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[Softpedia] AMD’s Vishera Piledriver FX 8320 and FX 8300 8-Core Processors Revealed (Piledriver expected to launch/enter production in Q3 2012) - Page 15  

post #141 of 312
I don't think any of this is off topic, everyone's being pretty respectful and making half-decent points (although some are repeating obvious information we already know). We know the 8350 will need all of its 8 cores used, we should rather compare the 8350 as a quad core with an extra integer core, after all, did you guys know that bulldozer's die is 20% bigger @ 32nm than a 32nm sandy bridge die? Interesting, they start off at 50% behind in single threaded peformance, and when using 5-8 threads vs the more "logical" hyperthreading when comparing thread usage 5-8 the 2600k can get up to a 40% boost while AMD's SMT is making up the 50% differance behind in single threading and then leveling out to match a 2500k with all 8 threads used I don't know if my math is bad and way off based but it looks like AMD found a way to match Intel on threads 5-8 and get their scaling there, to a point that their next release will almost very closely match a 2600k.

I forsee no brand new platform builds on the piledriver, none whatsoever because AM3 is going to be dead, just about everyone with an existing AM3 board is going to get piledriver, at least by the time steamroller is released and piledriver is uber cheap. I love the idea that I got a 1045t @ $100.00 at microcenter and got it to 4 GHz (amd X6). I love the idea that I can pop in the piledriver chip for extra life before I sell the platform and go Haswell-E when I have more money saved up. What I don't love is the selling of my 750 Watt Power Supply just to buy the 1000 watt power supply that I'll find myself needing just to run the FX-8350 @ 5 GHz thanks to AMD's Resonant Clock Mesh (which will suck the same power as a Bulldozer @ 4.6 GHz which I hear is topping the 500 Watts meter and slightly above, that's so bad that this now $100.00 platform advantage is ruined because what people don't understand is that 750 watts to 1000 watts power supply is a $30.00 difference if you wanna try a Kingwin 1000 watt 80 plus bronze certified @ microcenter.com.

The 2600k is $239.99 @ microcenter.com, the 8350 for $199.99 and thats -$40.00, the motherboard pricing is probably -$30.00, the power supply pricing is at least +$30.00 because we know that piledriver wants an extra 200 watt load which is about $30.00 more on the power supply. Extra 200-250 Watt load usage over 8 hours a day of battlefield 3 and the wife will complain about why our power bill is now $10.00 more a month than when we last had our slower intel system or prior AMD Thuban system running. It's like that.

That $40.00 platform savings we're all talking about is gone in 5-6 months @ 200 extra Watts per hour @ $8.00 more a month on our power bill. That's where we are.

10% higher clocks means 5% more performance in OC Scaling

Piledriver has at least 15% higher IPC, cache never did anything for min fps not even 1% boost as far as I remember (not sure if this fact changed in the last 10 years, i.e. celeron and sempron vs p4 and athlon in the old days)

Most people here already reviewed the toms article on the piledriver APUs clock for clock being 15% faster, 10% higher clocks means 5% boost. Piledriver will be a 20-22% jump based on a more mature process and other unforseen factors, but at minimum will be 20% faster. Those already on watercooling will not see higher clocks at all perhaps, as the power saving feature will just get people from 4.6 GHz to 5.0 GHz more easily I doubt it will get people from 5.0 GHz to 5.5 GHz more easily I'm not sure where the benefits of resonant clock mesh technology will end as my obvious fear is that it can't help achieving higher max OCs they'll have the same max OC as before but just help people with cheaper air coolers clock 10% higher before thermals really are an issue, right?

We're all pretty interested in the new piledriver whether we buy it or not we all like to see the benchmarks either to justify our intel purchase or to see AMD gain ground. Looks like at least for Gaming AMD will come within 20% of the 2600k there's a sweclockers.com minimum fps slide most of us have seen in battlefield 3 64 players in multiplayer, where the 2600k is 40% ahead of the 8150 with all 8 threads used, now we'll be within 20% of the 2600k. Hmm, why does this sound so bad, how FPU intensive is gaming really? My thoughts were that the FPU is about 50% utilized with 4 integer cores/threads in use and the other 4 integer cores/threads use up the other 50% maybe the numbers are far more FPU intensive than that I don't know how much AMD can really scale this platform for gamers, what am I missing? Just how FPU intensive is Games and how far can AMD go with this if FPU bottlenecks are even an issue? Someone care to explain games and FPU I'm pretty new there.

