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[Official] Ivy Bridge Owners Thread - Page 568

Poll Results: Which Ivy Bridge CPU did you buy?

This is a multiple choice poll
  • 50% of voters (692)
    i5 3570k
  • 43% of voters (586)
    i7 3770k
  • 6% of voters (91)
    Other
1362 Total Votes  
post #5671 of 7362
Right... so will you pay me $300 for my 'special i5 (3570k)' because it's 4ghz@1.3vcore, even though it's just a standard 3.3ghz 3570k? It's not a different chip. It's just pushed to a higher speed..

It's hard to find a right analogy or something for this but...

like my ram, like i said. 1333mhzCL9 1.5v. I can set it to 1600mhzCL10 1.5 or 1600mhz CL9 1.65v. It's all the same 'thing'.

Isn't 1866mhzCL9 1.5v RAM exactly the same as 1600mhzCL81.5v? Yes, the 1866 is faster but looser at stock, but like it could very well just be the exact same stick of ram, the same chips, set at a different speed and timing.

Like 1600mhz CL5 1.5v RAM is clearly superior to 1866mhz CL9 1.5v RAM. You could probably loosen it to like 2000+mhz CL9 1.5v. Right? Or, you got 2000mhz CL15 1.5v RAM. That is clearly worse than the 1600mhz CL9 1.5v RAM. Or, you got 1600mhz CL8 1.65 ram, that's the same as 1600mhz CL9 1.5v RAM, and worse than 1600mhz CL8 1.5v RAM.
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post #5672 of 7362
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148516

Yes...
and for 1 penny cheaper:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148495
x 2.

Now these 2 RAM sticks might have different ICs, or one of them might just be fundamentally better or designed better, so maybe the answer is different in this case.

But speaking generally, what is better:
1866mhz CL9 1.5v OR 1600mhz CL8 1.5v

I mean aren't they really just the exact same? And since speed > timing, generally, on intel, even if you got the 1600mhz ram, you'd just run it at 1866mhz CL9 1.5v, right?
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post #5673 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

Right... so will you pay me $300 for my 'special i5 (3570k)' because it's 4ghz@1.3vcore, even though it's just a standard 3.3ghz 3570k? It's not a different chip. It's just pushed to a higher speed..
It's hard to find a right analogy or something for this but...
like my ram, like i said. 1333mhzCL9 1.5v. I can set it to 1600mhzCL10 1.5 or 1600mhz CL9 1.65v. It's all the same 'thing'.
Isn't 1866mhzCL9 1.5v RAM exactly the same as 1600mhzCL81.5v? Yes, the 1866 is faster but looser at stock, but like it could very well just be the exact same stick of ram, the same chips, set at a different speed and timing.
Like 1600mhz CL5 1.5v RAM is clearly superior to 1866mhz CL9 1.5v RAM. You could probably loosen it to like 2000+mhz CL9 1.5v. Right? Or, you got 2000mhz CL15 1.5v RAM. That is clearly worse than the 1600mhz CL9 1.5v RAM. Or, you got 1600mhz CL8 1.65 ram, that's the same as 1600mhz CL9 1.5v RAM, and worse than 1600mhz CL8 1.5v RAM.

Actually if you find me an i5-3570K that can do 4.5GHz at 1.0v I would pay $300 for it. I know a guy that just sold a 3770K for $500 because it does 5.5GHz at 1.6v which is quite rare. Even though two chips are the same model number does not mean they overclock the same. They make several batches and chips closest to the middle of the silicon wafer are usually more potent than ones cut off the end. This process is referred to as "binning"

And 1600MHz CL8 is not the same as 1866MHz CL9, especially with an Ivy CPU, case and point...

1600 CL8


1866 CL9


Same exact system, same exact RAM, different speeds, different scores...
post #5674 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickg1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

Right... so will you pay me $300 for my 'special i5 (3570k)' because it's 4ghz@1.3vcore, even though it's just a standard 3.3ghz 3570k? It's not a different chip. It's just pushed to a higher speed..
It's hard to find a right analogy or something for this but...
like my ram, like i said. 1333mhzCL9 1.5v. I can set it to 1600mhzCL10 1.5 or 1600mhz CL9 1.65v. It's all the same 'thing'.
Isn't 1866mhzCL9 1.5v RAM exactly the same as 1600mhzCL81.5v? Yes, the 1866 is faster but looser at stock, but like it could very well just be the exact same stick of ram, the same chips, set at a different speed and timing.
Like 1600mhz CL5 1.5v RAM is clearly superior to 1866mhz CL9 1.5v RAM. You could probably loosen it to like 2000+mhz CL9 1.5v. Right? Or, you got 2000mhz CL15 1.5v RAM. That is clearly worse than the 1600mhz CL9 1.5v RAM. Or, you got 1600mhz CL8 1.65 ram, that's the same as 1600mhz CL9 1.5v RAM, and worse than 1600mhz CL8 1.5v RAM.

