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post #121 of 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwnedINC View Post

To bad all competitive games rely on all those factors...

how is sc2 affected by dice rolls or gear? also, where are the dice rolls in most fps? yeah guns have a certain amount of recoil but this can be compensated for.

also, even if randomness does play some role in these genres, it is not nearly to the degree it can in mmos. not to mention the relative lack of complexity compared to rts or lack of reflexes compared to fps
post #122 of 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masked View Post

It does because there are STILL plans for D3 to be released on console.
http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/even-if-diablo-iii-comes-to-consoles-starcraft-ii-likely-wont/
And he is not correct because he said:
Which actually isn't true at all.
Diablo 1 released on the PS1 in 1998 and was actually significantly more successful than the PC version...
Consoles have a higher sales rate because they're available to a larger group of consumers thus...Why Blizzard is still developing the console version of D3...
Dude thats what im saying they made some console game in the past and maybe they will PORT Diablo 3 to console, but its still much more optimized for PC , like ALL their other franchise. just like Diablo 1 was. Thats said I was wrong they made some game for console back in the 90s but thats pretty much it. Since then they only made PC exclusive title and im not really convinced about a D3 port for console, seriously just think about it how it would suck to aim or simply talk to a npc without a cursor. Blizzard doesnt care about console, thats why I love this company K thx Bye.
post #123 of 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by perfectblade View Post

mmos dont take skill compared to actual competitive genres rts/fps, yet so many players get this super elitist attitude (maybe because they've invested so much time).
i used to play wow casually and this super serious attitude ruined it for me. and it just seemed out of place in a game where some of the most important factors are: 1. dice rolls 2. strength of build/class 3. gear.
i dont see how researching the best build/playing a lot=skill. i actually like what blizzard is doing in simplifying builds/stats, so the game becomes less about number crunching and hopefully more about actual gameplay

Um....I am sorry but you are wrong. If you had raided Naxx (Vanilla not WotLK) or AQ 40 then you would know that the game used to require a significant amount of skill at that level of the game. The fights were immensely complex and required precision timing. If you were wiping raids and blaming it on RNG then you were with a bad group. The whole point its to have a strategy in place that allows for such events to take place and how to handle them. Most high end (top 50 world) guilds would even say that it wasn't that they were unlucky, it is that they were finding out that they needed to gear up a bit more or that their strategy was inadequate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xoleras View Post

Your opinion sucks. BC was the best expansion that had real challenges and real fun, and much more content.
Nowadays in cataclysm there's only 1 tier of relevant content, the current one. Even heroic raids are ridiculously easy, even keyboard turning morons are clearing heroics now. I preferred BC's linear progression much more, you had A LOT MORE STUFF to do in that game....WoW caters to casual idiots now that log in for 15 minutes a day, I quit playing after cata was released. Cataclysm is a joke and is the worst expac, MoP will be even worse.
I understand TBC and naxx (level 60) were too hard for some people but this is what real MMOs are about - challenges and progression. Overcoming that as a group. TBC may have been hard but the game has gone in the other extreme - its WAY TOO EASY now and there's no reason to play. You can clear heroic dragon soul in 30 minutes, its a joke.
Cataclysm isn't 1/4th the expac that TBC was. I'm guessing you aren't aware of this because you're probably a new player...

You obviously did not read what I said at all because your last statement makes you look like a fool, even when you quoted me. What challenges did BC offer? Magtheridon V1.0 was tough as balls but that is about it. Gruul was a joke, as was TK and Vasjh. Ilidan just required very well geared tanks and a raid with high dps. MH was mind numbingly boring! Wave after wave of boring easy trash followed by an even easier boss. The only part that had a challenge to it was Arch due to the miniscule margin for error. Raid wise and in comparison to other expansions, excluding vanila, yes it was better. Overall, no it was a joke. Pvp was atrocious and that was the expansion that killed the economy. I was able to farm over 5,000 gold per week doing dailies only with two characters. Blizzard even banned me for "exploiting the economy" which was over turned when I petitioned it. Sorry, but no expansion yet has even compared to what the "Vanilla" era of WoW had produced. I hope that MoP is better then previous installments and have heard very promising things about it. Please if you are going to argue someone, pay attention to what they say.