Anyway, I'm buying piledriver just so you all know, but only when its like $150.00 because I already have socket AM3+ but would never in a million years save $40.00 in platform cost just to go AMD, silly, did ya'll forget the $30.00 loss when you go AMD because suddenly you need 250 Watts more on the PSU just to handle an overclocked piledriver/bulldozer vs SB/IB??

**EDIT** I meant I am not going to be building any new AMD platforms if the savings falls short of $100.00, so far on thuban x6 I am not buying an insanely expensive power supply yet and my platform savings really was closer to $100.00 and in a 64 player server my minimum fps is the same as that of a 2500k (as shown on sweclockers.com minimum fps 64 player slides) so yeah $99.99 1045t vs $160.00 2500k - $40.00 off mobo and very similar power supply maybe a little less than $100.00 savings but bulldozer and piledriver will cut the platform savings to more like $50.00 people don't seem to understand the need for beefy/expensive power supplies just to have bulldozer/piledriver. I haven't seen that much mention of that! (and the extra $7.00 to $10.00 a month on power. So that $50.00 platform savings and -30% single threaded performance just to get closer to matching SB Multi performance seems lame. I guess all of us are dreaming toward the high end and we should really just drop the performance argument and let people go with a FX-4100 cuz somehow Intel just doesn't care to compete down that low $100.00 and under?
Edited by Kancel21 - 7/24/12 at 12:37pm
post #142 of 312
I would imagine the FX-6300 will probably be in the $160 range, and the FX-4300 should be below $150. I'm definitely looking into the FX-6300 as my future CPU.
    
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post #143 of 312
why on earth would you buy anything other than an AMD Thuban X6 1045t for $99.99 at microcenter stores (check microcenter.com) and you must do a store pickup to get that price? Makes any other choice look very silly, people also forget the 15% boost in minimum fps when you overclock northbridge from 2.0 GHz to 2.6 GHz or higher, I think the northbridge on bulldozer Arch is already at 2.6 GHz is it not? So overclocking Northbridge from 2.6 GHz to 2.8 GHz is like a 3% difference.

"Google" "Importance of Northbridge overclocking minimum fps"

15% vs 3% northbridge minimum fps overclock scaling meaning get thuban while you still can, its faster, microcenter *BARELY* has any thubans left they are selling like hotcakes for poor people right now $99.99 and matching the 2500k in only 1 situation that I care for, minimum fps on a 64 player multiplayer server in BF3 with all 6 threads used is virtually identical between thuban x6 and intel 2500k when the northbridge is properly overclocked from 2 GHz to 2.6-3 GHz
post #144 of 312
http://www.microcenter.com/specials/promotions/AMDbundlePROMO.html

Free mobo or get the Gigabyte motherboard for a little bit extra. The gigabyte board I think has the 6 + 2 phase design delivering cleaner power and all the other asus / asrock / cheap mini ATX boards don't have. Wouldn't get the free mobos cuz they are mini-ATX with no VRM cooling you can't even overclock on stock voltage without throttling so just remember free mobo = 0 overclocking, recommend either that slightly more expensive asus board or if you really care the extra $10.00 gets you that gigabyte board with somewhat better power delivery (rumored slightly less vcore is needed on the cpu when overclocking)