Actually if you find me an i5-3570K that can do 4.5GHz at 1.0v I would pay $300 for it. I know a guy that just sold a 3770K for $500 because it does 5.5GHz at 1.6v which is quite rare. Even though two chips are the same model number does not mean they overclock the same. They make several batches and chips closest to the middle of the silicon wafer are usually more potent than ones cut off the end. This process is referred to as "binning"

And 1600MHz CL8 is not the same as 1866MHz CL9, especially with an Ivy CPU, case and point...

1600 CL8


1866 CL9


Same exact system, same exact RAM, different speeds, different scores...
he needs to start a thread, why is still being discussed here, with him.?
post #5675 of 7362
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post #5676 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

Right... so will you pay me $300 for my 'special i5 (3570k)' because it's 4ghz@1.3vcore, even though it's just a standard 3.3ghz 3570k? It's not a different chip. It's just pushed to a higher speed..
It's hard to find a right analogy or something for this but...
like my ram, like i said. 1333mhzCL9 1.5v. I can set it to 1600mhzCL10 1.5 or 1600mhz CL9 1.65v. It's all the same 'thing'.
Isn't 1866mhzCL9 1.5v RAM exactly the same as 1600mhzCL81.5v? Yes, the 1866 is faster but looser at stock, but like it could very well just be the exact same stick of ram, the same chips, set at a different speed and timing.
Like 1600mhz CL5 1.5v RAM is clearly superior to 1866mhz CL9 1.5v RAM. You could probably loosen it to like 2000+mhz CL9 1.5v. Right? Or, you got 2000mhz CL15 1.5v RAM. That is clearly worse than the 1600mhz CL9 1.5v RAM. Or, you got 1600mhz CL8 1.65 ram, that's the same as 1600mhz CL9 1.5v RAM, and worse than 1600mhz CL8 1.5v RAM.

Different ram chips clock differently, there are people that know how to distinguish them in whatever brand/model ram sticks there are and pick the ones that will go faster or will be better for a certain application.
I just said that ram that can do cl7-9-7-24-1t at 2000mhz with 1.65v will be much better than newer ram that can only do 1866mhz cl9-9-9-24-2t at the same voltage and those contain different chips.
And happily, you can find the former for little money, used, in 2x2gb kits.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148516
Yes...
and for 1 penny cheaper:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148495
x 2.
Now these 2 RAM sticks might have different ICs, or one of them might just be fundamentally better or designed better, so maybe the answer is different in this case.
But speaking generally, what is better:
1866mhz CL9 1.5v OR 1600mhz CL8 1.5v
I mean aren't they really just the exact same? And since speed > timing, generally, on intel, even if you got the 1600mhz ram, you'd just run it at 1866mhz CL9 1.5v, right?


You won't notice a difference between 1600mhz cl9 random generic crap, but that doesn't mean others will, so just buy whatever you want. Same with the board, get the cheapest thing that will suit your needs if you don't use sata3 storage or faster ssd's, but remember if you eventually do get a sata3 ssd your board will limit the transfer speeds that's all.

Good luck with your new build.
post #5677 of 7362
Yes, I am 2 steps ahead. I am perfectly aware that an i5 at 4ghz @ 1.0vcore (i didnt even say anything like that?) is great, and that some ram is better than other.

Obviously, when buying ram, I will be looking in-depth into the specific ram. This question is not so complicated, the answer was supposed to be very simple but instead I'm getting a newbs guide written many times over here.

You got 2 ram, same brand, same ics. 1600mhz CL 8 1.5v, or 1866mhz CL9 1.5v. Isn't that essentially the same thing. I'm completely aware that ram can be different, some things like timings, some like speed, some ram ICs overclock better than others, etc. It's a very generic, basic question, please dont read too much into it.
Quote:
You won't notice a difference between 1600mhz cl9 random generic crap, but that doesn't mean others will, so just buy whatever you want.

