Overclock.net › Forums › Intel › Intel CPUs › [Official] Ivy Bridge Owners Thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[Official] Ivy Bridge Owners Thread - Page 567

Poll Results: Which Ivy Bridge CPU did you buy?

This is a multiple choice poll
  • 50% of voters (692)
    i5 3570k
  • 43% of voters (586)
    i7 3770k
  • 6% of voters (91)
    Other
1362 Total Votes  
post #5661 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

The issue of Bios flash is just convenience, but I'm not flashing the bios that often, you usually just stick with what works anyways. I don't think it's worth anything to have a bios flashback feature, unless maybe cpu-less flash or ib flash on a p67/z68 if anything, but not for much.
I do think your right that z77 doesnt tend to be much more expensive, but sometimes you just find deals on used p67/z68 that is a good 20-50+ cheaper than z77, i think. It tends to be really high quality p67/Z68 going for prices a little less or equal to decent z77s.
You say performance but I'm a bit confused... your z68 maximus 4 extreme-z is better performer than....?
Also, in regards to latest technology... for me the answer is no. sata 3, usb 3, pci 3, i dont need any of these features. I'm going to be using a sata 2 ssd, pci 2.0 gtx 460, i dont use external drives or anything like that often. 40gb of hdd space usage in 2 years, and no plans to change that in the coming years. Not to mention such features aren't even noticeable anyways, or even significant even in synthetic benches. If anything, I'd upgrade to a 660ti in 4+ years, not 3x680s.
Lucid Virtu, as I understand it, is crap, and is just about saving energy, not performance. Dont care. If you could explain how lucid virtu has been helpful to you, maybe that'd be more informative, maybe I'm wrong on lucid, but from what I've seen it's crap and hard to make work and is on z68 anyways.
I'm a budget buyer, so I think your confusing some of the stuff I do. I just stream + game, and i ONLY stream + game starcraft 2. I will not be playing the best and newest games, and have no plans to. I will be playing only sc2 for about the next 5+ years.
In fact, my Phenom ii x4 is MORE than powerful enough for my needs, it does everything I want very very smoothly, ie hd x264 encoding and game capture. I'm just replacing my build, not upgrading. I got a bunch of spare pc components so i can basically sell my amd system for more than it'd cost me to upgrade (obviously, opportunity cost aside, i mean i could list some of these coolers and gpu's and hdd's for sale so im essentially 'paying' $500+ but you get what i mean).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

Well I'll be using just 1.5v CL9 ram, so that isn't a big issue, but I'll look more into this, thanks for the specifics.
The max of 39x, I believe that's a bios issue with gigabyte boards, and I believe it's been fixed. GA released a statement when IB first came out in regards to that, I'll ask the Gigabyte thread about it but I believe it was fixed.
It's not a risk, I think you are just saying you wouldnt risk it because you aren't informed on every motherboard (granted, its a pain in the ass to try to research all this but I have time, this isn't happening tommorow). I think with good research I can find a p67/z68 that isn't any more of a risk than a z68. Like anything, you just have to research what you are buying. From what I've read so far, there is no risk. I mean the motherboard either works or doesn't, if it doesn't work with i5 3570k i think it'd be pretty obvious, there's not some 'risk' there.
The z77 chipset is fundamentally just not any different than z68 anyways. In fact, even UEFI is being released on some of the p67/z68 boards that didnt have UEFI before.

Okay, so you want your build to last you 5 years right? So you plan on using SATA II and PCIe 2.0 for the next 5 years. It seems odd to me that you want to go 5 years on already outdated technology. Oh well, do what you think is best.

If you do plan on just playing SC2 for the next 5 years, and you don't really want or need to overclock, then why aren't you just buying a locked Sandy chip and H61/H67? Why do you even want the Ivy chip or a high end motherboard? Also, I see used 2500K's going for $150 left and right, not much of a difference especially if you're going best bang for buck. Get one of those.

The risk you take with buying a P67/Z68 motherboard and using an Ivy chip for it is that you buy the board and it isn't flashed for Ivy yet. So you either need to get a cheap Sandy chip or find a BIOS chip for it. More money and time spent.

Sounds to me like you could just get a i5-2400 and H67 and play your old game with your old GPU for the next decade and be perfectly happy. That's my suggestion.
post #5662 of 7362
Quote:
Z68 doesn't rally do USB 3.0 from what I understand.... I wanna add this however. You've had the answers all along for your question.... I will point them out.. Keep your existing hardware or Z68

It's just not 'native support' or something. I dont really care, i mean it has more than just usb 2.0, im sure there's no noticeable difference between non native and native usb 3.0 (or usb 2.0 and 3.0 for anything but large file transfers). I dont use external hdd or external storage anyways. I mean there's no usb 3.0 mouse or keyboard you know.

I havne't really had the answers I was looking for, I mean i read there were some issues with p67 and sli, but it might be just that certain mobo model that came up on google. i can't even find that issue if i try googling for it now.

I also didn't know you can't overclock/volt ram on p67 and z68, that'll definitely influence my decision too (so $10-20 premium for z77 is probably worthwhile, even if it isnt in performance, i like to overclock).
Quote:
Okay, so you want your build to last you 5 years right? So you plan on using SATA II and PCIe 2.0 for the next 5 years. It seems odd to me that you want to go 5 years on already outdated technology. Oh well, do what you think is best.

No not really lol. Here's my opinion on this:

1. Future proofing is stupid. I, and everyone else here among us, are probably going to be upgrading every 2 years, not 5+. And anything is going to be outdated in 5+ years, FX/Phenom or i5, for that matter.

2. trying to future proof things you have no clue on is stupid. Yea, maybe sata 3 and usb 3 might be 'the future', but we dont know that for sure. It could go the way for firewire or something. Or, it may take 5+ years before usb/sata 3 to be a noticeable increase in performance.

3. USB3 is pretty much just for external drives. it doesnt like affect your keyboard or mouse. I'm not moving large files or using external drives, as i said, ive used 40gb of hdd in 2 years.

4. You wont notice sata 3. no current technology really utilizes sata 3, it'll be a few years before you really can notice (ssd performance is all about 4k write/read anyways, which are below the sata 2 max bandwidth speed anyways).

5. I'm not even using usb3/sata3 items. I just 'upgraded' to a sata 2 x25-m 80gb ssd. I wont be using sata3 or usb3 gear anyways, not for a long time.

6. P67/Z68 has sata3/usb3 anyways! so they might not be onchip native controller, that's not even going to be noticeable, and not noticeable even in benchmarks anyways.

i care about the cpu performance, the gear performance. usb3 and sata 3 and pci 3.0 is 'ahead of its time', it's being rolled out before the relevant hardware is out. by the time these things become important, I will be upgrading my build. Worst case scenario, in 2+ years, I'll buy a z77 motherboard for super cheap lol. not a big deal.

i dont have any usb3/sata3/pci3 items. I will be using basically the same stuff in my system sig (except sata2 x25-m 80gb, ill be using gtx 460 768mb, and then, you know, ~400w psu, nzxt gamma, nzxt sentry 2 fan controller).

Future proofing is stupid. in 5 years i5 will be just as outdated as i3, maybe you get a few months, maybe a year out of it. On top of that, i3 and i5 and phenom ii, are all very very strong, and going to last a long time anyways.

on top of all this, i will only be streaming x264 codex to justintv using OBS, starcraft2 (the expansion hots is coming out soon but isn't goign to require much more at all and only 8gb more of hdd space, and the next expansion will be 3+ years in the future...). I wont be playing bf3, i wont be playing any of the newest games, or anything. as i said, my current build is MORE than strong enough to last enough 5+ years for me as it is, an i5 build with p67/z68 (or z77, too) will be way more than enough.

if i was smart id really just sidegrade/replace to another phenom ii build, but i think for $130, basically, the i5+p67/z68/z77 is... well, will be fun.
Quote:
If you do plan on just playing SC2 for the next 5 years, and you don't really want or need to overclock, then why aren't you just buying a locked Sandy chip and H61/H67?

