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[Kotaku] Blizzard will take a Big cut of Money You try to make From Diablo III. - Page 26

post #251 of 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

It isn't an RPG, but an ARPG, there is a pretty strong difference between them.
As for the quality of the game itself, it won't appeal to everyone. The ARPG market has always been smaller compared to the others, it is just that those of us in it really enjoy it and are very faithful to it, this allows it to continue on. FPS on the other hand can keep going just based off the massive number of people that play it, the individual player doesn't have to be dedicated because there are so many of them.

In the FPS market, the only one that is doing well is the COD style of FPS. The skilled team-based, arena, and tactical shooter subgenre of FPS are dying/dead. Only instant gratification and easy shallow shooters with tons of unlocks are very popular nowadays. Single player FPS games are also much worse nowadays with all the cut scenes and boring, linear gameplay.
Edited by Riou - 5/14/12 at 3:05pm
post #252 of 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riou View Post

In the FPS market, the only one that is doing well is the COD style of FPS. The skilled team-based, arena, and tactical shooter subgenre of FPS are dying/dead. Only instant gratification and easy shallow shooters with tons of unlocks are very popular nowadays. Single player FPS games are also much worse nowadays with all the cut scenes and boring, linear gameplay.

After I stopped playing CS (v.1.0 - v.1.6) competitively years ago, I fell out of the genre, I am hoping to get back into it with CS:GO. Anytime I mention CS to people I get the "Old man doesn't know what he is talking about" look, followed by some crap about MW or BF series. I just couldn't get into them, I don't know if it was the lack of real skill and teamwork, or the annoying 15 year old kids screaming into my ear over voice com.
    
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post #253 of 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

After I stopped playing CS (v.1.0 - v.1.6) competitively years ago, I fell out of the genre, I am hoping to get back into it with CS:GO. Anytime I mention CS to people I get the "Old man doesn't know what he is talking about" look, followed by some crap about MW or BF series. I just couldn't get into them, I don't know if it was the lack of real skill and teamwork, or the annoying 15 year old kids screaming into my ear over voice com.

I only play CoD on PS3 once a week or so to mess with people. I get called all sorts of names it's hilarious. But other than that I don't play them much. I do see why people like them so much though. The low skill requirement is good for people that just want to hop on and have fun, something that a lot of games seem to have lost. They become too serious and competitive and lose all the joy of playing. It is a game afterall and games are meant to be fun redface.gif
post #254 of 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

It isn't an RPG, but an ARPG, there is a pretty strong difference between them.
As for the quality of the game itself, it won't appeal to everyone. The ARPG market has always been smaller compared to the others, it is just that those of us in it really enjoy it and are very faithful to it, this allows it to continue on. FPS on the other hand can keep going just based off the massive number of people that play it, the individual player doesn't have to be dedicated because there are so many of them.

Interesting. I wasn't aware of the distinction. So it's an rpg and then some; or minus some. I mean obviously it can't not be an rpg merely by adding to the name, since we can't include the words in the name if it isn't those words to some extent. What makes an action game into an arpg? Cutscenes? Gear swapping? Playing a fictional character..no wait that is pretty much all games. Crap I just confused myself. Nevermind.
    
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post #255 of 264
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Originally Posted by Otterclock View Post

Interesting. I wasn't aware of the distinction. So it's an rpg and then some; or minus some. I mean obviously it can't not be an rpg merely by adding to the name, since we can't include the words in the name if it isn't those words to some extent. What makes an action game into an arpg? Cutscenes? Gear swapping? Playing a fictional character..no wait that is pretty much all games. Crap I just confused myself. Nevermind.

The primary difference between an RPG and ARPG is with combat, an ARPG being live action and RPG being turned based. That line is being blurred more and more each year it seems, but that was the bases of it all. So games like Diablo and Torchlight are all live action hack and slashes, with strong RPG elements. They are story driven with persistent characters, gear, and leveling. You could even consider some FPS to be ARPG's, as they contain all of the previously mentioned but the combat being from a FPS. Though typically you see these titles, Planetside 1/2, as being marketed as FPSRPG.
    
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post #256 of 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

The primary difference between an RPG and ARPG is with combat, an ARPG being live action and RPG being turned based. That line is being blurred more and more each year it seems, but that was the bases of it all. So games like Diablo and Torchlight are all live action hack and slashes, with strong RPG elements. They are story driven with persistent characters, gear, and leveling. You could even consider some FPS to be ARPG's, as they contain all of the previously mentioned but the combat being from a FPS. Though typically you see these titles, Planetside 1/2, as being marketed as FPSRPG.


