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[New York Times] How Apple Sidesteps Billions in Taxes - Page 16

post #151 of 199
Quote:
SThen, in 2009, after an intense lobbying campaign led by Apple, Cisco, Oracle, Intel and other companies, the California Legislature reduced taxes for corporations based in California but operating in other states or nations. Legislative analysts say the change will eventually cost the state government about $1.5 billion a year.

Such lost revenue is one reason California now faces a budget crisis, with a shortfall of more than $9.2 billion in the coming fiscal year alone. The state has cut some health care programs, significantly raised tuition at state universities, cut services to the disabled and proposed a $4.8 billion reduction in spending on kindergarten and other grades.

Stuff like this makes me sick.
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post #152 of 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpankyMcFlych View Post

I actually find this little bit ^ fairly offensive.
Yes the dude who is digging your ditch or mowing your lawn or bagging your groceries or cutting your hair or washing your windows or whatever unskilled labor they're doing should be able to make enough money to live off of (I can't imagine living off just 25k). If these jobs were as unimportant and pathetic as you're implying here then you wouldn't need someone to do them in the first place. Yet we the people who have skilled jobs still need someone to fulfill these unskilled jobs for us in order to live our lives in comfort, and the people who do these jobs for us should have every right to be paid enough money for those jobs to afford food, housing, medical care, savings for their childrens education, and savings for their retirement. Almost 20% of americans don't have health insurance... it boggles the mind that a "first world" country has such a large portion of it's people without modern medicine. We should all be ashamed of this.
Their lack of education or experience does not matter in this because these jobs are necessary and must be filled. If everyone in the world had a PHD we would still have x number of unskilled jobs that need to be filled. McDonalds still needs people to take orders and cook the food. Lack of education or experience is a false argument because we can't all have "good" skilled jobs. Someone has to do the menial, and these menial jobs are just as vital to our society as any "skilled" job is.
You the mighty skilled worker wouldn't get very far in life if there weren't people at registers to ring up your bills, or stock the grocery store.
It is truly pathetic that you think they don't deserve to make a living wage.

What do you think the average age of the workers who are in these positions? What would you wager the turn-over rate is with respect to these positions? How many can be claimed as dependents?

You completely avoid that messy issue of demographics when you started waving your hands in the air about how offended you were. You can find it as offensive as you please. By all means. It is your right. However, do not try to draw some correlation between the Sonic carhop and the landscaper and barber/stylist in terms of societal benefit and skill set. Landscapers get paid around $25k. Barbers get paid even more at $43k. The two groups you mentioned provide services that I either won't or can't perform myself. I don't know the first thing about building a retaining wall or operating a pair of clippers adequately to not horrify others. However, I am quite capable of getting my own food and bagging my groceries. The fact that a business wanted to include a "value added service" through the usage of a high school kid doesn't mean they are legally or morally obligated to overcompensate them for a completely unskilled (usually unnecessary) job. They put a bit of cash in the kid's pocket, and the kid learns about the workforce. If you have a deep personal calling for delivering bags of food to people's cars just 15ft away, then follow your dreams. Just understand that it might not be the most lucrative or secure career move.

(I'm not touching the health care issue with a 10ft pole.)
Quote:
You the mighty skilled worker wouldn't get very far in life if there weren't people at registers to ring up your bills, or stock the grocery store.

Yes, I would. They would just hire someone else to do that same job in a week. How do I know? When I quit Home Depot they hired someone to take my place. Surprisingly, the sun rose the next day.
Edited by Solarin - 4/30/12 at 5:09pm
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post #153 of 199
Stopped reading at "lack of motivation." Americans and their denial kills me. Literally, kills me. Wrap it in howevermuch pseudointellectual mumbo jumbo you wish, doesn't change the fact that many other developed countries are taking the opposite route of the US in regards to labour and taxation (Australia,New Zealand, etc.) and it's working extremely well. That's all I have to say.
Edited by Malcolm - 4/30/12 at 6:29pm
post #154 of 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malcolm View Post

Stopped reading at "lack of motivation." Americans and their denial kills me. Literally, kills me. Wrap it in howevermuch pseudointellectual mumbo jumbo you wish, doesn't change the fact that many other developed countries are taking the opposite route of the US in regards to labour and taxation (Australia,New Zealand, etc.) and it's working extremely well. That's all I have to say.