Streaming is very cpu intensive. I'm replacing my current computer (someone offering to buy it for a very good price, and i have lots of spare computer components, so i can basically replace my current build with an i5 build for free. obviously its not free, I could make $100+ selling these components, but you get my point).

I also enjoy overclocking a lot. I would not buy a locked cpu. if i wanted to 'save' money id go phenom ii, which frankly might be smarter, but no one regrets buying i5 so im biting the bullet and going i5.

the 3570k, at microcenter, which is 1.5 hours away, is $169. The way I look at it, $10 per 100mhz is good.

Per clock, IB is about 300mhz above SB. If you delid the IB (which im comfortable doing), it'll also overclock further. So 200mhz higher overclock, silicon lottery equivalent, plus 300mhz, 500mhz for $40 price premium. Not even, actually, since i5 2500k for cheapest i can find, is more expensive than $169. But I'd be willing to buy the SB if it was $50 or more cheaper, the problem is i just cant find it that cheap. Usually the IB chip is about $40 more expensive per vendor than SB, but at microcenter, the IB is cheaper than anywhere else, and they dont have the SB.
Quote:
The risk you take with buying a P67/Z68 motherboard and using an Ivy chip for it is that you buy the board and it isn't flashed for Ivy yet. So you either need to get a cheap Sandy chip or find a BIOS chip for it. More money and time spent.

This isn't a risk to me. I'm 'savvy' enough that I can buy a bios replacement chip for just free-$10, or used where the bios is already updated (whatever board i buy, and from whomever i buy it from, ill make sure to ask that the bios is updated). I can also go to a local store, like microcenter, to get the board flashed. Or, I can ask someone. Or, I can 'rent' a $30 celeron and/or throw it in the trash can sell it on ebay for $15.

I dont consider the bios issue a 'risk'. It's an inconvenience that's well worth it for $40+ (if the savings are that much).