I am completely aware of that, but again most people probably wouldn't even notice the difference between an IB and SB, much less an i5 and an i3. That doesn't mean people still don't try to figure out what's the best for their money. I'm simply trying to do the same, sorry if everyone here just doesnt even bother with ram and buys willy nilly.
Quote:
Same with the board, get the cheapest thing that will suit your needs if you don't use sata3 storage or faster ssd's, but remember if you eventually do get a sata3 ssd your board will limit the transfer speeds that's all.

The thing is, p67/z68 has usb/sata 3.0 so it's an argument that isn't even based in reality.

Sata3 really is not utilized by SSDs. if you look up how SSDs work (see I can play that too), you'll see that sequential writes and transfer speeds that go over sata 2 bandwidth limit, are used less than 1% of the time in SSD performance, and are the least noticeable. That's why going by the advertised specifications of an SSD is worthless - an SSD can be many times better than another, but you wouldn't know it by looking at what the flashy label says. You gotta go by 4k writes, and then 4k reads, which make up 50% and i believe something like 10-20% respectively. Everything else is much less in usage, with the faster, over 200mb/s bandwidth (sic?) , ie over sata2 limit, transfer types almost never being used and completely unnoticeable.

Basically, at the moment, sata 3 drives aren't going to be noticeable over a good sata2 drive, or rather, a high quality sata3 ssd will not appear to run any slower on sata 2 than on sata 3.

And, I will not be buying a sata 3 ssd for at least 5+ years, no time in the foreseeable future. I know it's impossible to understand, but someone who's only used 40gb of HDD simply is not using large files all the time, is not transferring large files, does not use external drives. I dont even have a usb drive, cd drive, or external hdd, nor have ever had a problem with not having one.

And, god forbid some weird emergency happens where I need such a thing, I can live with the .2 seconds 'lost' of my life because of the slower legacy speeds... and pocket the extra cash for something else to be better.

I will be only playing starcraft2, a rather old game, for a few years. I can say with confidence on this too, and I've only played sc2 for the last 2 years. I'm just not the type of person to play a new game every week. So please, this is not your build, this is my build, my needs. Just compatability, overclockability, performance. SLI isn't important but I'd consider paying maybe $10 for it. I won't be upgrading for a very long time, and upgrading in 4 years is perfectly fine, your sata 3 z77 will be outdated by then anyways. Futureproofing is stupid.
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post #5678 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post

Yes, I am 2 steps ahead. I am perfectly aware that an i5 at 4ghz @ 1.0vcore (i didnt even say anything like that?) is great, and that some ram is better than other.
Obviously, when buying ram, I will be looking in-depth into the specific ram. This question is not so complicated, the answer was supposed to be very simple but instead I'm getting a newbs guide written many times over here.
You got 2 ram, same brand, same ics. 1600mhz CL 8 1.5v, or 1866mhz CL9 1.5v. Isn't that essentially the same thing. I'm completely aware that ram can be different, some things like timings, some like speed, some ram ICs overclock better than others, etc. It's a very generic, basic question, please dont read too much into it.
I am completely aware of that, but again most people probably wouldn't even notice the difference between an IB and SB, much less an i5 and an i3. That doesn't mean people still don't try to figure out what's the best for their money. I'm simply trying to do the same, sorry if everyone here just doesnt even bother with ram and buys willy nilly.
The thing is, p67/z68 has usb/sata 3.0 so it's an argument that isn't even based in reality.
Sata3 really is not utilized by SSDs. if you look up how SSDs work (see I can play that too), you'll see that sequential writes and transfer speeds that go over sata 2 bandwidth limit, are used less than 1% of the time in SSD performance, and are the least noticeable. That's why going by the advertised specifications of an SSD is worthless - an SSD can be many times better than another, but you wouldn't know it by looking at what the flashy label says. You gotta go by 4k writes, and then 4k reads, which make up 50% and i believe something like 10-20% respectively. Everything else is much less in usage, with the faster, over 200mb/s bandwidth (sic?) , ie over sata2 limit, transfer types almost never being used and completely unnoticeable.
Basically, at the moment, sata 3 drives aren't going to be noticeable over a good sata2 drive, or rather, a high quality sata3 ssd will not appear to run any slower on sata 2 than on sata 3.
And, I will not be buying a sata 3 ssd for at least 5+ years, no time in the foreseeable future. I know it's impossible to understand, but someone who's only used 40gb of HDD simply is not using large files all the time, is not transferring large files, does not use external drives. I dont even have a usb drive, cd drive, or external hdd, nor have ever had a problem with not having one.
And, god forbid some weird emergency happens where I need such a thing, I can live with the .2 seconds 'lost' of my life because of the slower legacy speeds... and pocket the extra cash for something else to be better.
I will be only playing starcraft2, a rather old game, for a few years. I can say with confidence on this too, and I've only played sc2 for the last 2 years. I'm just not the type of person to play a new game every week. So please, this is not your build, this is my build, my needs. Just compatability, overclockability, performance. SLI isn't important but I'd consider paying maybe $10 for it. I won't be upgrading for a very long time, and upgrading in 4 years is perfectly fine, your sata 3 z77 will be outdated by then anyways. Futureproofing is stupid.

