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OC'd 7970 Crossfired vs OC'd 670 FTW SLI - Page 2

post #11 of 33
6/18/12 at 5:02pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twitchyzero View Post

dont mean to thread jack as I was contemplating the same comparsion few weeks ago
I have a 670 FTW on the way and I'm hoping to SLI and OC it. Went with the Nvidia because i didn't have a good experience with AMD drivers on legacy cards..and i figure if going CF/SLI AND surround i want to ensure driver support is top notch.
I am not familiar with how memory works in multi-GPU setups. In the scaling/multimonitor benchmark thread on EVGA forums it shows BF3 ultra with AA tipped it over the 2GB VRAM.
http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?&m=1625084&mpage=1
I'm not quite sure how SLI/CF uses memory..does that mean the FTW SLI isn't good enough as one of the 2GB VRAM is being limited or does it distribute the memory bandwidth (not sure if correct term) across each of the two 2GB VRAM...hence having 2+2GB would not be bottlenecked in BF3?
I should mention I intend to run all games on 5760x1080

Was originally going for the 670 FTW's because I was going to build a WC'd FT02, but decided on the TJ07 after looking at the murderbox haha SO MUCH POTENTIAL!

And in terms of the VRAM question, from my take on it, the cards will use the extra VRAM. But I'm not so sure.
But now looking at the wikipedia pages (So take that as you will redface.gif ), the SLI might not use the extra VRAM because of the master/ slave nature of the GPU but CrossfireX will because it doesn't have the same logical structure?

But then saying that, it makes no sense for nVidia to have such terrible Multi-GPU drivers. So that surely can't be right. So I would like to see the result of that question as well!
Sorry to be a lack of help!
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post #12 of 33
6/18/12 at 9:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by twitchyzero View Post

dont mean to thread jack as I was contemplating the same comparsion few weeks ago
I have a 670 FTW on the way and I'm hoping to SLI and OC it. Went with the Nvidia because i didn't have a good experience with AMD drivers on legacy cards..and i figure if going CF/SLI AND surround i want to ensure driver support is top notch.
I am not familiar with how memory works in multi-GPU setups. In the scaling/multimonitor benchmark thread on EVGA forums it shows BF3 ultra with AA tipped it over the 2GB VRAM.
http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?&m=1625084&mpage=1
I'm not quite sure how SLI/CF uses memory..does that mean the FTW SLI isn't good enough as one of the 2GB VRAM is being limited or does it distribute the memory bandwidth (not sure if correct term) across each of the two 2GB VRAM...hence having 2+2GB would not be bottlenecked in BF3?
I should mention I intend to run all games on 5760x1080

At 5760 x 1080 you should have no problems with BF3 at Ultra 2X MSAA on GTX 670 2GB SLI. At 4x MSAA you will notice stuttering and frequent drops to below 20 fps. This is because of VRAM shortages. Bandwidth could also be a factor. So take this as a thumb rule. If you experience frame skips or frequent drops to below 20 fps you are VRAM and maybe bandwidth cosntrained . Just drop the AA levels a notch. thumb.gif


http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/05/03/nvidia_geforce_gtx_690_dual_gpu_video_card_review/3

"The first apples-to-apples comparison we wanted to make was to push graphics settings up to 4X MSAA + FXAA. At this setting we do experience what feels like texture or memory swapping, causing slowdowns, choppiness and overall an unplayable gameplay experience on GTX 690 and 680 SLI. It doesn't quite show up in framerates, but it is there when you play the game. We cannot explain the low dip below 30 FPS toward the middle of the graph with the GTX 690. GTX 680 SLI didn't do this, but again neither were playable at this setting to begin with. "
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post #13 of 33
6/20/12 at 2:53pm
If I'm reading this right,

SLI having two 2GB cards and when a game maxed out uses over 2GB VRAM there's going to be bottleneck even if your total VRAM is 2+2GB?
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post #14 of 33
6/20/12 at 4:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by twitchyzero View Post

If I'm reading this right,
SLI having two 2GB cards and when a game maxed out uses over 2GB VRAM there's going to be bottleneck even if your total VRAM is 2+2GB?

No, there's usually a fair amount of headroom, because 'usage' is not really 'usage', it's a measure of the vram 'reserved' by the driver for the application. A 2GB card will easily handle up to 2.5GB 'usage' with most apps, and on some apps up to about 2.8GB before perf starts falling off to any significant degree. This is because many apps will 'reserve' vram far in excess of what is actually needed at that moment, if that vram is sitting there doing nothing.

Also, your understanding is correct. Adding cards in SLI does not expand the memory capacity, because each GPU must have it's own copy of the same data in it's local vram for properly quick access. So while the memory 'amount' is doubled, the data amount is also doubled, so the overall 'capacity' is effectively the same no matter how many cards in SLi you have.

Or, to use an analogy, if you understand how RAID-1 (mirrored array) works, you basically understand how SLI memory capacity works as well thumb.gif.

AMD Crossfire works EXACTLY the same way in this regard. As do multi-GPU cards like the 690, which is 2 x 680 2GB. It's advertised as a 4gb card, but it's effective capacity is still 2GB.
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post #15 of 33
6/20/12 at 4:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom1121 View Post

If you go with AMD, Good luck with the drivers, honestly. And before any one quotes my post telling me there is nothing wrong with AMD's drivers, there is problems with them. Their are with Nvidia as well, but not many as well.