Close, but still off. Otherwise Blizzard wouldn't have "invented" the genre. Which is a false claim also I'd like to add.

ARPG's also have the distinction of a top-down camera in a 3D environment, randomly generated equipment and levels. Buuuut.... Other than that, no obvious distinctions between an RPG and ARPG.

There are pen and paper RPG's that aren't turn based. Board Game RPG's that aren't turn based. Can't quite figure out how you thought that was a distinguishing characteristic of all of them.... And weren't we all traumatized enough by the advent of LARPing to never forget what it entails? Good God....wth.gif
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post #257 of 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otterclock View Post

Interesting. I wasn't aware of the distinction. So it's an rpg and then some; or minus some. I mean obviously it can't not be an rpg merely by adding to the name, since we can't include the words in the name if it isn't those words to some extent. What makes an action game into an arpg? Cutscenes? Gear swapping? Playing a fictional character..no wait that is pretty much all games. Crap I just confused myself. Nevermind.

Combat mechanics are the difference.

Pure RPG is usually turned based or menu based. Stats and dice rolls determine if an attack is successful. It is more about dice rolls and game rule conventions like Dungeon and Dragons rules.

ARPG's are more about real-time live action combat. Stats are still involved like RPGs but real-time physical contact is what determines if an attack is successful. ARPG's likely make more sense to an action/adventure game player imho.
post #258 of 264
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Originally Posted by Riou View Post

Combat mechanics are the difference.
Pure RPG is usually turned based or menu based. Stats and dice rolls determine if an attack is successful. It is more about dice rolls and game rule conventions like Dungeon and Dragons rules.
ARPG's are more about real-time live action combat. Stats are still involved like RPGs but real-time physical contact is what determines if an attack is successful. ARPG's likely make more sense to an action/adventure game player imho.

Alright. One more thing about this turn-based vs. real time combat.

Cool-downs are an enforcement of turn-based mechanics on real time action. They're used to simplify balancing, because mechanics geeks like me have a hard time calculating the in-game effects of spamming an ability in real time for as long as you have resources, when other things like percentage bonuses and reductions to efficacy and speed come into play.

In other words, so long as cool-downs are a part of gameplay, it isn't true real-time combat, because that's a carry-over from turn-based combat. This does not include the time necessary for execution, only cooldowns. thumb.gif
Edited by Ganf - 5/14/12 at 5:31pm
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post #259 of 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganf View Post

Close, but still off. Otherwise Blizzard wouldn't have "invented" the genre. Which is a false claim also I'd like to add.
ARPG's also have the distinction of a top-down camera in a 3D environment, randomly generated equipment and levels. Buuuut.... Other than that, no obvious distinctions between an RPG and ARPG.
There are pen and paper RPG's that aren't turn based. Board Game RPG's that aren't turn based. Can't quite figure out how you thought that was a distinguishing characteristic of all of them.... And weren't we all traumatized enough by the advent of LARPing to never forget what it entails? Good God....wth.gif

I never said Blizzard invented it....

Not all ARPG's are top down in a 3D environment

Frankly there isn't a single definition to an RPG/ARPG/JRPG, they are all very broad in scope.

LARPing.....

Dear god how dare you even mention that, the trauma.........the trauma.....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganf View Post

Alright. One more thing about this turn-based vs. real time combat.
Cool-downs are an enforcement of turn-based mechanics on real time action. They're used to simplify balancing, because mechanics geeks like me have a hard time calculating the in-game effects of spamming an ability in real time for as long as you have resources, when other things like percentage bonuses and reductions to efficacy and speed come into play.
In other words, so long as cool-downs are a part of gameplay, it isn't true real-time combat, because that's a carry-over from turn-based combat. This does not include the time necessary for execution, only cooldowns. thumb.gif

Well typically you will still have the option to auto attack, while things are on CD, maintaining that live action combat situation.
    
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post #260 of 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

I never said Blizzard invented it....
Not all ARPG's are top down in a 3D environment
Frankly there isn't a single definition to an RPG/ARPG/JRPG, they are all very broad in scope.
LARPing.....
Dear god how dare you even mention that, the trauma.........the trauma.....
Well typically you will still have the option to auto attack, while things are on CD, maintaining that live action combat situation.

Blizzard said Blizzard invented it, actually.

And that is where the "standard camera angle" comes from also.

Live action is just an illusion so long as you have animations with a standard time and cooldowns.
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