No one says you should futureproof either, just that z77 offers better overclocking potential for someone who will compete at benchmarking level, or someone who wants to avoid troubleshooting stuff or researching a lot to find an old board that IS compatible and hassle free with your new IB cpu.
I've said all I have to say to you, I won't bother anymore and I'm quite patient actually...
post #5679 of 7362
cleaned and reopened.

Folks, remember, we are all here to teach, spread our knowledge and correct one another. I ask kindly that you don't resort to personal attacks, name calling, trolling, singling out a member or members or pass condescending comments at each other to satisfy your ego. Let us respect each other and act like civilized mature human beings that we are smile.gif


cheers.gif
post #5680 of 7362
Quote:
Originally Posted by ivanlabrie View Post

I needed 1.23v for 4.4ghz, 1.112v for 4.2ghz and 1.31v for 4.6ghz...prime95 stable 18hs. 4.9ghz required 1.48v for stability, 5ghz was too hot to stress test.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tw33k View Post

Here's what I can get out of mine..
Quote:
Originally Posted by vaporizer View Post

here's my 4.5. bios vcore is 1.235

Edit: prime95 for 1hr. avg seems around mid-50's just by glancing. EK supr. copper/plexi

Quote:
Originally Posted by PatrickCrowely View Post

Good chip
Mine without delidding. Max temp 65.....
ab4a38ec_12-27-20129-41-13PM.jpeg

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCWargamer View Post

Happy New Years VonDutch - and others too!!!
My first 3770K needed 1.248v to be stable at 4.5GHz - but that chip died in a tragic delidding accident (small nick in pcb is all it takes!).
My second 3770K needs 1.288v to be stable at 4.5GHz. Bummer as I was hoping for a better replacement chip! But it OCs to 5.2GHz.
I then tried another 3770K and a 3750K, and they had a bit lower vcore requirement for 4.5GHz, but did not OC past 5.0GHz, so no good.
Also, the 2nd 3770K would do 4.5GHz on an MPower at 1.25v, where as it needs the 1.288v for the P8Z68-V/Gen 3 and the Sabertooth Z77.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCWargamer View Post

Man, my per-delidded 4.5GHz temps at 1.248v were in the 90C range with an H80!!! Temps go up fast with higher vcore on the IBs before they are delidded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PatrickCrowely View Post

This is true about some IVY bridge chips. Not all. My chip hasn't run hot @ all. It does 4.8GHz @ 1.260 with a max temp of 72. As I didn't do any other overclocking past that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HPE1000 View Post

Here is my 3570k @ 4.5ghz, it was running prime95 and then furmark on the gtx670.
And yes, the water was heated up all the way, it wasnt a multi hour prime run, but it took around 30 mins for the water to cool down, the temps were 45c idle for around 30 mins straight after running it (no diff in temp even when I run it overnight so that is further proving that). Normally my idle is 25c or so when just at the desktop. Prime ran for around 20 some minutes and furmark was going for 15 mins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by glc24 View Post

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!
This is my initial overclock. Not sure if I would really gain much going to 4.8,but I may try to achieve it with no more than 1.25V-1.27V.
Temps are pretty decent for 12 hours on Prime too.

i7 3770K batch #3229A935
Asus Z77 Sabertooth with 1708 BIOS
Corsair H100i with push/pull using Cougar Vortex 1500rpm Fans
Greg

thanks you all, im curious about ivy's running at 4.5ghz, and the vcore needed,
compare that to higher oc's with the same (delidded) chip's we have, to see if a ivy is worth delidding, to archieve higher oc's with low vcore
Edited by VonDutch - 1/2/13 at 2:06am
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BamBam
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
amd 8350 my kids rig :) Gigabyte 990fxa-ud3 Gigabyte 7970 windforce Corsair Vengeance CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9 
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500gb OZC vertex 4  Scythe Mugen 3 rev b windows 8.1 
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acer 23 inch logitech G510 XFX ProSeries 750W XXX Edition Cooler Master CM 690 II 
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