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[USAToday]'Battlefield 3' Premium tops 800,000 within first 2 weeks - Page 12  

post #111 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert03570k View Post

You retroactively edited your post to counter the point I brought up about what you said.
Every time I have mentioned the fact that Battlefield 2 rates higher in polls with both gamers and reviewers, I get the same excuses for why its not a "valid" result. There aren't enough votes. There are too many. The poll only reflects what was out at the time.
The fact is again, that if Battlefield 3 was satisfying its player base more than or even approaching the degree to which Battlefield 2 did, it shouldn't be rated nearly a full point out of ten less by gamers and reviewers in various online polls and collections of polls. And if multiple game site polls of both reviewers and gamers are not enough to host an argument, your own reasoning isn't either.
If Battlefield 3 really is going in the right direction according to its players, why do its players rate it lower than prior games in multiple polls?
Where are we going to get a better reflection of gamer opinion about the quality of the game than how they rate it in polls of gamers?
Battlefield 2 is rated the superior game by both critics and gamers, with the actual evidence that is available (not your opinion-reinforcing logic). And there is more to a game than map desgn. I personally never enjoyed the close quarters maps as much as the large scale battles like in Oman, Dalian Plant, Dragon Valley, and Kubra Dam.

It is actually subjective my favorite bf game remains 1942 and yet that got a lower score than bf2 and bf3; so what do I give a damn what gamespot polls say. Bf2 had alot of problems, I would say more than bf3. Terrible hit detection, overpowered air vehicles to the max with no real counter, unbalanced guns and classes, nade spam, dolphin diving, connection issues etc. Yet I still enjoyed the game. Also good luck finding a big map server on bf2, it was always 24/7 karkand.

I remember the upcry when bf2 had no ships and large vehicle centric maps compared to bf1942. If you think bf2 maps were large and vehicle centric you have not play operation aberdeen, coral sea, battle of britain etc. Hit detection for all games was bad, but bf3 has the best hit detection in the series hands down. I do not like CQC either but there is still armored kill which will be very vehicle centric.

Also bf3 is tactical and involves alot of teamwork; things such as the soflam, mav, citv station, spawn beacon. The problem is people cannot use these assets properly so they complain there is no teamwork.
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post #112 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert03570k View Post

You retroactively edited your post to counter the point I brought up about what you said.
Every time I mention the fact that Battlefield 2 rates higher in polls with both gamers and reviewers, I get the same excuses for why its not a "valid" result. There aren't enough votes. There are too many. The poll only reflects what was out at the time.

Uh, what? "Every time"? We've only discussed this the once with each other......"retroactively" edited my posts? Care to explain what you mean by that, because I can print screen the edit history of my posts for all to see right now if you so desire.

As I said, a gamespot poll really isn't hard evidence about anything. Especially with the trolling people do in user reviews that weren't all the rage seven years ago.

Or should I bring up Diablo 3s 3.9 rating on metacritic and attempt to use that as an argument to "prove" why someone elses opinion on whether D2 or D3 was "superior" is the correct opinion to have?
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post #113 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert03570k View Post

I completely disagree with your conclusion re: nothing much has changed in the series except that they're catering more to what their playerbase wants most. Don't you realize that is as subjective an opinion as you just commented about me making?
And it kind of depends on how you define "playerbase." BF3's goal was to win over players from COD... so if they designed the game to be more simplistic (as I think they rather indisputably have) compared to Battlefield 2, then the new player base they've won over from COD may well obviously prefer this new style of gameplay.
However, I don't quite see how you can make the assertion that they are catering to what their players want most.
Here is a poll from Gamespot about Battlefield 2:
The game has a 9.2 user score (9.3 editor score) with 27,423 votes. That's a lot of people who really were satisfied with and loved Battlefield 2.
http://www.gamespot.com/battlefield-2/
Battlefield 3 on the other hand has a user score of only only 8.4 (8.5 editor score) out of 4,484 votes.
http://www.gamespot.com/battlefield-3/reviews/battlefield-3-review-6342248/
It's pretty clear from this what both the gaming community and reviewer community think about both games (and these numbers are reflected elsewhere, on metacritic et al).
Battlefield 2 was the superior game. The main reason Battlefield 3's release was such a big deal was because it was the sequel to Battlefield 2.
I don't know where you get the idea (besides your own logic and opinon) that BF3 has better satisfied its player base, but from the evidence available here it would seem that is quite not the case.
Battlefield 2 is rated the superior game in multiple venues by both critics AND gamers.

All his comments were factual if you ask me, and I haven't played the game so I'm looking at this like Switzerland.