I was in a guild that killed KT in vanilla and a grand marshal. I have killed every raid boss from every expansion, except cata as I quit raiding and that was also when I was preparing for BMT which left little time for gaming. I have been responsible, with fellow guildies, for many nerfs of the game and am part of the reason for the new talent tree design. I am one of those players that abused the hell out of hybrid classes talent trees.
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post #124 of 240
Man I am so excited to see this game come out, can't wait to see how hard it fails. I wonder if it will be worse than D3, I sure hope so. With all the anger at D3/blizz I think a lot will carry over to Pandas. I'm sure there will be lots of updates on WoW subs from various sites. And who is going to play WoWs imba pvp when GW2 comes out? Sure arena players are a small percent but maybe pvpers will completely desert the game.


Conspiray Keanu Corner

Wait wait wait... maybe blizz is sabotaging D3 and WoW so people will play Titan or w/e.... like make the games so horrible but people buy it anyway, then try to redeem themselves with an actual good nonstarcraft game... hmm...

WOAH....
Quote:
Originally Posted by perfectblade View Post

how is sc2 affected by dice rolls or gear? also, where are the dice rolls in most fps? yeah guns have a certain amount of recoil but this can be compensated for.
also, even if randomness does play some role in these genres, it is not nearly to the degree it can in mmos. not to mention the relative lack of complexity compared to rts or lack of reflexes compared to fps

I agree but I wouldnt even argue this point man. I'd just argue that its impossible to balance so many different classes/specs/abilities. FPS is easy to balance because its balanced by nature. Only spawn points and gun vs gun balance really matter. For RTS there are a lot of random/incomplete information, BUT the better player is still going to win most of the time. Its like poker basically while MMO/RPGs are more like rolling dice.

Blizzard didnt care to balance wow arena, I waited and waited but they didnt care. GW2 might be good but I have no idea how they will balance it. I mean warcraft 4 had 4 races and it wasnt exactly balanced in a few matchups, how are you gonna balance 3v3 with 10 classes or w/e it is, plus specs, plus gear. GW2 realizes gear should be standardized for stats (derp derp derp blizzard) and they limited abilities (relative to GW1).

Anyway wow is a joke game because missing a blind for instance is gamebreaking.
Edited by Ploppytheman - 7/29/12 at 11:26am
post #125 of 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ploppytheman View Post

Man I am so excited to see this game come out, can't wait to see how hard it fails. I wonder if it will be worse than D3, I sure hope so. With all the anger at D3/blizz I think a lot will carry over to Pandas. I'm sure there will be lots of updates on WoW subs from various sites. And who is going to play WoWs imba pvp when GW2 comes out? Sure arena players are a small percent but maybe pvpers will completely desert the game.
Conspiray Keanu Corner
Wait wait wait... maybe blizz is sabotaging D3 and WoW so people will play Titan or w/e.... like make the games so horrible but people buy it anyway, then try to redeem themselves with an actual good nonstarcraft game... hmm...
WOAH....
I agree but I wouldnt even argue this point man. I'd just argue that its impossible to balance so many different classes/specs/abilities. FPS is easy to balance because its balanced by nature. Only spawn points and gun vs gun balance really matter. For RTS there are a lot of random/incomplete information, BUT the better player is still going to win most of the time. Its like poker basically while MMO/RPGs are more like rolling dice.
Blizzard didnt care to balance wow arena, I waited and waited but they didnt care. GW2 might be good but I have no idea how they will balance it. I mean warcraft 4 had 4 races and it wasnt exactly balanced in a few matchups, how are you gonna balance 3v3 with 10 classes or w/e it is, plus specs, plus gear. GW2 realizes gear should be standardized for stats (derp derp derp blizzard) and they limited abilities (relative to GW1).
Anyway wow is a joke game because missing a blind for instance is gamebreaking.

The fail is strong with this one.

Warcraft 4? Really man?