Intellectual dishonesty with a side of self loathing. How delicious.

If you consider larger tax burdens in order to acquire government services, then sure. It works splendidly. I'm not impeaching their system, however. It is just vastly different. To each their own, and that is what the Aussies want.

I prefer to have as little government in my life as humanly possible; something that is becoming increasingly hard.
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post #155 of 199
Thread Starter 

No one ever said Apple was the only one doing this. thumb.gif

I would have posted the Google article had it not been from last year!

And in addition the other 2 aren't tech sector related. Feel free to post any recent articles yourself! smile.gif
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post #156 of 199
I just breezed through the first few pages of this thread... I live in Reno and I can say this is not just an Apple thing.

Microsoft has had its licensing division in Reno for many years.... Intuit is also here in Reno.

Matter of fact there are Nevada companies who the entire business model is bringing in companies to get these tax breaks.

Its a very broken system..
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post #157 of 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solarin View Post

Intellectual dishonesty with a side of self loathing. How delicious.

If you consider larger tax burdens in order to acquire government services, then sure. It works splendidly. I'm not impeaching their system, however. It is just vastly different. To each their own, and that is what the Aussies want.
I prefer to have as little government in my life as humanly possible; something that is becoming increasingly hard.

My willingness to criticise the conditions and policies of my country and opening my mind to alternatives and solutions is hardly "self-loathing." Glenn Beck much?

Egalitarian social policies are the future. Best start dealing with it now, because the rest of the developed world is already well on its way to achieving this goal and the US will eventually catch up. Sometime.
post #158 of 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by MediaRocker View Post

No one ever said Apple was the only one doing this. thumb.gif
I would have posted the Google article had it not been from last year!
And in addition the other 2 aren't tech sector related. Feel free to post any recent articles yourself! smile.gif

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/334737/20120429/apple-avoid-taxes-nytimes-profits.htm

Here is the PDF if you want to be more specific: http://www.ctj.org/pdf/notax2012.pdf
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post #159 of 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by armourcore9brker View Post

. How would you like it if you worked your butt off and got millions to only have it taken away because some lazy person couldn't get up and get a job to sustain themselves. This entitlement mentality is what is killing the economy and it'll only get worse until changes are made.

It's not about laziness in all cases. I make a 5-figure salary, and pay a higher tax percentage then the multi-millionaire Mitt Romney. How exactly is that fair? The problem is that the rich are actually paying lower tax percentages in many cases than the middle-class, because of all of the loopholes they can take advantage of. Because of greed the richest people in the country are often in a good position to keep themselves rich at the expense of others. I'm a fiscal conservative but I find myself agreeing with Obama's proposal that we close all tax loopholes, simplifying the process and making the rich as least pay the same tax percentage as people making less than them.
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post #160 of 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by lordikon View Post


It's not about laziness in all cases. I make a 5-figure salary, and pay a higher tax percentage then the multi-millionaire Mitt Romney. How exactly is that fair? The problem is that the rich are actually paying lower tax percentages in many cases than the middle-class, because of all of the loopholes they can take advantage of. Because of greed the richest people in the country are often in a good position to keep themselves rich at the expense of others. I'm a fiscal conservative but I find myself agreeing with Obama's proposal that we close all tax loopholes, simplifying the process and making the rich as least pay the same tax percentage as people making less than them.

I addressed that. smile.gif
Quote:
Lower taxes across the board and eliminate loopholes. That way companies are not stiff armed with massive taxes and there is no way to get out from under them.
     
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