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[Build Log] CaseLabs Magnum STH10 - Page 2

post #11 of 14
Are you open to feedback and input? You can consider me a newbie, but I do have some ideas.
  • The most power efficient model for heat dissipation is geothermal. You've probably seen several pics of rigs where people run copper through their garage floor or what-not. This is usually not an option for most people for various reasons though.
  • If you want a good monitor/controller, you might want to add the Aqua Computer Aquaero to your list. It's pretty much the best one available if you're okay with the price. It would offer you tons of ways to control air/water flow rates, noise, etc. It also provides a nice way for instant shutdown in case of cooling failure.
  • I didn't see an SSD mentioned in your list; that is pretty much a requirement for any performance-oriented PC nowadays (at least for boot and swap); I would personally go with an Intel 520 (or maybe the new 330?) for reliability. I'm not sure I trust these hybrids just yet, but maybe others have had good experiences. You could just use an SSD with the Intel Smart Response Technology if you wanted too.
  • You should wait for the AMD 7990 to see if it impresses, but lately it seems that AMD has been twiddling their thumbs; I wouldn't rule out Nvidia. Planning for SLI/Crossfire?
  • I've been looking at this case myself and wonder if it wouldn't be possible to seal up the top chamber from any air leaks, use dual radiators on the sides and vent the air upward using negative pressure inside the sealed chamber (would have to test airflow through the rads). I'm not sure how thick of fans could be used, but it'd be nice if you could create enough vaccuum to pull fresh air through two radiators with a single fan line venting up. The surface area would be immense, so in theory the air wouldn't need to move very fast. What's more, you could have a straight air filter on both sides for easy cleanup of dust.
  • Cooling rads on the bottom is trickier; if you pull from the sides, then you'd either need to go in one side and out the other or pump the post-radiator air into your main chamber. Pushing the air down won't work well because then you'll create a hot-air loop. If you used a single rad on the bottom and pushed the air out the sides it would be ok as long as you didn't pull air in from the sides on the top chamber (this may be incorrect; since your air delta shouldn't be too much, it may have cooled by the time it reaches the top chamber: would have to test).
  • You mentioned the need to use a dehumidifier; why? If the water and cooling components never reach a temperature below ambient, it shouldn't condensate. Surely the air does not cool so fast in the evening to cause condensation indoors? Dehumidifiers are power-hungry. If you really need one, why not go one step further and use internal AC? If you used water to pull out the heat from the hottest components, then in theory you could have a closed system that used AC internally for cooling (and drying) everything else. You may even be able to incorporate cooling of the AC using the same water loop. That removes all dust too, except for the radiators' intakes.

Edited by Electrocutor - 5/23/12 at 8:06am
post #12 of 14
Thread Starter 
Hi Electrocutor,

Thank you for passing by, I am totally open to criticism and welcome your suggestions.

• Unfortunately, I live in a flat and there is no way I can benefit from geothermal water-cooling right now. I might consider a 3770K-690/7990 powered under-floor heating though smile.gif

• The Aquaero is a great controller and I will definitely consider it. In terms of CPU cooling, I am studying the potential TIM and IHS inefficiencies with the 3770K. Right now, I am pondering whether I should remove the IHS and apply some Nanoxia Nano TF-1000 on the die.

• I added a SSD #1 entry today: Plextor M3P 128 GB. The Intel 520 Series is indeed more reliable, but the M3P series offers overall faster performance, better power consumption and a 5-year warranty.

• I agree with you about AMD, and I am not ruling out nVidia: the 690 is an excellent card with a solid design. I am waiting to see how the 7990 is priced and if it has more than 4 GB of VRAM. I am not considering a SLI/Crossfire, only one dual-GPU card. My intuition tells me that a quad-GPU would produce a lot of additional heat, and consume much more power for limited performance gains on a single monitor.

• I am still selecting parts and I have not thought too much about the about the airflow and water-cooling system yet. I would like to use negative air pressure, assisted by dust filters. The general idea behind vertical heat convection mentioned on my first post is to amplify natural convection and have a linear airflow. I will certainly:
1. use the lower chamber as an inflow of colder floor air
2. let this air rise to the middle chamber (optional exhaust on the back)
3. use stronger fans in the upper chamber to create negative pressure and use it as an outflow for hot air.
I am aware that the case has many ventilated parts (upper, lower covers, back, front etc.) and that it might be tricky to create an efficient negative pressure. I might have to order solid parts to seal up the upper, and even the middle chamber as you suggest. I would also like to keep room in the lower chamber for the PSU(s) and the pump(s). Thank you for pointing out potential issues with side pulling.