I might end up going with the ud3h z77 for $94. But if I see a p67/z68 for $70 of higher quality, i'm gonna go for it. i think. I dont mind spending the time, I build computers for a hobby and for fun, not professionally (although i do stream for money, i woudlnt say it's in a professional capacity). Delidding a CPU, replacing a bios chip, I find these tasks enjoyable, not frustrating.
Build In Progress
(17 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Haswell i7-4770K 4.8GHz@1.452v/1.97vRIN Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H Older Gigabyte 7950 (H60 Mod) 2x4GB Gskill 2400CL11 Hynix CFRs 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 830 128gb Corsair H110 w/4x 140mm Yate Loon High Blues W7 x64 Ultimate Yarrgh Matey Dell U2312HM Matte IPS 1080p 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
Sanyo DP19640 18.5" 768p KDS Rad-7xp 1024p CM Storm Quickfire Rapids Brown Rosewill Capstone 750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Bitfenix Shinobi Modded CM Storm Spawn Steelseries Diablo 3 2 set CD Speaker + Big Sub 
Other
Bitfenix Recon Fan Controller Moded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Delidded i7-3770K 5GHz@1.499 Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H 1.1 Sapphire Dual-X 7950 3L Boost 4x2GB Mushkin Ridgeback 2200mhz 8/11/8/27 1.75v... 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 Noctua 120/140/140 Fans 3 x Yate Loon Mediums (Petras) 2 x NZXT Havik 140mm Fans 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64-bit Sanyo DP19640 19'' KDS Radius Rad-7xp 17'' Ducky 1087 MX Brown 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Rosewill Capstone 550w Modular NZXT Source 210 w/Modded Window Razer Deathadder 3.5G Steelseries Blizzcon D3 
AudioAudioOtherOther
Phillips FW-C250 2 Speaker Set w/3 CD Changer JBL Sub 6 Subwoofer NZXT Sleeved LED Strip 1m Blue NZXT Sentry 2 Fan Controller 
Other
Colonial Blue Paracord Sleeving 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom ii X4 955C2, $31, 5 broken pins, works! ... Biostar A770e3 6.3 Red&Black MSI GTX 460 768mb Twin Frozr II 2 x 2GB Kingston HyperX 1333 OC to 1348CL7@1.65v 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M G2 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 6 x Case Fans (4 x YL-M, NZXT case fan, CM Hype... Jerryrigged Chipset-Northbridge 80mm HSF 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Jerryrigged VRM Heatsink (sawed off stock AM2 h... Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64bit Sanyo DP19640 19"1360x768 Ducky Cherry Browns 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Earthwatts 430D NZXT Gamma Steelseries Kinzu Optical Steelseries Blizzcon Diablo 3 
  hide details  
Reply
Build In Progress
(17 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Haswell i7-4770K 4.8GHz@1.452v/1.97vRIN Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H Older Gigabyte 7950 (H60 Mod) 2x4GB Gskill 2400CL11 Hynix CFRs 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 830 128gb Corsair H110 w/4x 140mm Yate Loon High Blues W7 x64 Ultimate Yarrgh Matey Dell U2312HM Matte IPS 1080p 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
Sanyo DP19640 18.5" 768p KDS Rad-7xp 1024p CM Storm Quickfire Rapids Brown Rosewill Capstone 750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Bitfenix Shinobi Modded CM Storm Spawn Steelseries Diablo 3 2 set CD Speaker + Big Sub 
Other
Bitfenix Recon Fan Controller Moded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Delidded i7-3770K 5GHz@1.499 Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H 1.1 Sapphire Dual-X 7950 3L Boost 4x2GB Mushkin Ridgeback 2200mhz 8/11/8/27 1.75v... 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 Noctua 120/140/140 Fans 3 x Yate Loon Mediums (Petras) 2 x NZXT Havik 140mm Fans 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64-bit Sanyo DP19640 19'' KDS Radius Rad-7xp 17'' Ducky 1087 MX Brown 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Rosewill Capstone 550w Modular NZXT Source 210 w/Modded Window Razer Deathadder 3.5G Steelseries Blizzcon D3 
AudioAudioOtherOther
Phillips FW-C250 2 Speaker Set w/3 CD Changer JBL Sub 6 Subwoofer NZXT Sleeved LED Strip 1m Blue NZXT Sentry 2 Fan Controller 
Other
Colonial Blue Paracord Sleeving 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom ii X4 955C2, $31, 5 broken pins, works! ... Biostar A770e3 6.3 Red&Black MSI GTX 460 768mb Twin Frozr II 2 x 2GB Kingston HyperX 1333 OC to 1348CL7@1.65v 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M G2 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 6 x Case Fans (4 x YL-M, NZXT case fan, CM Hype... Jerryrigged Chipset-Northbridge 80mm HSF 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Jerryrigged VRM Heatsink (sawed off stock AM2 h... Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64bit Sanyo DP19640 19"1360x768 Ducky Cherry Browns 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Earthwatts 430D NZXT Gamma Steelseries Kinzu Optical Steelseries Blizzcon Diablo 3 
  hide details  
Reply
post #5663 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Well I'll be using just 1.5v CL9 ram, so that isn't a big issue, but I'll look more into this, thanks for the specifics.
The max of 39x, I believe that's a bios issue with gigabyte boards, and I believe it's been fixed. GA released a statement when IB first came out in regards to that, I'll ask the Gigabyte thread about it but I believe it was fixed.
It's not a risk, I think you are just saying you wouldnt risk it because you aren't informed on every motherboard (granted, its a pain in the ass to try to research all this but I have time, this isn't happening tommorow). I think with good research I can find a p67/z68 that isn't any more of a risk than a z68. Like anything, you just have to research what you are buying. From what I've read so far, there is no risk. I mean the motherboard either works or doesn't, if it doesn't work with i5 3570k i think it'd be pretty obvious, there's not some 'risk' there.
The z77 chipset is fundamentally just not any different than z68 anyways. In fact, even UEFI is being released on some of the p67/z68 boards that didnt have UEFI before.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
It's just not 'native support' or something. I dont really care, i mean it has more than just usb 2.0, im sure there's no noticeable difference between non native and native usb 3.0 (or usb 2.0 and 3.0 for anything but large file transfers). I dont use external hdd or external storage anyways. I mean there's no usb 3.0 mouse or keyboard you know.
I havne't really had the answers I was looking for, I mean i read there were some issues with p67 and sli, but it might be just that certain mobo model that came up on google. i can't even find that issue if i try googling for it now.
I also didn't know you can't overclock/volt ram on p67 and z68, that'll definitely influence my decision too (so $10-20 premium for z77 is probably worthwhile, even if it isnt in performance, i like to overclock).
No not really lol. Here's my opinion on this:
1. Future proofing is stupid. I, and everyone else here among us, are probably going to be upgrading every 2 years, not 5+. And anything is going to be outdated in 5+ years, FX/Phenom or i5, for that matter.
2. trying to future proof things you have no clue on is stupid. Yea, maybe sata 3 and usb 3 might be 'the future', but we dont know that for sure. It could go the way for firewire or something. Or, it may take 5+ years before usb/sata 3 to be a noticeable increase in performance.
3. USB3 is pretty much just for external drives. it doesnt like affect your keyboard or mouse. I'm not moving large files or using external drives, as i said, ive used 40gb of hdd in 2 years.
4. You wont notice sata 3. no current technology really utilizes sata 3, it'll be a few years before you really can notice (ssd performance is all about 4k write/read anyways, which are below the sata 2 max bandwidth speed anyways).
5. I'm not even using usb3/sata3 items. I just 'upgraded' to a sata 2 x25-m 80gb ssd. I wont be using sata3 or usb3 gear anyways, not for a long time.
6. P67/Z68 has sata3/usb3 anyways! so they might not be onchip native controller, that's not even going to be noticeable, and not noticeable even in benchmarks anyways.
i care about the cpu performance, the gear performance. usb3 and sata 3 and pci 3.0 is 'ahead of its time', it's being rolled out before the relevant hardware is out. by the time these things become important, I will be upgrading my build. Worst case scenario, in 2+ years, I'll buy a z77 motherboard for super cheap lol. not a big deal.
i dont have any usb3/sata3/pci3 items. I will be using basically the same stuff in my system sig (except sata2 x25-m 80gb, ill be using gtx 460 768mb, and then, you know, ~400w psu, nzxt gamma, nzxt sentry 2 fan controller).
Future proofing is stupid. in 5 years i5 will be just as outdated as i3, maybe you get a few months, maybe a year out of it. On top of that, i3 and i5 and phenom ii, are all very very strong, and going to last a long time anyways.
on top of all this, i will only be streaming x264 codex to justintv using OBS, starcraft2 (the expansion hots is coming out soon but isn't goign to require much more at all and only 8gb more of hdd space, and the next expansion will be 3+ years in the future...). I wont be playing bf3, i wont be playing any of the newest games, or anything. as i said, my current build is MORE than strong enough to last enough 5+ years for me as it is, an i5 build with p67/z68 (or z77, too) will be way more than enough.
if i was smart id really just sidegrade/replace to another phenom ii build, but i think for $130, basically, the i5+p67/z68/z77 is... well, will be fun.
Streaming is very cpu intensive. I'm replacing my current computer (someone offering to buy it for a very good price, and i have lots of spare computer components, so i can basically replace my current build with an i5 build for free. obviously its not free, I could make $100+ selling these components, but you get my point).
I also enjoy overclocking a lot. I would not buy a locked cpu. if i wanted to 'save' money id go phenom ii, which frankly might be smarter, but no one regrets buying i5 so im biting the bullet and going i5.
the 3570k, at microcenter, which is 1.5 hours away, is $169. The way I look at it, $10 per 100mhz is good.
Per clock, IB is about 300mhz above SB. If you delid the IB (which im comfortable doing), it'll also overclock further. So 200mhz higher overclock, silicon lottery equivalent, plus 300mhz, 500mhz for $40 price premium. Not even, actually, since i5 2500k for cheapest i can find, is more expensive than $169. But I'd be willing to buy the SB if it was $50 or more cheaper, the problem is i just cant find it that cheap. Usually the IB chip is about $40 more expensive per vendor than SB, but at microcenter, the IB is cheaper than anywhere else, and they dont have the SB.
This isn't a risk to me. I'm 'savvy' enough that I can buy a bios replacement chip for just free-$10, or used where the bios is already updated (whatever board i buy, and from whomever i buy it from, ill make sure to ask that the bios is updated). I can also go to a local store, like microcenter, to get the board flashed. Or, I can ask someone. Or, I can 'rent' a $30 celeron and/or throw it in the trash can sell it on ebay for $15.
I dont consider the bios issue a 'risk'. It's an inconvenience that's well worth it for $40+ (if the savings are that much).
I might end up going with the ud3h z77 for $94. But if I see a p67/z68 for $70 of higher quality, i'm gonna go for it. i think. I dont mind spending the time, I build computers for a hobby and for fun, not professionally (although i do stream for money, i woudlnt say it's in a professional capacity). Delidding a CPU, replacing a bios chip, I find these tasks enjoyable, not frustrating.

I agree on the value and overclocking part...I think your best bet would be a really cheap P67 Maximus IV board, 0 issues but you'd still need the celeron SB to flash. (I got one, g620 actually and it makes for a useful backup chip...dead 3770k I still game alright)

See what deals come out, but if you don't bump into anything and feel the itch to upgrade (cause it REALLY is an upgrade from a Phenom II, specially for a cpu bound game like Starcraft 2 *hint double the fps*) get a z77x-d3h board for a decent board with high end components that is cheap.

EDIT: Also if you wanna stream your games you'd be better off with a 2600k or a discounted 3770k for the HT.
I'll give you an advice now:

-Get a 2600k used...cheap.
-Get PSC or BBSE ram which goes for 40 bucks or so. 2000cl9 2x2gb kits are your best bet. (older ram but overclocks better than ANY of the newer chips, except for higher clocks above 2700mhz, which would require cold lol) Still timings of cl7-9-7-24-1t are easily obtainable, at clocks around 2000mhz-2200mhz for SB, and 2400mhz-2600mhz for IB.
-Get a Maximus P67 or Z68 MIVGene-z or a p67 ud7 board.
Edited by ivanlabrie - 1/1/13 at 10:47am
post #5664 of 7362
my phenom ii x4 actually streams more than powerful enough.

In fact I started streaming hd @45 fps on my athlon ii x4 cpu (so im sure the phenom can handle 60fps, my athlon just barely stuttered on 60 fps, and it was the stream, not ingame). I streamed for a year on an athlon ii x4 3.4ghz system and it was perfectly capable. I have been doing a lot of pc tinkering recently but the phenom ii x4 streams hd @60fps perfectly.

i have no problems in performance, really.

for ram i'd go for the cheapest cl9 1.5v ram lol. ram doesnt make a difference. Right now though on newegg, the cheapest ram for 4gb, is like 1866CL9 vs 1600CL8. Isn't that basically the exact same thing? faster speed but loosened the timing... if it was 1866cl8 vs 1600cl8 that'd obviously be better, and even 2000mhzcl9 vs 1600cl8 the 2000mhz is better, but 1866cl9 vs 1600cl8... ***.

thanks, ill look into maximus. i think the z77 ud3h for $94 might be cheaper than a used maximus z68 though, ill look into p67 and different variations of the maximus though.

