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An Overview of Mouse Technology - Page 7

post #61 of 110
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayfkay View Post

does this table actually mean that for 1920, the ideal pixel precise sens has to be between 1.357 and 2.713???
It means you won't need sensitivity below 1.0 to be pixel precise even with very high resolutions.
post #62 of 110
Would you look at that, stickied thumb.gif
post #63 of 110
Very informative, but there are a few practical questions I'm left with:
Quote:
As an example, Player A has a rotational turn of 46cm/360° using a combination of 3600 CPI and 0.25 sens. Player B also uses 46cm/360° but instead uses 800 CPI and 1.125 sens (both use a pointer speed of 6/11 and have a yaw of 0.022). In the case of Player A, the size of his radial value is 4.5 times smaller Player B which gives him many smaller adjustments per degree as each count represents a much smaller radial value. It is important to remember that neither sensitivity setting is incorrect, but a personal preference, however, two other notes of importance should be touched upon to clarify matters.

How is this a matter of preference though? I mean, what difference does it make if either the sensor is set to report information at a lower rate of CPI or the game to use the information differently? Theoretically, an in-game sensitivity of 1 @ 800cpi should behave exactly like one of 2 @ 400cpi, shouldn't it (technically, there are difference as far as sensor idiosyncrasies go, of course)?
Quote:
The yaw/pitch values, which are set by the game engine, are the base unit (usually in degrees, and then converted to radians by the game) that are applied for each registered count of mouse movement. The default yaw value in Source engine games for example is 0.022, so for each count registered by the OS, the mouse will move the horizontal view matrix by a radial value of 0.0003839723°. It should be noted that for many games, the yaw/pitch values cannot be modified, though Quake as usual is an outlier and does allow modification of these settings.

Where does this value
Quote:
0.0003839723°
come from? I always thought the m_yaw/-pitch values represented the actual translation of counts to degrees (in source engine-based games 0.022° per count for example).

Finally, what is the general consensus as to how custom CPI values affect the sensor's performance (- keyword CPI interpolation)? Is it generally better to have the mouse running at its sensor's native resolutions, does this depend on the specific sensor or can you generally safely use whatever you are comfortable with, without having to worry about any inconsistencies?

Thanks.
Edited by HAGGARD - 6/3/13 at 3:55pm
post #64 of 110
Quote:
Originally Posted by HAGGARD View Post

How is this a matter of preference though?
The difference is: the lower sensitivity, the higher aiming precision (potentially).
Quote:
Originally Posted by HAGGARD View Post

Where does this value come from? I always thought the m_yaw/-pitch values represented the actual translation of counts to degrees.
This value is 0.022 degrees but in radians. Yes, m_yaw/pitch are in degrees.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HAGGARD View Post

Finally, what is the general consensus as to how custom CPI values affect the sensor's performance (- keyword CPI interpolation)?
In my opinion:
for FPS games (with cross hair) - use native resolution at which your mouse performs best, set sensitivity to achieve cm/360 distance that you like,
other games (with cursor) - use cursor speed that you like, but avoid double interpolation (for example both from Windows slider and mouse driver).
post #65 of 110
I know this question is as old as time, just wanted to reassure myself..
if I was using one sensitivity with two different FOVs, then I would still have the same cm/360° right? but the feeling changes, or something.. tongue.gif
post #66 of 110
Quote:
The difference is: the lower sensitivity, the higher aiming precision (potentially).

What do you mean? The (real) sensitivity (xcm/360°) is the same for both settings.
Quote:
This value is 0.022 degrees but in radians. Yes, m_yaw/pitch are in degrees.

Well, I know that the value represents radians. Still where does it come from? I can't find that information anywhere else. Also, why would one measure in radians, when in fact, all that matters for sensitivity is how many degrees are rotated per count (which is sufficiently described by m_yaw/-pitch)?
Quote:
[...] native resolution at which your mouse performs best [...]

Is this part of your opinion or are you saying it is widely acknowledged that mice perform better running at native CPI?

Thanks.
Edited by HAGGARD - 6/4/13 at 11:50am
post #67 of 110
jayfkay
Yes cm/360 should be the same at different FOV.

HAGGARD
1. When sensitivity is lower there is more possible "directions" to aim. Try sensitivity: 1.0 m_yaw 90 - there will be 4 possible directions, but with sensitivity 2.0 there will be only two and with sens 4.0 you won't rotate at all wink.gif .
2. I don't know, maybe the inner working of game is with radians but degrees are more natural for humans so settings are recalculated.
3. This is tricky question because I do think that native CPI are better but I would say some not native resolutions are equally good (like halved). For example for CS1.6 I use Logitech G400 at 400 CPI but this isn't native step, so I meant: use the best performing resolution. This is entirely my opinion. There are some users, who will try convince you to change a lot of BIOS and system settings in order to have better mouse response and they are judging this improvement "by feel".
post #68 of 110
Framerate and hz value will influence overall feel quite a bit.

Problem being, our setups aren't static. - Whats a problem for a specific person, might not be for the next guy. Referring to DA 4G "lag"
post #69 of 110
I see, thanks. In the article it said 2 radians = 360°. But 360 / 0.022 = 16363.63636363636 * 0.0003839723 = 6.283183090909091. I guess this would mean 6.28... radians = 360° in source engine-based games.

Scaling down the implications of your m_yaw 90 example to the value 0.022, wouldn't this mean that going for the lowest in-game sensitivity is always preferable as less degrees are "skipped" per count? As in, a sensitivity of 0.5 applied to the m_yaw of 90 would mean that you turn only 45° per count, allowing for more freedom of rotation, and 0.25 22.5° and so on... Or is this neglectable due to the fact that the human hand is not able to control the mouse "count-precise"? In the article it just said this is down to preference, I thought there was no difference at all, but there apparently is, so what exactly is it that you prefer when going for low in-game sensitivity and high CPI as opposed to high sensitivity and low CPI?
Edited by HAGGARD - 6/4/13 at 2:12pm
post #70 of 110
2 * PI radians = 360 degrees
6.28... / 2 = PI

With your second question we are returning to jayfkay's question about the table: http://www.overclock.net/t/1251156/an-overview-of-mouse-technology/50#post_20101884. Even at very high screen resolution, sensitivities 1.0-2.0 are good enough to be below "pixel skipping" level, so lowering sensitivity to ridiculously small value isn't needed. Additionally, aiming precision at 640x480 sens 3.0 will be the same as at 1920x1080 sens 3.0, and some progamers do very well with that sensitivity. They don't have any problems with aiming at whatever they want. Because of that, very high CPI values are not needed for FPS games.
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