• Hong Kong has a humid, subtropical climate. Humidity is above 80% on average. Moisture combined with ambient dust create the worst kind of sticky, corrosive fluff. An internal AC is an ambitious, interesting idea. However I am not sure that the case is large enough to host an efficient AC. Even if it could, it would probably vibrate a lot and be very noisy. I was thinking to start with desiccants, not a mechanical dehumidifier, and see how it goes. If the results are not satisfactory, I might have to supplement the dehumidifiers and dust filters with an external AC (heat, humidity) and with an iQair (dust).

KL
post #13 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by King Louie 
In terms of CPU cooling, I am studying the potential TIM and IHS inefficiencies with the 3770K. Right now, I am pondering whether I should remove the IHS and apply some Nanoxia Nano TF-1000 on the die.
It looks like replacing the TIM will probably net a 6-7 degree drop in temps. It also shows how mediocre the paste is that Intel uses.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1258439/ivy-bridge-3770k-heat-spreader-thermal-grease-testing

I've seen some overclock.net results that show overclock temps down almost 20 degrees. It's a shame some idiot decided to cut a corner and save a cent or two on each chip. Here's to hoping that the backlash causes the B to have solder or a better paste.

If you're going to do this, you'll have to think about whether you want direct-to-die contact or not. Doing that is possible, but would either require that you modify the IHS (cut out the middle) or figure out another way to hold down the wafer. Personally, I'd just pull it off, clean it, apply the liquid metal, then re-attach the thing to give you less headache.

Quote:
Originally Posted by King Louie 
I would like to use negative air pressure, assisted by dust filters. The general idea behind vertical heat convection mentioned on my first post is to amplify natural convection and have a linear airflow.
If you're wanting to be able to vent from bottom to top, how about this arrangement:
  • Bottom - bottom, front, back sealed
  • Bottom - left, right 560 GTX (dense fins) + fan pull on both sides
  • Middle - bottom fan pull from lower chamber (help rad via negative lower chamber pressure) + pump
  • Middle - middle res + everything else minus psu
  • Middle - front, back intake/exhaust (heat from lower chamber and middle chamber misc) This really wouldn't be necessary and could be sealed instead if you wanted; the only concern may be pump and hdd cooling without fresh air?
  • Middle - top fan push to top chamber
  • Top - bottom open
  • Top - front vent/intake
  • Top - back PSU
  • Top - left, right 360 SR-1 (non-dense) + fan pull on both sides
  • Top - top vent


----
As an unrelated side note, I've been trying to find anyone who has used the Cougar Vortex fans in a radiator to get some information on them. From everything I've read about them, they have higher CFM, higher pressure, and less noise than the GT AP15, but until I can find someone who used the AP15 and them side-by-side, it's just unverified numbers.


* If you'd prefer I keep my thoughts to myself please let me know and I'll clutter you're build thread no further.
Edited by Electrocutor - 5/24/12 at 9:20pm
post #14 of 14
Thread Starter 
Hi Electrocutor,

No worries, you are not cluttering the thread at all!

I have also done my research and I will replace the TIM of the 3770K with some Nanoxia Nano TF-1000 and keep the IHS. I would love to observe a 20°C drop, but even 5-6°C would be significant for me.

Your suggested setup is more or less what I had in mind, but with:

- the PSU in the lower chamber so that it benefits from cold floor air (with a dust filter), I prefer to avoid filling the upper chamber with components that need cooling.

- lower chamber: front, sides, back (half of it because of the PSU) sealed, bottom with fans (and dust filters), so that the airflow starts in the right direction (upward).

- middle chamber: front sealed or with fans (need to experiment), back with exhaust.

- upper chamber: bottom open, top with exhaust, sides with radiators and then either sealed, open or exhaust front and back, I will also need to experiment!

With regards to the case fans, I am still waiting as there is still very limited feedback on the Corsair Series, and it seems that the Scythe Gentle Typhoons AP-15 are still the top. The Cougar Vortex are excellent fans, but their colour scheme is not what I have in mind for this build.

KL
Edited by King Louie - 5/27/12 at 2:47am
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