I dont think I'd find a 2600k cheaper than microcenter's 3570k@$169. If it was under $200, I'd go for an i7 maybe... but really, my athlon ii x4 was more than powerful enough. The only reason I have a phenom ii x4 right now, is because I bought a broken one for $31, then sold my athlon ii x4 for $70 used and made a huge profit and huge upgrade. I'm going i5 3570k by basically doing the same thing.

The 'smart' thing for me to do would really be just replace my system with a Phenom ii x4 c3, and pocket the $130. But what the hell. I dont need the i5 performance but i dont think anyone regrets going i5 so im biting the bullet. Im not upgrading, im selling my current pc for profit and replacing.
Edited by Belial - 1/1/13 at 11:53am
Build In Progress
(17 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Haswell i7-4770K 4.8GHz@1.452v/1.97vRIN Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H Older Gigabyte 7950 (H60 Mod) 2x4GB Gskill 2400CL11 Hynix CFRs 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 830 128gb Corsair H110 w/4x 140mm Yate Loon High Blues W7 x64 Ultimate Yarrgh Matey Dell U2312HM Matte IPS 1080p 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
Sanyo DP19640 18.5" 768p KDS Rad-7xp 1024p CM Storm Quickfire Rapids Brown Rosewill Capstone 750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Bitfenix Shinobi Modded CM Storm Spawn Steelseries Diablo 3 2 set CD Speaker + Big Sub 
Other
Bitfenix Recon Fan Controller Moded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Delidded i7-3770K 5GHz@1.499 Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H 1.1 Sapphire Dual-X 7950 3L Boost 4x2GB Mushkin Ridgeback 2200mhz 8/11/8/27 1.75v... 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 Noctua 120/140/140 Fans 3 x Yate Loon Mediums (Petras) 2 x NZXT Havik 140mm Fans 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64-bit Sanyo DP19640 19'' KDS Radius Rad-7xp 17'' Ducky 1087 MX Brown 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Rosewill Capstone 550w Modular NZXT Source 210 w/Modded Window Razer Deathadder 3.5G Steelseries Blizzcon D3 
AudioAudioOtherOther
Phillips FW-C250 2 Speaker Set w/3 CD Changer JBL Sub 6 Subwoofer NZXT Sleeved LED Strip 1m Blue NZXT Sentry 2 Fan Controller 
Other
Colonial Blue Paracord Sleeving 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom ii X4 955C2, $31, 5 broken pins, works! ... Biostar A770e3 6.3 Red&Black MSI GTX 460 768mb Twin Frozr II 2 x 2GB Kingston HyperX 1333 OC to 1348CL7@1.65v 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M G2 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 6 x Case Fans (4 x YL-M, NZXT case fan, CM Hype... Jerryrigged Chipset-Northbridge 80mm HSF 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Jerryrigged VRM Heatsink (sawed off stock AM2 h... Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64bit Sanyo DP19640 19"1360x768 Ducky Cherry Browns 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Earthwatts 430D NZXT Gamma Steelseries Kinzu Optical Steelseries Blizzcon Diablo 3 
  hide details  
Reply
Build In Progress
(17 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Haswell i7-4770K 4.8GHz@1.452v/1.97vRIN Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H Older Gigabyte 7950 (H60 Mod) 2x4GB Gskill 2400CL11 Hynix CFRs 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 830 128gb Corsair H110 w/4x 140mm Yate Loon High Blues W7 x64 Ultimate Yarrgh Matey Dell U2312HM Matte IPS 1080p 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
Sanyo DP19640 18.5" 768p KDS Rad-7xp 1024p CM Storm Quickfire Rapids Brown Rosewill Capstone 750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Bitfenix Shinobi Modded CM Storm Spawn Steelseries Diablo 3 2 set CD Speaker + Big Sub 
Other
Bitfenix Recon Fan Controller Moded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Delidded i7-3770K 5GHz@1.499 Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H 1.1 Sapphire Dual-X 7950 3L Boost 4x2GB Mushkin Ridgeback 2200mhz 8/11/8/27 1.75v... 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 Noctua 120/140/140 Fans 3 x Yate Loon Mediums (Petras) 2 x NZXT Havik 140mm Fans 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64-bit Sanyo DP19640 19'' KDS Radius Rad-7xp 17'' Ducky 1087 MX Brown 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Rosewill Capstone 550w Modular NZXT Source 210 w/Modded Window Razer Deathadder 3.5G Steelseries Blizzcon D3 
AudioAudioOtherOther
Phillips FW-C250 2 Speaker Set w/3 CD Changer JBL Sub 6 Subwoofer NZXT Sleeved LED Strip 1m Blue NZXT Sentry 2 Fan Controller 
Other
Colonial Blue Paracord Sleeving 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom ii X4 955C2, $31, 5 broken pins, works! ... Biostar A770e3 6.3 Red&Black MSI GTX 460 768mb Twin Frozr II 2 x 2GB Kingston HyperX 1333 OC to 1348CL7@1.65v 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M G2 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 6 x Case Fans (4 x YL-M, NZXT case fan, CM Hype... Jerryrigged Chipset-Northbridge 80mm HSF 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Jerryrigged VRM Heatsink (sawed off stock AM2 h... Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64bit Sanyo DP19640 19"1360x768 Ducky Cherry Browns 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Earthwatts 430D NZXT Gamma Steelseries Kinzu Optical Steelseries Blizzcon Diablo 3 
  hide details  
Reply
post #5665 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

my phenom ii x4 actually streams more than powerful enough.
In fact I started streaming hd @45 fps on my athlon ii x4 cpu (so im sure the phenom can handle 60fps, my athlon just barely stuttered on 60 fps, and it was the stream, not ingame). I streamed for a year on an athlon ii x4 3.4ghz system and it was perfectly capable. I have been doing a lot of pc tinkering recently but the phenom ii x4 streams hd @60fps perfectly.
i have no problems in performance, really.
for ram i'd go for the cheapest cl9 1.5v ram lol. ram doesnt make a difference. Right now though on newegg, the cheapest ram for 4gb, is like 1866CL9 vs 1600CL8. Isn't that basically the exact same thing? faster speed but loosened the timing... if it was 1866cl8 vs 1600cl8 that'd obviously be better, and even 2000mhzcl9 vs 1600cl8 the 2000mhz is better, but 1866cl9 vs 1600cl8... ***.
thanks, ill look into maximus. i think the z77 ud3h for $94 might be cheaper than a used maximus z68 though, ill look into p67 and different variations of the maximus though.
I dont think I'd find a 2600k cheaper than microcenter's 3570k@$169. If it was under $200, I'd go for an i7 maybe... but really, my athlon ii x4 was more than powerful enough. The only reason I have a phenom ii x4 right now, is because I bought a broken one for $31, then sold my athlon ii x4 for $70 used and made a huge profit and huge upgrade. I'm going i5 3570k by basically doing the same thing.
The 'smart' thing for me to do would really be just replace my system with a Phenom ii x4 c3, and pocket the $130. But what the hell. I dont need the i5 performance but i dont think anyone regrets going i5 so im biting the bullet. Im not upgrading, im selling my current pc for profit and replacing.

