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Does a hard drive weigh more when full..? - Page 19

post #181 of 190
Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Vanelay View Post

It's impossible for all particles to be stopped because of it. I never looked into it; my dad took quantum physics in university, and he told me that.

Great credibility reference there. Its still incorrect, as to Duckie and I trying to explain it to you.
 
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post #182 of 190
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindrage606 View Post

A HDD enclosure is vacuumed shut upon factory, which is more relevant than a one that is not in this discussion.
True vacuums don't exist.

Quote:
Great credibility reference there. Its still incorrect, as to Duckie and I trying to explain it to you.
This is a thread labelled Does a hard drive weigh more full; why would I care about credibility. I later provided an explanation from wikipedia; could someone explain to me why that explanation was false? It proved the relation between ground state and the uncertainty principle through math.
Edited by Art Vanelay - 7/10/12 at 4:27pm
post #183 of 190
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindrage606 View Post

A HDD enclosure is vacuumed shut upon factory, which is more relevant than a one that is not in this discussion.

But but..... Why does a HDD have a breathing hole? It's not vaccumed huh
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post #184 of 190
What an interesting read this has been. thumb.gif
post #185 of 190
Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Vanelay View Post

You cite the sources that Wikipedia lists.

And we go full circle thumb.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

Quote:
Can you cite Wikipedia when submitting research papers in college (honest question, never been to college)?
nope lol

thumb.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindrage606 View Post

A HDD enclosure is vacuumed shut upon factory, which is more relevant than a one that is not in this discussion.
And also to 1 rep-wiki scholars, law of conservation of mass is not in any form dependent upon a closed system. thumb.gif
(i.e. burning a match does not equate to net loss weight but merely the carbon mass is dissipated through the atmosphere and heat.)

HDD Enclosures are not "vacuumed shut"(hermetically sealed) when leaving the factory.

They're not hermetically sealed at all, I forget the exact reason, but something about the equalization of the atmospheres during spin-up/down/preventing excess heat build-up/repair-ability/something something dark side.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomfix View Post

But but..... Why does a HDD have a breathing hole? It's not vaccumed huh

The little gerbils in there need air to breath to keep those platters rotating lachen.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Vanelay View Post

True vacuums don't exist.
Quote:
Great credibility reference there. Its still incorrect, as to Duckie and I trying to explain it to you.
This is a thread labelled Does a hard drive weigh more full; why would I care about credibility. I later provided an explanation from wikipedia; could someone explain to me why that explanation was false? It proved the relation between ground state and the uncertainty principle through math.

Some credence during a semi-academic discussion?

I don't know about you, but I don't understand squat about advanced math, and some times analogies fall flat.
Edited by Nocturin - 7/10/12 at 4:32pm
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post #186 of 190
Electricity does have a mass.
Data is transferred in ones and zeros as an electrical pulses.
So , according to this electricity moving from one particle to another means mass moving.
But the same atoms can probably hold the same number of electrons on its last orbital.
So , i think the part about the moving electrons , the mass may change so fast , but it stays constant.

Of course here we are not talking only about hard drives , here we are talking about anything that has an electric current in it.
How data is saved in hard disk is not the same like in system memory RAM, it is saved in a different way, but the data as an electric current is still moving in and out.

Any way the question that you are asking for the way we think you understand it has this answer : no noticeable weight difference on any of the normal life levels.
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post #187 of 190
post #188 of 190
Some of you people must be kidding. My Norco RPC-4224 didn't weigh much when I racked it after it first arrived, 6 months later, I'd put 40TB of data on it and it practically gave me a hernia lifting it out. This data stuff is heavvvvy.
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post #189 of 190
Quote:
Originally Posted by xbowtiekillax View Post

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WaUzu-iksi8 this answers everything

This video is also on the very first page of this thread.
post #190 of 190
Quote:
Data stored on the disk do not change it's mass.

Bit's are stored by changing magnetisation of small grains in the
recording medium.
http://www.tvhandbook.com/support/pdf_files/audio/Chapter6_1.pdf

This is the same process (on microscopic scale) as magnetising a needle by
rubbing it with a permanent magnet. The process does not adds or removes mass
to or from the object.

Since you asked to include even the smallest changes in mass, we
need to consider the energy content of empty vs full disk. Increase
in energy by amount E will increase it's mass by amount E/ (c * c) - a
very small amount.

The writing of the disk requires energy, but that energy is not stored.
Magnetisation of the grain is a bistable system
http://www-civ.eng.cam.ac.uk/dsl/Bistable_actuation/main_project_page.html
Writing a bit is similar to rolling a stone up the hill, across the top,
from one valley to another. So, energy delivered on the way up is
returned on the way down. So far answer is still: Enefgy content is
not changed.
However, some of that energy will be dissipated as heat. Immediately
after recording, disk will be warmer and therefore heavier (not in a
measurable way). But that temperature rise will equilibrate to
enviroment - so that change is not permanent.

Finally, there is an interaction of magnetic moments with each other
and with external magnetic field ( e.g. Earth magnetism).

Each magnetic dipole (a grain seen as small permanent magnet) has energy
which depends on orientation of the dipole relative to external field.
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/magnetic/magpot.html

By writing on the disk, the total number if dipoles on one direction,
(let's say) pointing North, changes. However, number depends on the pattern
written, and empty disk has a pattern written on it when disk is formated.

So, this very small change depends on the data, and also on the orientation of
the whole disk as a unit. Becouse of this last fact (dependence on the
orientation of the object) I would summarise answer as follow:

Writing the data on the hard disk may change (increase or decrease)
total magnetic moment of the unit. That does not changes the mass of
the unit.
However, orientation of the unit in external magnetic field will effect total
energy of the unit. If we include mass equivalent of that energy in the term
'mass of the unit', that quantity may go up or down as a result of recording or
erasing (reformating the disk) of the data.

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=442528
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