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Arch, FreeBSD, or Similar?

post #1 of 63
7/21/12 at 10:09am
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Hey all -

Along with my first IT / SysAdmin job, I finally have the time, resources, and ability to make my first foray into UNIX structures. I'm familiar with only a few commands ( I mean... a few, fdisk, sudo make-me-a-sammich, etc). To that end, I'm looking for a stripped down, unbloated UNIX OS to start studying. My Brother has long been an advocated of FreeBSD - but I have my reservations. A friend of mine recommends Arch, but there are a few issues there as well. And then there may be some others that I have not yet seen. I'm not enamored by going into super mainstream Linux like Fedora or Ubuntu, because I want to learn by being tossed headfirst into CLI and ground-up a machine, not have to reverse engineer a complex, existing system.

Now, this is coming from a guy who's never used UNIX, so I may be wrong, but here are my current perceptions:

FreeBSD:
- "Purist" Variant - Least Associated with "Linux," but accordingly small desktop userbase.
- Lags behind Linux in Driver Support for Mainstream Hardware
- Little to No Support for Non-Mainstream Hardware
- Not as many conveniences as Linux (My Brother's FreeBSD can't auto-mount USB keys....)
- "Fringe" or "Niche," may not provide desired relevancy to my IT career other than in the Server industry.

ArchLinux:
- Among the most well documented Linux Versions out there.
- Relatively user friendly (however, the people on the forums are dicks)
- Closest to BSD in its "Purity" while still being Linux.
- Doesn't come with a lot of built in bloat - heavy use of pacman necessary
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post #2 of 63
7/21/12 at 2:11pm
I'm not 100% here but I don't think even the Arch guys claim that Arch is "purist" in UNIX mentality. Last I heard Slackware was.

If you're building/configuring your own server base or want to be "forced to learn" I'd assume you'd start from the Gentoo, LFS, Slackware, and Arch base.
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post #3 of 63
7/21/12 at 2:26pm
RH/CentOS are going to be more towards standards. When building a server it isn't exactly about purity, more about stability. The rock hard distributions are where you are going to want to learn... RH, CentOS, Debian, and possibly the BSD variants. You won't see much else in the server world, occasionally Gentoo/Slackware but I wouldn't really make a mission critical (business) server from anything else.

[edit] I should say, if you just want to learn linux go with whatever you feel most comfortable with. You can take any distribution and manually install packages, some require more some require less setup too. In the end, it's not really how much you set up but more towards how often you do those types of tasks. I build custom packages for any distro regularly, even if it comes with a version that's acceptable.

I'm currently testing arch, even though the nvidia drivers worked I wanted the beta drivers. I had to go get my own packages made as well as lib32-nvidia-utils, so everything works. I'd do the same on Debian/Ubuntu, Fedora, you name it. I do this for my own reasons but it also helps me keep in touch with the more annoying (advanced) things to do. wink.gif
Edited by mushroomboy - 7/21/12 at 2:34pm
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post #4 of 63
7/21/12 at 4:15pm
  • Shrak
  • (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
If you do decide to test Arch, I made a guide to get people started a short while ago;
http://www.overclock.net/a/how-to-install-archlinux-the-easy-quick-and-dirt-way


As to the forums, they aren't dicks. You just have to provide the information required. They're all actually relatively wonderful people and very helpful. Just make sure to post threads properly there, while providing the right information asked for, and you have to show that you've tried finding it yourself, and that you are willing to accept help. <- One of the biggest pieves there, as a lot of people come looking for help, but won't take any advice they're given.

And as muchroom said, if you want to learn more for server stuff, then RH/Cent would be the area to start. I run an Arch server and it's been going strong for the past year or so now with no hiccups. So, personally for me a "stable" server just means "ancient", as all my Arch installs are "stable" enough in my eyes.

Other than that it's pretty much personal preference. Slack is nice if you like maintaining every single little detail yourself, resolving your own dependencies, building your own packages and what not. Gentoo is nice as it's a step above that, you get 2 amazing package managers, but still have to do most configuring yourself. Arch a step above Gentoo, the base kernel is already compiled, and pacman is (imo) one of the best package managers out there.

Each will force you to learn and rely on the heavy use of the command line.
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post #5 of 63
7/21/12 at 5:18pm
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I would suggest gentoo, arch, debian 'netinstall' (the others are mostly with guis and that) freebsd, or slackware. As far as I know the most 'UNIX' ones are slackware and freebsd (which complies with unix standerds and is a durect decendent from at&t unix) but arch is close. Debian is good to learn about linux as a ton of other distros (buntu, mint, etc.) are based on it but isnt very 'unix-like' if your looking for that kind of thing. Gentoo, well, gentoo is gentoo. Of the ones ive listed gentoo and arch are more on the 'cutting edge' side where as the others tend to test everything to death. Personnlly I use debian, but it depends on your wants/needs in the system. A stage one gentoo tarball might do you good, but if all you want is too learn about unix/unix-like, installing freebsd and reading the handbook is what gave me most of what I know about non linux unix.
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post #6 of 63
7/21/12 at 5:21pm
  • Shrak
  • (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrl1357 View Post

where as the others tend to test everything to death.

They test them far far far past death.
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post #7 of 63
7/21/12 at 6:32pm
Greetz
It is absolutely untrue that Arch is "the most BSD-like" distribution. While there are subtle differences between distros by far the greatest single difference is how packages are handled - the package Management system. Traditionally BSD does not try to handle package dependencies automatically as a function of package management. Almost all Linux distros do including Arch. The only one that comes default w/o such an intrusive and pervasive packaging system is Slackware.

Patrick Volkerding, the original and still inventor/controller of Slackware, freely admits that he literally copied the BSD package system for Slackware. Even the evolution of Slackbuild scripts has still not broken with the fundamental dedication to user managed dependencies. If it is a BSD-like system with Linux driver support you want, then Slackware is the only game in town.
Slackware thumb.gif
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post #8 of 63
7/21/12 at 6:50pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrak View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrl1357 View Post

where as the others tend to test everything to death.

They test them far far far past death.

Linux 2.6! Thats my style biggrin.gif (debian stable user here) even testing is outdated (or stabler wink.gif ) by arch standards
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post #9 of 63
7/21/12 at 6:59pm
  • Shrak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrl1357 View Post

Linux 2.6! Thats my style biggrin.gif (debian stable user here) even testing is outdated (or stabler wink.gif ) by arch standards

You;

caveman.jpg

Me;

tron-legacy-coloring-pages-19.jpg
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post #10 of 63
7/21/12 at 8:36pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrak View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrl1357 View Post

Linux 2.6! Thats my style biggrin.gif (debian stable user here) even testing is outdated (or stabler wink.gif ) by arch standards

You;
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
caveman.jpg

Me;
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
tron-legacy-coloring-pages-19.jpg


You:

coloring-page-falling-dl11657.jpg

Me:

z-easter-island-head.jpg

o yeah rock soild (get it?)

To each his own
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