Cool, I know ram doesn't make or break a system, but if you are into spending less for more older ram is heaps better than current stuff.
Most 2000c9 2x2gb kits will be great and sometimes go for as low as 20 bucks a kit lol

Good luck with the Maximus, that would really be your best bet in any possible scenario. That or the p67 ud7 which is superb too...Try to get a g440 single core celeron, they are dirt cheap, and might come in handy.
post #5666 of 7362
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

It's just not 'native support' or something. I dont really care, i mean it has more than just usb 2.0, im sure there's no noticeable difference between non native and native usb 3.0 (or usb 2.0 and 3.0 for anything but large file transfers). I dont use external hdd or external storage anyways. I mean there's no usb 3.0 mouse or keyboard you know.
I havne't really had the answers I was looking for, I mean i read there were some issues with p67 and sli, but it might be just that certain mobo model that came up on google. i can't even find that issue if i try googling for it now.
I also didn't know you can't overclock/volt ram on p67 and z68, that'll definitely influence my decision too (so $10-20 premium for z77 is probably worthwhile, even if it isnt in performance, i like to overclock).
No not really lol. Here's my opinion on this:
1. Future proofing is stupid. I, and everyone else here among us, are probably going to be upgrading every 2 years, not 5+. And anything is going to be outdated in 5+ years, FX/Phenom or i5, for that matter.
2. trying to future proof things you have no clue on is stupid. Yea, maybe sata 3 and usb 3 might be 'the future', but we dont know that for sure. It could go the way for firewire or something. Or, it may take 5+ years before usb/sata 3 to be a noticeable increase in performance.
3. USB3 is pretty much just for external drives. it doesnt like affect your keyboard or mouse. I'm not moving large files or using external drives, as i said, ive used 40gb of hdd in 2 years.
4. You wont notice sata 3. no current technology really utilizes sata 3, it'll be a few years before you really can notice (ssd performance is all about 4k write/read anyways, which are below the sata 2 max bandwidth speed anyways).
5. I'm not even using usb3/sata3 items. I just 'upgraded' to a sata 2 x25-m 80gb ssd. I wont be using sata3 or usb3 gear anyways, not for a long time.
6. P67/Z68 has sata3/usb3 anyways! so they might not be onchip native controller, that's not even going to be noticeable, and not noticeable even in benchmarks anyways.
i care about the cpu performance, the gear performance. usb3 and sata 3 and pci 3.0 is 'ahead of its time', it's being rolled out before the relevant hardware is out. by the time these things become important, I will be upgrading my build. Worst case scenario, in 2+ years, I'll buy a z77 motherboard for super cheap lol. not a big deal.
i dont have any usb3/sata3/pci3 items. I will be using basically the same stuff in my system sig (except sata2 x25-m 80gb, ill be using gtx 460 768mb, and then, you know, ~400w psu, nzxt gamma, nzxt sentry 2 fan controller).
Future proofing is stupid. in 5 years i5 will be just as outdated as i3, maybe you get a few months, maybe a year out of it. On top of that, i3 and i5 and phenom ii, are all very very strong, and going to last a long time anyways.
on top of all this, i will only be streaming x264 codex to justintv using OBS, starcraft2 (the expansion hots is coming out soon but isn't goign to require much more at all and only 8gb more of hdd space, and the next expansion will be 3+ years in the future...). I wont be playing bf3, i wont be playing any of the newest games, or anything. as i said, my current build is MORE than strong enough to last enough 5+ years for me as it is, an i5 build with p67/z68 (or z77, too) will be way more than enough.
if i was smart id really just sidegrade/replace to another phenom ii build, but i think for $130, basically, the i5+p67/z68/z77 is... well, will be fun.
Streaming is very cpu intensive. I'm replacing my current computer (someone offering to buy it for a very good price, and i have lots of spare computer components, so i can basically replace my current build with an i5 build for free. obviously its not free, I could make $100+ selling these components, but you get my point).
I also enjoy overclocking a lot. I would not buy a locked cpu. if i wanted to 'save' money id go phenom ii, which frankly might be smarter, but no one regrets buying i5 so im biting the bullet and going i5.
the 3570k, at microcenter, which is 1.5 hours away, is $169. The way I look at it, $10 per 100mhz is good.
Per clock, IB is about 300mhz above SB. If you delid the IB (which im comfortable doing), it'll also overclock further. So 200mhz higher overclock, silicon lottery equivalent, plus 300mhz, 500mhz for $40 price premium. Not even, actually, since i5 2500k for cheapest i can find, is more expensive than $169. But I'd be willing to buy the SB if it was $50 or more cheaper, the problem is i just cant find it that cheap. Usually the IB chip is about $40 more expensive per vendor than SB, but at microcenter, the IB is cheaper than anywhere else, and they dont have the SB.
This isn't a risk to me. I'm 'savvy' enough that I can buy a bios replacement chip for just free-$10, or used where the bios is already updated (whatever board i buy, and from whomever i buy it from, ill make sure to ask that the bios is updated). I can also go to a local store, like microcenter, to get the board flashed. Or, I can ask someone. Or, I can 'rent' a $30 celeron and/or throw it in the trash can sell it on ebay for $15.
I dont consider the bios issue a 'risk'. It's an inconvenience that's well worth it for $40+ (if the savings are that much).
I might end up going with the ud3h z77 for $94. But if I see a p67/z68 for $70 of higher quality, i'm gonna go for it. i think. I dont mind spending the time, I build computers for a hobby and for fun, not professionally (although i do stream for money, i woudlnt say it's in a professional capacity). Delidding a CPU, replacing a bios chip, I find these tasks enjoyable, not frustrating.

I'm not sure how you can say here that USB3.0 and SATA3 might not be the future. They are absolutely here to stay and there is no way they are going the way of firewire. That's just ignorant. The reason firewire went under is because it was under used, as opposed to USB and SATA which both already have millions of devices which use them. And in fact the advantages of both are already being used by current hardware. My SSD achieves transfer rates which do exceed those possible on SATA 2 and I use USB 3.0 hard drives all the time. The only threat to USB 3.0 is thunderbolt, but because USB is already so wide spread it's really not likely to gain popularity to the point that USB would be phased out. Meanwhile, SATA is currently the only option for internal storage attachment and there are no plans to replace it, so it will be here for years to come.

Additionally, while the 3rd party USB3.0 controllers on z68 do work fine, the third party SATA3 controllers are nothing short of garbage. They almost invariably perform worse than the onboard SATA2 controllers, just because they are attached onto a PCI-e controller from the chipset which can't keep up with the data transfer. If you're not using the native controllers you will lose performance, so if you want SATA3 performance from a board then z77 is a better option than z68.

EDIT: I also think that neither of these techs are "The future". They are the present, we have got plenty of external drives that were easily saturated by USB 2.0 and with SSDs SATA2 hit the limit. These techs are not something that we are using for futureproofing, they are here now and they are being used to improve over their older counterparts now.
Edited by DirektEffekt - 1/1/13 at 3:09pm
My System
(21 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 4790K 4.8GHz @ 1.306v (Actual) ASUS Maximus VII Gene Gigabyte GTX 780 Galaxy GTX 780 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveCooling
16GB G.Skill Ares (4x4GB @ 1866MHz OC'd to 2133) Samsung 840 Evo 500GB WD Black 2.5" 750GB EK Supremacy EVO Acetal 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Aquacool NeXXos UT60 240mm Radiator EK XE 360 Radiator x 2 EK-FC780 GTX Ti Acetal /w Backplate and Reinfor... 8 x EK Vardar F4 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
EK MOSFET ASUS M7G Acetal Nickel Windows 8 x64 Pro Dell U2711 (2560*1440) Dell P2715q 
KeyboardPowerCase
Ducky Shine 3 Year of the Snake Edition Corsair AX1200 Thermaltake Cube X2 
  hide details  
Reply
My System
(21 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 4790K 4.8GHz @ 1.306v (Actual) ASUS Maximus VII Gene Gigabyte GTX 780 Galaxy GTX 780 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveCooling
16GB G.Skill Ares (4x4GB @ 1866MHz OC'd to 2133) Samsung 840 Evo 500GB WD Black 2.5" 750GB EK Supremacy EVO Acetal 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Aquacool NeXXos UT60 240mm Radiator EK XE 360 Radiator x 2 EK-FC780 GTX Ti Acetal /w Backplate and Reinfor... 8 x EK Vardar F4 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
EK MOSFET ASUS M7G Acetal Nickel Windows 8 x64 Pro Dell U2711 (2560*1440) Dell P2715q 
KeyboardPowerCase
Ducky Shine 3 Year of the Snake Edition Corsair AX1200 Thermaltake Cube X2 
  hide details  
Reply
post #5667 of 7362
Quote:
if you are into spending less for more older ram is heaps better than current stuff.
Most 2000c9 2x2gb kits will be great and sometimes go for as low as 20 bucks a kit lol

I'm sorry what? I really have no clue what you are talking about, can you go a little more indepth?