I got 1.325 Volts @ 4050 MHz on my 1045t on the gigabyte 970-A-UD3 board in that Microcenter AMD promo. 1.3 Volts is stock. I can do 4 GHz on stock voltage and 1.325 @ 4050 MHz so if the motherboard has anything to do it get the 970-A-UD3 same as 990 boards but without SLI?
post #145 of 312
I hope they really get the power usage under control. I loved my 48 core Opteron folding system and would love to build another one based on the newer design. The new server cpu's (Intel or AMD) still cant beat Opterons in watt per $$ or performance at folding.
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post #146 of 312
Not everyone has a Microcenter nearby, so it's not an option for everyone. Actually, for the vast majority of people, Microcenter is not an option, and with the Microcenter in Santa Clara closing down, the number of people that do have access is going to drop significantly.
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post #147 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kancel21 View Post

http://www.microcenter.com/specials/promotions/AMDbundlePROMO.html
Free mobo or get the Gigabyte motherboard for a little bit extra. The gigabyte board I think has the 6 + 2 phase design delivering cleaner power and all the other asus / asrock / cheap mini ATX boards don't have. Wouldn't get the free mobos cuz they are mini-ATX with no VRM cooling you can't even overclock on stock voltage without throttling so just remember free mobo = 0 overclocking, recommend either that slightly more expensive asus board or if you really care the extra $10.00 gets you that gigabyte board with somewhat better power delivery (rumored slightly less vcore is needed on the cpu when overclocking)
I got 1.325 Volts @ 4050 MHz on my 1045t on the gigabyte 970-A-UD3 board in that Microcenter AMD promo. 1.3 Volts is stock. I can do 4 GHz on stock voltage and 1.325 @ 4050 MHz so if the motherboard has anything to do it get the 970-A-UD3 same as 990 boards but without SLI?

I would rather spend an extra $69 and get a 2500K deal, but that's just me.

My reasoning is, I'd rather buy the best at the time, to last me a few years, since I don't upgade every gen.

An extra $70 over the long term pays for itself.

I did the same thing in the Athlon days as well, back then, Intel wasn't even an option.
Edited by 2010rig - 7/24/12 at 3:16pm
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post #148 of 312
As I've said multiple times, I won't be upgrading to Vishera no matter how good it is, my X6 still kicks plenty of ass, even after going strong after some nice 2 years and almost a half.

And considering I paid €200 for it on launch day, it will need to hold itself for at least another year and a half, provided the board doesn't die thumb.gif
   
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post #149 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post


As I've said multiple times, I won't be upgrading to Vishera no matter how good it is, my X6 still kicks plenty of ass, even after going strong after some nice 2 years and almost a half.
And considering I paid €200 for it on launch day, it will need to hold itself for at least another year and a half, provided the board doesn't die thumb.gif
I still can't see anyone buying a BD chip if they already have a Phenom II,unless they can afford to tinker,then by all means go ahead lol.
I didn't know you could modify the turbo clock if the base core clocks were changed,can the X6's do a turbo up to 3.8-4GHz? I'm still going to hold onto my X6 until SR, unless PD is a worthwhile improvement in power consumption.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kancel21 View Post

http://www.microcenter.com/specials/promotions/AMDbundlePROMO.html
Free mobo or get the Gigabyte motherboard for a little bit extra. The gigabyte board I think has the 6 + 2 phase design delivering cleaner power and all the other asus / asrock / cheap mini ATX boards don't have. Wouldn't get the free mobos cuz they are mini-ATX with no VRM cooling you can't even overclock on stock voltage without throttling so just remember free mobo = 0 overclocking, recommend either that slightly more expensive asus board or if you really care the extra $10.00 gets you that gigabyte board with somewhat better power delivery (rumored slightly less vcore is needed on the cpu when overclocking)
I got 1.325 Volts @ 4050 MHz on my 1045t on the gigabyte 970-A-UD3 board in that Microcenter AMD promo. 1.3 Volts is stock. I can do 4 GHz on stock voltage and 1.325 @ 4050 MHz so if the motherboard has anything to do it get the 970-A-UD3 same as 990 boards but without SLI?
Like others said,not everyone has a MC nearby,all I have in my area is a Best(worst)buy. I only use bestbuy to check out an item first if they even have it at the store,I've been making my PC purchases from newegg for awhile now.
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post #150 of 312
Okay guys. I decided to give it a go with my 2500K. it took about 5 minutes to convert Safe House (1.37GB) at 4.6ghz. I'm gonna give it another go.
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