I have not had any issues, and I own crossfire 7970s. I like how you said "Before anyone quotes my post telling me there is nothing wrong", and then didn't follow up the post with any proof or detailed issues you have had, but instead "there is problems with them". If you have proof to help the OP, please do share, but otherwise, this post helped no one.
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post #16 of 33
6/20/12 at 4:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by s0up2up View Post

Hey there OCN,
I know there are probably tonnes of threads out there but didn't feel like thread hijacking or raising a thread up from the dead, so here goes:
So what would perform better? Both will be under water.
Will be running at a resolution of 5760 x 1200.
Cheers in advance for any help given on the above questions guys & gals wink.gif,
Really appreciate it,
s0up2up.
Go with GTX 670 4gb. The GTX 690 is very comparable to GTX 670 SLI.
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/53901-nvidia-geforce-gtx-690-review-19.html
^ 680 SLI and the GTX 690 beat CF 7970 in EVERY benchmark. Save yourself the headachers of registry hacking to disable ULPS and go with Nvidia. thumb.gif
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post #17 of 33
6/20/12 at 4:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benchmarksli View Post

Go with GTX 670 4gb. The GTX 690 is very comparable to GTX 670 SLI.
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/53901-nvidia-geforce-gtx-690-review-19.html
^ 680 SLI and the GTX 690 beat CF 7970 in EVERY benchmark. Save yourself the headachers of registry hacking to disable ULPS and go with Nvidia. thumb.gif

It really should be noted that:
  1. That claim is false on it's face, as the 7970's win big in Shogun, and in Metro at 1600p res. And on a side note, most sites on the web don't show Kepler beating Tahiti at DX:HR, nor it even being CLOSE in Metro. Kepler, in fact, blows at Metro compared to Tahiti. Although it maybe depends where in the game you bench.
  2. It really would not be at all difficult to simply pick a different suite of games to benchmark that would show the 7970 to be similarly dominant. Take out five of the games that like Kepler and instead use AvP, Stalker CoP, Alan Wake, Crysis/WH, and Dirt Showdown instead, and a very different picture would emerge wink.gif
  3. The 7970 is clocked at 925MHz, the 680 at (typically) around 1100MHz, yet both cards will generally OC to somewhere around 1250MHz. This means the 7970 has 35% OC'ing headroom, and the 680 around 13.5% OC'ing headroom. So don't forget to adjust the numbers accordingly if you're an OC'er thumb.gif
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post #18 of 33
6/20/12 at 7:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by brettjv View Post

It really should be noted that:
  1. That claim is false on it's face, as the 7970's win big in Shogun, and in Metro at 1600p res. And on a side note, most sites on the web don't show Kepler beating Tahiti at DX:HR, nor it even being CLOSE in Metro. Kepler, in fact, blows at Metro compared to Tahiti. Although it maybe depends where in the game you bench.
  2. It really would not be at all difficult to simply pick a different suite of games to benchmark that would show the 7970 to be similarly dominant. Take out five of the games that like Kepler and instead use AvP, Stalker CoP, Alan Wake, Crysis/WH, and Dirt Showdown instead, and a very different picture would emerge wink.gif
  3. The 7970 is clocked at 925MHz, the 680 at (typically) around 1100MHz, yet both cards will generally OC to somewhere around 1250MHz. This means the 7970 has 35% OC'ing headroom, and the 680 around 13.5% OC'ing headroom. So don't forget to adjust the numbers accordingly if you're an OC'er thumb.gif
I'm not sure where you see it winning BIIIG in metro. I've ran both cards in my system, and while the hd 7970 gets more fps in benchmarks, the gameplay experience is the SAME. They both suck at 2560x. thumb.gif
309
309

Quote:
And on a side note, most sites on the web don't show Kepler beating Tahiti at DX:HR
It wins Deus Ex in single card, but gets STOMPED in dual card config.
503
505
Quote:
3.The 7970 is clocked at 925MHz, the 680 at (typically) around 1100MHz, yet both cards will generally OC to somewhere around 1250MHz. This means the 7970 has 35% OC'ing headroom, and the 680 around 13.5% OC'ing headroom. So don't forget to adjust the numbers accordingly if you're an OC'er
The average I've seen on non pre-overclocked cards is 1084, not 1100.rolleyes.gif I've owned 7 different 680's btw...
Edited by Benchmarksli - 6/20/12 at 7:11pm
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post #19 of 33
6/20/12 at 7:13pm
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Definitely 7970's, you will not be disappointed.
- chmodlabs
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post #20 of 33
6/20/12 at 8:43pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benchmarksli View Post

I'm not sure where you see it winning BIIIG in metro. I've ran both cards in my system, and while the hd 7970 gets more fps in benchmarks, the gameplay experience is the SAME. They both suck at 2560x. thumb.gif
Quote:
3.The 7970 is clocked at 925MHz, the 680 at (typically) around 1100MHz, yet both cards will generally OC to somewhere around 1250MHz. This means the 7970 has 35% OC'ing headroom, and the 680 around 13.5% OC'ing headroom. So don't forget to adjust the numbers accordingly if you're an OC'er
The average I've seen on non pre-overclocked cards is 1084, not 1100.rolleyes.gif I've owned 7 different 680's btw...

Yeah for extreme resolutions they both suck.
But the benchmarks quoted they are running stock clocks, and we all know how they go for the majority of it all. Wait for OC'd Crossfired Benchs. Especially with the new 12.6 Beta drivers and you will see that it will troll over the 680 SLI.

Also why in hell have you owned 7 680's? Were you personally trying to disprove the early supply issues that nVidia had?
Quote:
Originally Posted by chmodlabs View Post

Definitely 7970's, you will not be disappointed.
- chmodlabs

And looks like this will be what I will be going with.
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