As I always understood it - and I might be a bit outdated on this, I'm more familiar with AMD than Intel - you should just get the cheapest 1.5v RAM with CL9 or better. On newegg right now the cheapest ram is both a 1866 CL9 ram and 1600 CL8 RAM. Which, like, aren't they exactly the same thing?

Like isn't 1333mhz CL9 1.5v RAM the exact same as 1600mhz CL9 1.65v RAM... right? I mean an i5 3570k at 5ghz@1.4v is not a different processor, it's an i5 3570k the same as any other (granted, silicon lottery makes a difference but it's architecturally the same).

Anyways, from there just pick the 'best', ie go by reviews or something but usually that info isn't really out there, it's just by name brand or something. And also, I understood that for intel 1600mhz is really the sweet spot (and unlike AMD, intel wants more mhz over tighter timings, ie a step up in speed is better than tighter usually, but you have diminishing returns after around 1600mhz+).
Quote:
I'm not sure how you can say here that USB3.0 and SATA3 might not be the future. They are absolutely here to stay and there is no way they are going the way of firewire. That's just ignorant. The reason firewire went under is because it was under used, as opposed to USB and SATA which both already have millions of devices which use them. And in fact the advantages of both are already being used by current hardware. My SSD achieves transfer rates which do exceed those possible on SATA 2 and I use USB 3.0 hard drives all the time. The only threat to USB 3.0 is thunderbolt, but because USB is already so wide spread it's really not likely to gain popularity to the point that USB would be phased out. Meanwhile, SATA is currently the only option for internal storage attachment and there are no plans to replace it, so it will be here for years to come.

Yes, if you want to get specific, I'm aware of how much better USB 3.0 and Sata3 are over legacy, and how they will definitely be the future.

My point was that USB3.0/SATA3 is:
1. I do not use anything that uses these ports, and I know for 100% certainty I won't be using that uses such ports in the next 3+ years
2. They are 100%, these days, only useful for storage, which I don't care for, I don't move lots of files around or anything, like I said, I have used only 40gb of HDD in 2 years.
3. At the moment, they are not even noticeable increase in performance, for example 4k write/read is the most important in ssd and 4k write/read does not even approach sata2 bandwidth limits.
4. p67/z68 motherboards already have usb 3.0/sata3 so the whole argument of buying z77 because somehow p67/z68 doesnt have it, is absurd and isn't true.

I can promise you, I do not use sata3 or usb3.0. Do you even use usb/sata 3.0? If you do, do you even notice a difference? No, of course not. Cd drives are as outdated as floppies, so it's not like I need a sata 3 bluray drive or whatever (who uses bluray even lol). Mice and keyboards dont use them either. Sata/usb 3.0 is only for transferring large files, basically, and I dont use external storage. My 80gb sata 2 ssd is twice as much space and capacity that I need.

Your only reaching sequential speeds above sata, and you would only notice a couple seconds on huge transfers since it's all 4k write/read on ssds anyways. You go over the sata2 bandwidth speed less than 1% of the time, like almost never (ie sequential or whateve rit is that is never used but is always advertised).

You might use external drives all the time, but I don't. And I won't anytime soon. And worst case scenario, oh my god, it's a few seconds slower. And it doesn't matter, because hardware doesnt yet really use sata/usb3.0, it's not like there's a noticeable difference, and this whole thing is stupid because p67/z68 already has usb3.0 and sata3 (errmugerd its not native controller).

I'll be looking at Gen 3 boards so there's no sata3 problem. Or maybe there is, i really dont give a **** dude. This **** is not relevant today, it's not relevant to me, and in 2 years, worst case scenario, I buy a new motherboard because.... my transfer speeds are 1-2 seconds too long on the external hdd i never use?
Quote:
EDIT: I also think that neither of these techs are "The future". They are the present, we have got plenty of external drives that were easily saturated by USB 2.0 and with SSDs SATA2 hit the limit. These techs are not something that we are using for futureproofing, they are here now and they are being used to improve over their older counterparts now.

But they don't. They might saturate it in sequential write, which you only use less than 1% of the time, and is completely unnoticeable in real world usage. random 4k, 4k write/read, etc.... they never go anywhere near saturating sata 2, even on the fastest of ssd's today.

I got a sata2 ssd. It's going to last me at least 2 years, if not 5+.... seriously. goofy.

Thanks for your input but that's totally not what I'm doing or care for. Worst case scenario, I buy z77 in 2 years, because the non-native controller is just soooo bad.