But I do like how you are using a GameSpot poll, a hardly worthwhile polling site, to judge your full conclusion on it.

Just like teachers, even in high school and middle school would say, 1 source isn't enough information to base your work on. If you give me 2-3 more and they seem relatively comparable to what I'm seeing, then I have no choice but to agree.
post #114 of 137
800,000 is a good amount of sales, but in the bigger picture it's a horrible number compared to how many the actual game sold. I saw the update about CQ and figured I would start up BF3 again finally, just to realize that I had to pay another $50 for the same game. Screw that.

BF3 and CoD are the same now. Both money grabbing while the basic game still sits broken. As much as I hate CoD, I still play Black Ops over BF3.
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post #115 of 137
People need to stop comparing BF3 to COD, they aren't the same game at all.
    
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post #116 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by sausageson View Post

It is actually subjective my favorite bf game remains 1942 and yet that got a lower score than bf2 and bf3; so what do I give a damn what gamespot polls say. Bf2 had alot of problems, I would say more than bf3. Terrible hit detection, overpowered air vehicles to the max with no real counter, unbalanced guns and classes, nade spam, dolphin diving, connection issues etc. Yet I still enjoyed the game. Also good luck finding a big map server on bf2, it was always 24/7 karkand.
I remember the upcry when bf2 had no ships and large vehicle centric maps compared to bf1942. If you think bf2 maps were large and vehicle centric you have not play operation aberdeen, coral sea, battle of britain etc. Hit detection for all games was bad, but bf3 has the best hit detection in the series hands down. I do not like CQC either but there is still armored kill which will be very vehicle centric.
Also bf3 is tactical and involves alot of teamwork; things such as the soflam, mav, citv station, spawn beacon. The problem is people cannot use these assets properly so they complain there is no teamwork.

We're talking about what the community at large thinks, and the best evidence for that is reflected in multiple polls of many actual gamers who gave the opinion. Unless you have a better way of determining what the gaming community thinks.
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post #117 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogon View Post

All his comments were factual if you ask me, and I haven't played the game so I'm looking at this like Switzerland.
But I do like how you are using a GameSpot poll, a hardly worthwhile polling site, to judge your full conclusion on it.
Just like teachers, even in high school and middle school would say, 1 source isn't enough information to base your work on. If you give me 2-3 more and they seem relatively comparable to what I'm seeing, then I have no choice but to agree.

You guys can look these up yourselves, and I already did cite more than one source (and one which answers the other poster's objection about "too many votes vs. too few") with metacritic. But here are a few more sites with both reviewer scores and user polls.




Metacritic:


Battlefield 2:

Reviewers Score: 91.

Users Score: 8.3 out of 441 ratings



Battlefield 3:

Reviewer score: 89

User score: 7.3 out of 3,176 ratings.


http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/battlefield-2






Still yet another source:


Battlefield 2:

Reviewer score: 9.3

User score: 9.2 out of 2,768 votes


Battlefield 3:

Reviewer score (n/a, 9.6 with some aggregation from other sites but unlikely as comprehensive as metacritic

User score: 7.5 out of 19 votes


http://www.strategyinformer.com/pc/battlefield2/reviews.html





Same thing holds true across multiple sites, Battlefield 3 scores notably lower than 2 in both reviewer and user polls, and does so whether it has more votes than BF3, or less votes. This should be enough to give a solid impression of the opinion of the reviewer and gamer community about which is the better game. And if the direction in which they're going is so right-on, BF3 should rate at least equal to 2, which it does not.
Edited by Robert03570k - 7/1/12 at 2:02pm
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post #118 of 137
*sigh* Again with the meta critic?

Do you want me to post the Diablo 3 metacritic user score of 3.9 so you can explain why the huge increase in trolling within user reviews since 2005 somehow doesn't affect the accuracy of the results?

You're also comparing polls where one poll has 2.7k votes and one has 19?

You dont really seem to have a handle of statistics or reliability of said statistics.
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post #119 of 137
So what are we arguing about?
    
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post #120 of 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzleBoy View Post

*sigh* Again with the meta critic?
Do you want me to post the Diablo 3 metacritic user score of 3.9 so you can explain why the huge increase in trolling within user reviews since 2005 somehow doesn't affect the accuracy of the results?
You're also comparing polls where one poll has 2.7k votes and one has 19?
You dont really seem to have a handle of statistics or reliability of said statistics.

Why don't you go reread what is written and what is being discussed.


The question is, what is the community (and reviewer) opinion of Battlefield 2 and 3?

I cited several polls, all of which are consistent with each other in terms of which game rates higher.


As I said, if you have a better source of evidence, let's see it.


Otherwise, you're not furthering the discussion.
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