PvP imbalanced? To perfectly balance pvp for all classes, talent specs, and races has to simply be a nightmare. They are constantly balancing and tweaking it to make it better and well unfortunately not all goes as well as planned. Then you also have to account for the millions of players, where there is a small handful that manage to find a way to make anything overpowered. Blizzard and the vast majority of the community never say the possibility of prot healing for paladins, but didn't take long after I began using it in pvp before every paly was doing it. They cannot account for every single possibility. That is why there are patches. GW was god awful and sorry I cannot see GW2 doing any better. The variety of gear and abilities to use give you options. There is a learning curve and in order to excel you need to know how to optimize your character and team comp. Maybe it is just to complex for you.

Missing a blind would be considered failing a mechanic of a boss fight. One of HUNDREDS of mechanics that Blizzard utilizes with WoW. From your statement I would have to assume that your raid progression and/or standing in pvp would be average at best, maybe 1500 in arena.
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post #126 of 240
I have over 6k hours in wow, havent really played much last 2 years but i am always tempted to return.. GW2 may be the game that kills that urge, but if it ends up being subpar, i have no qualms returning to wow!
    
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post #127 of 240
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Originally Posted by Magariz View Post


PvP imbalanced? To perfectly balance pvp for all classes, talent specs, and races has to simply be a nightmare. They are constantly balancing and tweaking it to make it better and well unfortunately not all goes as well as planned. .

probably why pvp balance was always a joke. that and they had to factor in pve on top of that and refused to separate the two games
post #128 of 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by perfectblade View Post

probably why pvp balance was always a joke. that and they had to factor in pve on top of that and refused to separate the two games
This is by far my biggest complaint against the game. For a company that is pure genius when it comes to gaming as a whole (pretty much all their titles are trend-setting hits), it blows my mind why Blizzard are being so adamant and thick-headed when it comes to separating ability tooltips in PvP and PvE. They haven't even successfully answered WHY they hold such a strong stance against it, and at a certain point Ghostcrawler had simply said "any more threads suggesting to separate PvP/PvE will be locked". Even a retarded walrus would know that the solution to WoW's balancing issues is dancing naked in front of them. It was the height of insults when one of the reasons we got was "it would confuse players", that response angered off so many people in the PvP community that it wasn't even funny.

Blizzard have ALREADY made so many exceptions to their oh-so-golden "rule" - Resilience / PvP Power (MoP), separated CC durations, separated debuff durations, Deep Freeze effect, Colossal Smash effect, I'm probably missing a few more. Having different sets of gear in PvP and PvE = massive separation. So many mechanics that have separate effects in PvP/PvE. Yet Blizzard pretend that it's their "rule" to keep it as "one game", they treat their playerbase like children who can't understand anything.

I hate to play the "this is why I'm looking forward to GW2" card, but I really am, because I have faith that ArenaNet won't treat the PvP community like discarded trash who have no say in anything.
Edited by Tippy - 7/29/12 at 12:44pm
post #129 of 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tippy View Post

This is by far my biggest complaint against the game. For a company that is pure genius when it comes to gaming as a whole (pretty much all their titles are trend-setting hits), it blows my mind why Blizzard are being so adamant and thick-headed when it comes to separating ability tooltips in PvP and PvE. They haven't even successfully answered WHY they hold such a strong stance against it, and at a certain point Ghostcrawler had simply said "any more threads suggesting to separate PvP/PvE will be locked". Even a retarded walrus would know that the solution to WoW's balancing issues is dancing naked in front of them. It was the height of insults when one of the reasons we got was "it would confuse players", that response angered off so many people in the PvP community that it wasn't even funny.
Blizzard have ALREADY made so many exceptions to their oh-so-golden "rule" - Resilience / PvP Power (MoP), separated CC durations, separated debuff durations, Deep Freeze effect, Colossal Smash effect, I'm probably missing a few more. Having different sets of gear in PvP and PvE = massive separation. So many mechanics that have separate effects in PvP/PvE. Yet Blizzard pretend that it's their "rule" to keep it as "one game", they treat their playerbase like children who can't understand anything.
I hate to play the "this is why I'm looking forward to GW2" card, but I really am, because I have faith that ArenaNet won't treat the PvP community like discarded trash who have no say in anything.

