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High End Air Cooling vs Closed Loop Water Cooling - Page 9

post #81 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyd View Post

look, i did get mad, but i changed my post (before you replied). i apologize.
Quote:
The rest of your opinions are just that opinions and not based on objective test data.
you never mentioned ram clearance, so by default, you said it was an opinion.
you have repeatedly stirred up trouble, i am now going to block you, and I will avoid your flame threads. if everywhere you go, people are flaming, maybe the problem isnt everyone else.

Actually few people flame me because the test data speaks for itself. It's not my data it's data from various reputable PC industry sources. In the science and engineering communities objective scientific test data is worth far more than unsubstantiate subjective opinions that can't be validated.

Some people get irrational when they can't deal with the test data, but that is a personal issue they must address. No one can make you feel anything. How you feel is the result of how you view the world. Getting mad (angry) doesn't change anything. Maybe when you cool off you'll gain some perspective on this discussion and why it bothers you that the test data doesn't agree with all of your conclusions.

FWIW, I have no personal issue with you nor a differing POV - as long as you are civil and respectful. This is just a forum discussion where we can all learn and contribute if desired.
Edited by AMD4ME - 5/26/12 at 10:51pm
post #82 of 158
Okay everyone lets settle down now. No point in getting our feathers all ruffled just because somebody doesn't agree with our viewpoint. If somebody doesn't agree with you there is no point in trying to force them. smile.gif
    
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post #83 of 158
I was looking at buying a H100 not long ago, but after reading many reviews I decided on the Silver Arrow. Half the price, half the noise and within 1-2 deg temps. The money I saved paid for my ram and a new mouse mat.

I also love the beastly look my Silver Arrow has. Very menacing smile.gif
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post #84 of 158
Thread Starter 
People who say the 800D "is a poor case for air cooling" obviously don't own one or haven't set it up properly. People were spreading that myth when the case first came out but owners quickly busted it. With my air coolers in this case I had excellent air flow and the low temps are proof of that. The temp inside the case is never more than a couple of degrees warmer than room temp (right now the room is 21c and inside the case is 21.6c. That's a sign of great cooling inside the case)

Testing the air coolers and the H100 inside a case is the best way to get real world performance comparisons. How many people run test benches? Not many. The aim of this is to compare the 2 types under as close to identical circumstances as possible to see which is best. Obviously there are too many variables to say that what works in my set up will work the same across the board but it gives people a good idea of what to expect.
Edited by tw33k - 5/27/12 at 5:58am
post #85 of 158
To me and water cooling, it doesn't matter what case you use ... because my 2 360 radiators, pump, reservoir, 6 ultra quiet fans, and fan speed controller are all in an EXTERNAL stand and is put away from my PC. By doing that, not only does my COMPUTER run nearly totally silent (aside from 1 low spinning case fan and the fan in the PSU), but all the heat is pulled away from computer and exchanged away from it "somewhere else" so it doesn't heat up my computer are where I sit.

Do that on a "High End Air Cooling".
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post #86 of 158
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

To me and water cooling, it doesn't matter what case you use ... because my 2 360 radiators, pump, reservoir, 6 ultra quiet fans, and fan speed controller are all in an EXTERNAL stand and is put away from my PC. By doing that, not only does my COMPUTER run nearly totally silent (aside from 1 low spinning case fan and the fan in the PSU), but all the heat is pulled away from computer and exchanged away from it "somewhere else" so it doesn't heat up my computer are where I sit.
Do that on a "High End Air Cooling".

This has nothing to do with this thread so please don't troll here.
post #87 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMD4ME View Post

^^^^ Having to buy quiet fans for CLCs just makes them a worse value compared to highend HSFs. It's also worth noting that blowing the air OUT of the case thru a CLC makes it less thermally efficient than drawing outside cool air IN to the case. But when you draw air thru the CLC radiator IN to the case, then you preheat the air that is needed to cool the GPU, VRM, etc. so it's a no win situation with a CLC .

I draw cool air *in* to the H100 and have noticed a degree or two uptick in MB temps but nothing even remotely critical or worth forgoing the obviously better CPU temps that go along with the intake scenario.