If that's really all z77 has to offer - slightly better usb3.0/sata3.0 than the usb/sata3.0 on p67/z68 already on those boards, on hardware I do not have and will not use (i just upgraded from hdd to ssd, I wont be upgrading any further ANYTIME soon), with speeds that aren't noticeably better, and only in large transfers that I don't care about anyways, then I'm buying p67/z68. I could have just gone with a sata 2 hdd and been fine, I only got an ssd because it turned out to be cheaper than a hdd when I realized I only need 64gb used.
Edited by Belial - 1/1/13 at 4:56pm
Build In Progress
(17 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Haswell i7-4770K 4.8GHz@1.452v/1.97vRIN Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H Older Gigabyte 7950 (H60 Mod) 2x4GB Gskill 2400CL11 Hynix CFRs 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 830 128gb Corsair H110 w/4x 140mm Yate Loon High Blues W7 x64 Ultimate Yarrgh Matey Dell U2312HM Matte IPS 1080p 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
Sanyo DP19640 18.5" 768p KDS Rad-7xp 1024p CM Storm Quickfire Rapids Brown Rosewill Capstone 750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Bitfenix Shinobi Modded CM Storm Spawn Steelseries Diablo 3 2 set CD Speaker + Big Sub 
Other
Bitfenix Recon Fan Controller Moded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Delidded i7-3770K 5GHz@1.499 Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H 1.1 Sapphire Dual-X 7950 3L Boost 4x2GB Mushkin Ridgeback 2200mhz 8/11/8/27 1.75v... 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 Noctua 120/140/140 Fans 3 x Yate Loon Mediums (Petras) 2 x NZXT Havik 140mm Fans 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64-bit Sanyo DP19640 19'' KDS Radius Rad-7xp 17'' Ducky 1087 MX Brown 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Rosewill Capstone 550w Modular NZXT Source 210 w/Modded Window Razer Deathadder 3.5G Steelseries Blizzcon D3 
AudioAudioOtherOther
Phillips FW-C250 2 Speaker Set w/3 CD Changer JBL Sub 6 Subwoofer NZXT Sleeved LED Strip 1m Blue NZXT Sentry 2 Fan Controller 
Other
Colonial Blue Paracord Sleeving 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom ii X4 955C2, $31, 5 broken pins, works! ... Biostar A770e3 6.3 Red&Black MSI GTX 460 768mb Twin Frozr II 2 x 2GB Kingston HyperX 1333 OC to 1348CL7@1.65v 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M G2 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 6 x Case Fans (4 x YL-M, NZXT case fan, CM Hype... Jerryrigged Chipset-Northbridge 80mm HSF 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Jerryrigged VRM Heatsink (sawed off stock AM2 h... Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64bit Sanyo DP19640 19"1360x768 Ducky Cherry Browns 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Earthwatts 430D NZXT Gamma Steelseries Kinzu Optical Steelseries Blizzcon Diablo 3 
  hide details  
Reply
Build In Progress
(17 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Haswell i7-4770K 4.8GHz@1.452v/1.97vRIN Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H Older Gigabyte 7950 (H60 Mod) 2x4GB Gskill 2400CL11 Hynix CFRs 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 830 128gb Corsair H110 w/4x 140mm Yate Loon High Blues W7 x64 Ultimate Yarrgh Matey Dell U2312HM Matte IPS 1080p 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
Sanyo DP19640 18.5" 768p KDS Rad-7xp 1024p CM Storm Quickfire Rapids Brown Rosewill Capstone 750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Bitfenix Shinobi Modded CM Storm Spawn Steelseries Diablo 3 2 set CD Speaker + Big Sub 
Other
Bitfenix Recon Fan Controller Moded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Delidded i7-3770K 5GHz@1.499 Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H 1.1 Sapphire Dual-X 7950 3L Boost 4x2GB Mushkin Ridgeback 2200mhz 8/11/8/27 1.75v... 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 Noctua 120/140/140 Fans 3 x Yate Loon Mediums (Petras) 2 x NZXT Havik 140mm Fans 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64-bit Sanyo DP19640 19'' KDS Radius Rad-7xp 17'' Ducky 1087 MX Brown 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Rosewill Capstone 550w Modular NZXT Source 210 w/Modded Window Razer Deathadder 3.5G Steelseries Blizzcon D3 
AudioAudioOtherOther
Phillips FW-C250 2 Speaker Set w/3 CD Changer JBL Sub 6 Subwoofer NZXT Sleeved LED Strip 1m Blue NZXT Sentry 2 Fan Controller 
Other
Colonial Blue Paracord Sleeving 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom ii X4 955C2, $31, 5 broken pins, works! ... Biostar A770e3 6.3 Red&Black MSI GTX 460 768mb Twin Frozr II 2 x 2GB Kingston HyperX 1333 OC to 1348CL7@1.65v 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M G2 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 6 x Case Fans (4 x YL-M, NZXT case fan, CM Hype... Jerryrigged Chipset-Northbridge 80mm HSF 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Jerryrigged VRM Heatsink (sawed off stock AM2 h... Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64bit Sanyo DP19640 19"1360x768 Ducky Cherry Browns 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Earthwatts 430D NZXT Gamma Steelseries Kinzu Optical Steelseries Blizzcon Diablo 3 
  hide details  
Reply
post #5668 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

I'm sorry what? I really have no clue what you are talking about, can you go a little more indepth?
As I always understood it - and I might be a bit outdated on this, I'm more familiar with AMD than Intel - you should just get the cheapest 1.5v RAM with CL9 or better. On newegg right now the cheapest ram is both a 1866 CL9 ram and 1600 CL8 RAM. Which, like, aren't they exactly the same thing?
Like isn't 1333mhz CL9 1.5v RAM the exact same as 1600mhz CL9 1.65v RAM... right? I mean an i5 3570k at 5ghz@1.4v is not a different processor, it's an i5 3570k the same as any other (granted, silicon lottery makes a difference but it's architecturally the same).
Anyways, from there just pick the 'best', ie go by reviews or something but usually that info isn't really out there, it's just by name brand or something. And also, I understood that for intel 1600mhz is really the sweet spot (and unlike AMD, intel wants more mhz over tighter timings, ie a step up in speed is better than tighter usually, but you have diminishing returns after around 1600mhz+).

Intel likes higher RAM frequencies AND tighter timings. But will it make a huge difference for SC2 and streaming to JustinTV? Probably not...

1333MHz CL9 1.5v is slower than 1600MHz CL9 1.65v, the 1333MHz uses less power though. If I were you I would get 1600-1866MHz RAM with CL9 or CL8 timings. 1.35-1.5 volts. Its good performance and pretty cheap.

1600MHz CL8


2133MHz CL10
post #5669 of 7362
Quote:
Intel likes higher RAM frequencies AND tighter timings

Of course, but if it's the choice of 1333mhzCL9 to 1600mhzCL9 vs 1333mhzCL8, the 1600mhzCL9, generally, will win out (certain programs and even the same rig sometimes will be different, obviously), generally, with intel (i think its diminishing returns after 1600mhz, as i've seen though).

Whereas because AMD imc can only go up to 1333mhz or 1600mhz or something like that, at least on deneb/thuban, they really only appreciate timings, although higher speed is better, just not as good as more timings. most of the time, h263 codec is actually one application where speed is more important, but only sometimes.
Quote:
1333MHz CL9 1.5v is slower than 1600MHz CL9 1.65v, the 1333MHz uses less power though. If I were you I would get 1600-1866MHz RAM with CL9 or CL8 timings. 1.35-1.5 volts. Its good performance and pretty cheap.

Um... well is it? I mean... would you consider a quadcore, i5 ivy bridge cpu, at 3.3ghz@stock volt, a different chip than a 4ghz@1.4vcore? In the same sense, the 4ghz chip is 'faster', but is it really faster? Or is just overvolted and clocked differently?

Am I just not making sense at all? I feel like I'm not being understood on this ram thing. Like... when I'm overclocking my AMD system's ram, it's 1333mhzCL9 1.5v. I could either go to 1600mhz CL9 1.65v (1.6166vdimm), or 1333mhz CL8 1.65v. It's both the same thing.

Like I wouldn't list my ram on ebay or something as "1600mhz CL10 1.5v RAM". I wouldn't list it as "1066mhz CL 8 1.5v RAM". It's just 1333mhz CL9 1.5v, although all 3 of those are really the same, right? What about JEDEC specs, right, i mean those even show tighter/looser timings based on slower/quicker speed respectively.

And yea, 1333mhz CL9 1.5v is going to be slower than 1600mhz CL9 1.5. My question was 1866mhzCL9 1.5v vs 1600mhzCL8 1.5v.

I mean, 1333mhzCL9 1.5v is the same ram as 1600mhz CL9 1.65v, is it not? Isn't that simply the same 1333mhzCL9 1.5v RAM, with a little more juice to 1.65v, and then overclocked to 1600mhz with that extra juice? Which probably isn't the overclock limit of the ram anyways. Right?

Does what I say here make no sense at all? My ram. It runs at 1333mhz CL 9 1.5v. Overclocking, silicon lottery, luck, totally aside, this same RAM will run 1600mhz CL10 1.5v, or 1600mhz CL9 1.65v. Its all the same.

So isn't 1866 CL9 1.5v ram, the same as 1600mhz CL8 1.5v ram? What's the difference, besides that the speed raised, timings loosened, a 'give and take', a balance bar, that essentially just is the exact same load, but which may or may not be better for one system or another, but you could really run it either way with either ram.