I agree but I think you're overblowing it a tad. As I said earlier in this thread I played a multi gladiator mage. I remember when season 5 was released for about 3 weeks every 2s team at the top was a rogue & dk and all because said rogues had gotten "lucky" and received the naxx glaive drops. It was infuriating being 2 shot by these clowns ENTIRELY because they got lucky on their pve rolls. Who needs skill when you can backstab with a weapon that can two shot a mage? This story is the same (just change out class/weapon) at the beginning of every pvp season. However, now that there is a raid finder AND because pve points can be exchanged for pvp points, it mitigates this a bit. Its not perfect but yea, wow is primarily a pve game. With the ability to level entirely by pvp now at least blizzard acknowledges that there are people who love wow who don't want to slay dragons. Still, those of us in this camp are punished a little. We still require reputation to get the necessary shoulder slot enchants, etc. It used to be really bad, but its less so now, at least.
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post #130 of 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tippy View Post

This is by far my biggest complaint against the game. For a company that is pure genius when it comes to gaming as a whole (pretty much all their titles are trend-setting hits), it blows my mind why Blizzard are being so adamant and thick-headed when it comes to separating ability tooltips in PvP and PvE. They haven't even successfully answered WHY they hold such a strong stance against it, and at a certain point Ghostcrawler had simply said "any more threads suggesting to separate PvP/PvE will be locked". Even a retarded walrus would know that the solution to WoW's balancing issues is dancing naked in front of them. It was the height of insults when one of the reasons we got was "it would confuse players", that response angered off so many people in the PvP community that it wasn't even funny.
Blizzard have ALREADY made so many exceptions to their oh-so-golden "rule" - Resilience / PvP Power (MoP), separated CC durations, separated debuff durations, Deep Freeze effect, Colossal Smash effect, I'm probably missing a few more. Having different sets of gear in PvP and PvE = massive separation. So many mechanics that have separate effects in PvP/PvE. Yet Blizzard pretend that it's their "rule" to keep it as "one game", they treat their playerbase like children who can't understand anything.
I hate to play the "this is why I'm looking forward to GW2" card, but I really am, because I have faith that ArenaNet won't treat the PvP community like discarded trash who have no say in anything.

They have addressed it. It is called "the burden of knowledge". If they make all the abilities have different effects for pvp and pve then your going to make things far too complicated.
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6gb Corsair XMS2 DDR2-800 WD 500TB 7200rpm Seagate 2TB 7200rpm Corsair 60GB SSD 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
WD 2TB Green Samsung lightscribe 22x Sata dvd burner Thermaltake V1 Win7 64bit 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
46" Samsung LED Smart TV MaxKeyboard Nighthawk X8 ABS Tagan BZ700w modular Thermaltake Spedo 
MouseAudioAudio
Razer Naga Audio Technica AD-700's Denon receiver with BA 5.1 speakers 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i5 2500k Asus P8Z68-V sapphire 7970 ghz sapphire 7970 ghz 
RAMPowerMouse
8gb CoolerMaster Silent Pro Gold 800W Cooler Master CM690 II 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 4770k ASUS MAXIMUS VI EXTREME LGA 1150 Intel Z87 HDMI... EVGA 04G-P4-3774-KR GeForce GTX 770 4GB 256-bit... EVGA 04G-P4-3774-KR GeForce GTX 770 4GB 256-bit... 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveCooling
CORSAIR Vengeance Pro 32GB (4 x 8GB) 240-Pin DD... Corsair Nova Series 2 CSSD-V30GB2A 2.5" 30GB SA... HGST Ultrastar 7K3000 HUA723020ALA640 (0F12455)... CORSAIR Hydro Series H110 Water Cooler  
OSPowerCase
Win 8 CORSAIR HX Series HX1050 1050W ATX12V / EPS12V ... COOLER MASTER HAF series RC-902XB-KKN1 Black St... 
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Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Video Game News › [Blizzard Entertainment Inc] Mists of Pandaria Sep 25