My video card is cooled via another CLC, an Antec 620, and it exhausts the heat out of the case. Again, here, with the H100 as intake (and the 620 intake, literally, sitting right under the H100's exhaust) I've seen nothing but outstanding temps on my GTX 580 ( 57C load with Furmark/Heaven).

I've found that even under heavy synthetic load conditions, the H100 doesn't exhaust air *nearly* as hot as the Antec 620 mounted to my GTX 580 does; the Antec 620 on my vid card spits out 110F air when loading...just ridiculously hot exhaust...whereas the H100's really doesn't even feel too warm to the hand. And to be sure, I've encountered nothing but quite better CPU load temps using the H100 as an intake instead of an exhaust. This might have to do with the fact that none of the vid card heat ever hits the inside of the case, in fact, I'd reckon that's the main reason things are working so well cause if I still had the GTX580 reference cooler mounted, the case internals would most likely be an oven.

But still, as you can see below...the Antec radiator is sucking air straight out of the H100's exhaust and even the most grueling of synthetic loads can't heat up the video card (much less my RAM or MB):

...

450

...

Works real good.

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post #88 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by psyclum View Post

i'm not saying pick ANY case, i'm saying if you want a true unbiased test, put it on a test bench where there is no airflow variables that are not accounted for in a test like this. the superiority of a CPU cooler should NOT be based on what case it's used in.....
I understand your thinking, but real world use is not setting on a test bench. Yes, different cases perform differently... as will different components in them also change performance.

In my opinion that's what real life testing is all about.

And the reason I like what tw33k is doing.
Edited by doyll - 5/27/12 at 7:25am
post #89 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by EM2J View Post

http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=2665&page=7
if you take a look at the intel test results, when they push the thermal envelope a little higher to 150w, the h100 pulls ahead.
also id like to note the c14 pulls ahead of the d14 which i found interesting, as i have both and can't decide which one to use on my main pc.

Cooler 85w 125w 150w
H100 = 7.5 11.6 12.1
D-14 = 8.9 11.2 14.1
TC14 = 8.5 11.3 14.4

Find H100 125w 11.6c reading is not consistent with 150w 12.1c??? Seems 125w reading is high or 150w is low.....
post #90 of 158
Quote:
Originally Posted by tw33k View Post

People who say the 800D "is a poor case for air cooling" obviously don't own one or haven't set it up properly. People were spreading that myth when the case first came out but owners quickly busted it. With my air coolers in this case I had excellent air flow and the low temps are proof of that. The temp inside the case is never more than a couple of degrees warmer than room temp (right now the room is 21c and inside the case is 21.6c. That's a sign of great cooling inside the case)

Testing the air coolers and the H100 inside a case is the best way to get real world performance comparisons. How many people run test benches? Not many. The aim of this is to compare the 2 types under as close to identical circumstances as possible to see which is best. Obviously there are too many variables to say that what works in my set up will work the same across the board but it gives people a good idea of what to expect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by psyclum View Post

i'm not saying pick ANY case, i'm saying if you want a true unbiased test, put it on a test bench where there is no airflow variables that are not accounted for in a test like this. the superiority of a CPU cooler should NOT be based on what case it's used in.....
I understand your thinking, but real world use is not setting on a test bench. Yes, different cases perform differently... as will different components in them also change performance.

In my opinion that's what real life testing is all about.

And the reason I like what tw33k is doing.

You can't just add a variable (a case) and call it "real world" testing, cause it's only going to be real for the test system. By relying on effective case cooling for this test you are leaving it up to every other user out there to assure themselves that their case cooling is equally effective. That's alright if you agree that it's everyone's own responsibility to ensure they have effective case cooling, but this is not a great way to help anyone make a purchase or further any debate on CLC vs AIR---the debate here in this thread becomes CLC vs AIR-in-a-nice-case-with-lots-of-fans.

Now if tw33k's case temp really is only 0.6C above ambient, well OK. That would be good enough for me to consider this a fair test. But then how were the measurements taken? Ambient temp from the wall thermostat, and case temp from a motherboard diode? If so, not good enough. If not, well that's exactly what most newbs out there would look at to evaluate the effectiveness of their cooler based on case temp, so again the test helps only those with a setup similar to the tester's.

Just show the test setup. Hopefully the environment temps are coming from the exact same device.
Edited by samwiches - 5/27/12 at 11:40am
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