I dont know what your posting those benches for, they dont really tell me anything or are really relevant I feel. Sometimes timings is more important, sometimes speed is, depends on the system, and application, and lots of things. I mean you got 1333mhzCL9 ram, but it could be better to run it as 1066mhzCL8 ram for some application.
Edited by Belial - 1/1/13 at 5:53pm
Build In Progress
(17 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Haswell i7-4770K 4.8GHz@1.452v/1.97vRIN Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H Older Gigabyte 7950 (H60 Mod) 2x4GB Gskill 2400CL11 Hynix CFRs 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 830 128gb Corsair H110 w/4x 140mm Yate Loon High Blues W7 x64 Ultimate Yarrgh Matey Dell U2312HM Matte IPS 1080p 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
Sanyo DP19640 18.5" 768p KDS Rad-7xp 1024p CM Storm Quickfire Rapids Brown Rosewill Capstone 750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Bitfenix Shinobi Modded CM Storm Spawn Steelseries Diablo 3 2 set CD Speaker + Big Sub 
Other
Bitfenix Recon Fan Controller Moded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Delidded i7-3770K 5GHz@1.499 Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H 1.1 Sapphire Dual-X 7950 3L Boost 4x2GB Mushkin Ridgeback 2200mhz 8/11/8/27 1.75v... 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 Noctua 120/140/140 Fans 3 x Yate Loon Mediums (Petras) 2 x NZXT Havik 140mm Fans 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64-bit Sanyo DP19640 19'' KDS Radius Rad-7xp 17'' Ducky 1087 MX Brown 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Rosewill Capstone 550w Modular NZXT Source 210 w/Modded Window Razer Deathadder 3.5G Steelseries Blizzcon D3 
AudioAudioOtherOther
Phillips FW-C250 2 Speaker Set w/3 CD Changer JBL Sub 6 Subwoofer NZXT Sleeved LED Strip 1m Blue NZXT Sentry 2 Fan Controller 
Other
Colonial Blue Paracord Sleeving 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom ii X4 955C2, $31, 5 broken pins, works! ... Biostar A770e3 6.3 Red&Black MSI GTX 460 768mb Twin Frozr II 2 x 2GB Kingston HyperX 1333 OC to 1348CL7@1.65v 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M G2 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 6 x Case Fans (4 x YL-M, NZXT case fan, CM Hype... Jerryrigged Chipset-Northbridge 80mm HSF 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Jerryrigged VRM Heatsink (sawed off stock AM2 h... Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64bit Sanyo DP19640 19"1360x768 Ducky Cherry Browns 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Earthwatts 430D NZXT Gamma Steelseries Kinzu Optical Steelseries Blizzcon Diablo 3 
  hide details  
Reply
Build In Progress
(17 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Haswell i7-4770K 4.8GHz@1.452v/1.97vRIN Gigabyte Z87X-UD3H Older Gigabyte 7950 (H60 Mod) 2x4GB Gskill 2400CL11 Hynix CFRs 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 830 128gb Corsair H110 w/4x 140mm Yate Loon High Blues W7 x64 Ultimate Yarrgh Matey Dell U2312HM Matte IPS 1080p 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
Sanyo DP19640 18.5" 768p KDS Rad-7xp 1024p CM Storm Quickfire Rapids Brown Rosewill Capstone 750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Bitfenix Shinobi Modded CM Storm Spawn Steelseries Diablo 3 2 set CD Speaker + Big Sub 
Other
Bitfenix Recon Fan Controller Moded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Delidded i7-3770K 5GHz@1.499 Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H 1.1 Sapphire Dual-X 7950 3L Boost 4x2GB Mushkin Ridgeback 2200mhz 8/11/8/27 1.75v... 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 Noctua 120/140/140 Fans 3 x Yate Loon Mediums (Petras) 2 x NZXT Havik 140mm Fans 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64-bit Sanyo DP19640 19'' KDS Radius Rad-7xp 17'' Ducky 1087 MX Brown 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Rosewill Capstone 550w Modular NZXT Source 210 w/Modded Window Razer Deathadder 3.5G Steelseries Blizzcon D3 
AudioAudioOtherOther
Phillips FW-C250 2 Speaker Set w/3 CD Changer JBL Sub 6 Subwoofer NZXT Sleeved LED Strip 1m Blue NZXT Sentry 2 Fan Controller 
Other
Colonial Blue Paracord Sleeving 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Phenom ii X4 955C2, $31, 5 broken pins, works! ... Biostar A770e3 6.3 Red&Black MSI GTX 460 768mb Twin Frozr II 2 x 2GB Kingston HyperX 1333 OC to 1348CL7@1.65v 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Intel X25-M G2 80GB SSD NH-D14 SE2011 6 x Case Fans (4 x YL-M, NZXT case fan, CM Hype... Jerryrigged Chipset-Northbridge 80mm HSF 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Jerryrigged VRM Heatsink (sawed off stock AM2 h... Hax'd W7 Ultimate 64bit Sanyo DP19640 19"1360x768 Ducky Cherry Browns 10keyless 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Earthwatts 430D NZXT Gamma Steelseries Kinzu Optical Steelseries Blizzcon Diablo 3 
  hide details  
Reply
post #5670 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

Of course, but if it's the choice of 1333mhzCL9 to 1600mhzCL9 vs 1333mhzCL8, the 1600mhzCL9, generally, will win out (certain programs and even the same rig sometimes will be different, obviously), generally, with intel (i think its diminishing returns after 1600mhz, as i've seen though).
Whereas because AMD imc can only go up to 1333mhz or 1600mhz or something like that, at least on deneb/thuban, they really only appreciate timings, although higher speed is better, just not as good as more timings. most of the time, h263 codec is actually one application where speed is more important, but only sometimes.
Um... well is it? I mean... would you consider a quadcore, i5 ivy bridge cpu, at 3.3ghz@stock volt, a different chip than a 4ghz@1.4vcore? In the same sense, the 4ghz chip is 'faster', but is it really faster? Or is just overvolted and clocked differently?
Am I just not making sense at all? I feel like I'm not being understood on this ram thing. Like... when I'm overclocking my AMD system's ram, it's 1333mhzCL9 1.5v. I could either go to 1600mhz CL9 1.65v (1.6166vdimm), or 1333mhz CL8 1.65v. It's both the same thing.
Like I wouldn't list my ram on ebay or something as "1600mhz CL10 1.5v RAM". I wouldn't list it as "1066mhz CL 8 1.5v RAM". It's just 1333mhz CL9 1.5v, although all 3 of those are really the same, right? What about JEDEC specs, right, i mean those even show tighter/looser timings based on slower/quicker speed respectively.
And yea, 1333mhz CL9 1.5v is going to be slower than 1600mhz CL9 1.5. My question was 1866mhzCL9 1.5v vs 1600mhzCL8 1.5v.
I mean, 1333mhzCL9 1.5v is the same ram as 1600mhz CL9 1.65v, is it not? Isn't that simply the same 1333mhzCL9 1.5v RAM, with a little more juice to 1.65v, and then overclocked to 1600mhz with that extra juice? Which probably isn't the overclock limit of the ram anyways. Right?
Does what I say here make no sense at all? My ram. It runs at 1333mhz CL 9 1.5v. Overclocking, silicon lottery, luck, totally aside, this same RAM will run 1600mhz CL10 1.5v, or 1600mhz CL9 1.65v. Its all the same.
So isn't 1866 CL9 1.5v ram, the same as 1600mhz CL8 1.5v ram? What's the difference, besides that the speed raised, timings loosened, a 'give and take', a balance bar, that essentially just is the exact same load, but which may or may not be better for one system or another, but you could really run it either way with either ram.

No, what you say does not make sense. Yes is the same CPU that is stock at 3.3GHz and then overclocked to 4.1GHz, but they do not perform the same. One completes operations more quickly than the other one. Not all RAM is going to work outside of its factory specs. Same with CPU's that's why people overclock and HOPE to achieve results. It is not guaranteed.

You said you only wanted a 4GB kit right?

This stuff is on sale and is terrific RAM with respectable frequency and stellar timings..
Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer 4GB (2 x 2GB) 1
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148516
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Intel CPUs
Overclock.net › Forums › Intel › Intel CPUs › [Official] Ivy Bridge Owners Thread