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GTX 600 Series Unlocked Voltage Bios' downloads and tools. - Page 744

post #7431 of 7931
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrinus View Post

Yeah i guess i could run this whit the 120
Actually it aint. Manufactuares always notice the recomended power sourcer wayyyyyy higer than its actualy needed and it always depends the guality of the power source too. 350W 80+ Can easyly beat some recular 600W cheap powersource it aint the amount of the power itse guality of it! http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp is good site to check how much you really need power. I am running Q8200 quad oc 3..37GHZ from 2.4 and this gtx 670 and 8G DDR2 and 4 normal S-ata HD and so on just fine. smile.gif All oc so high than they can go

Actually you'll be surprised to know this,

80+ certification is about how much efficiency your PSU has. And not about how good it is to deliver power. Although it relates to both.

Here it is in my own words:

A cheapo 600 watts PSU can push out barely 600 watts. But in return, sucks up more than 600 watts from the wall socket. Thus low on efficiency.

It may also have poor power/ripple regulation. Thus low on output quality.

But it is so wrong to say your 350 80+ gold (or platinum) rated PSU to push out more than a 600 cheapo true rated PSU. Remember that's almost twice the deficit. And PSU's were not built to double their power ratings..

Also note this, PSU ratings were actually derived from their efficiency curves . So while your 350 gold certified may be cleaner to deliver power at it's optimal EFF curve, it still cannot topple the output of a 600 watts cheapo which has a lower or less than acceptable EFF curve.

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/742

Then there's ripple regulation.

Ripple is not voltage drop just to clear this out. It's a form of voltage distortion with a certain frequency that may either go higher or lower than the value of a desired PSU output voltage.

An ideal PSU has no ripples. But they're non existent in electronic world.

While it may be good to point out that 80+ certified PSU has a good ripple suppression, you should also know that ripples were not as big as 1 volt. Or some milivolts in computer PSU speak. Thus still giving a cheap 600 watts an edge over your 350watts 80+ gold.

Then, why the hell do we need to purchase an 80+ certified PSU?

It could mean savings, it could save the earth, it has better efficiency curve, it has less ripples and it is safer on the components because of their clean power output. But that's just about it.

It cannot and will not produce magical outputs that were higher than it is rated for. Period.

On the context of your OC'ing, you may have considered your cpu TDP value, your GPU power consumption ratings, and you overall system added together. But you may want to check and consider that overclocking does not produce a linear relationship to power consumption. A CPU oc'd by about 20% will consume more than 20% of it's normal power consumption.

That is because the frequency increase (more on states per second = more current) and it being subjected to a much higher voltage.

So you should consider that when choosing a PSU.

Another thing, TDP is not power consumption!!

And one last thing, electronics is now more concerned about low power figures. This is now the name of the game. So again wrong point to say they rate them much higher than they actually consume..
Edited by mus1mus - 3/17/14 at 9:34am
post #7432 of 7931
Quote:
Originally Posted by mus1mus View Post

Actually you'll be surprised to know this,

80+ certification is about how much efficiency your has. And not about how good it is to deliver power. Although it relates to both.

Here it is in my own words:

A cheapo 600 watts PSU can push out barely 600 watts. But in return, sucks up more than 600 watts from the wall socket. Thus low on efficiency.

It may also have poor power/ripple regulation. Thus low on output quality.

But it is so wrong to say your 350 80+ gold (or platinum) rated PSU to push out more than a 600 cheapo true rated PSU. Remember that's almost twice the deficit. And PSU's were not built to double their power ratings..

Also not this, PSU ratings were actually derived from their efficiency curves . So while your 350 gold certified may be cleaner to deliver power at it's optimal EFF curve, it still cannot topple the output of a

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/742

true true. maybe the 600 was little high tongue.gif But my point was nearly that you dont need to have 600w even the manufactuer would claim it to be so. They always tell to have like 500 for just the gpu wich is bull****. And iu wouldnt recoment to get any kind of cheap power source no matter how high the w would be. sens they are usually made so pad parts that they wont last for **** in real high end computers. Whit bad luck brake mainboard at the same time they brake down. I think power source is the one thing you dont wanna start to get cheap when building a computer..
post #7433 of 7931
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrinus View Post


true true. maybe the 600 was little high tongue.gif But my point was nearly that you dont need to have 600w even the manufactuer would claim it to be so. They always tell to have like 500 for just the gpu wich is bull****. And iu wouldnt recoment to get any kind of cheap power source no matter how high the w would be. sens they are usually made so pad parts that they wont last for **** in real high end computers. Whit bad luck brake mainboard at the same time they brake down. I think power source is the one thing you dont wanna start to get cheap when building a computer..

that comes down to power consumption alone the card can only suck 150w per 6-pin + pcie combo add another 6-pin and that is another 75w at stock. so your psu is undervolting other stuff if your cpu has a hefty oc and your gpu is at stock. hd's and usb slots on the mobo are the first things to be undervolted. 

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post #7434 of 7931
Quote:
Originally Posted by djthrottleboi View Post

that comes down to power consumption alone the card can only suck 150w per 6-pin + pcie combo add another 6-pin and that is another 75w at stock. so your psu is undervolting other stuff if your cpu has a hefty oc and your gpu is at stock. hd's and usb slots on the mobo are the first things to be undervolted. 

yeah off gourse but still you dont need to have like 500w just for the gpu like the manufactuares are claiming and i haven been having any problems whit my gear whit this power source. Of gourse it never harms to have the extra but you dont need to have 500w power source just for the gpu. Overall is pretty easy to count your power needs like trough that side i give link to. Off gourse it aint the 100% true but gives pretty good idea. instead beliving what the manufactueres claim to be needed sens Its the money that do the talks. And like i sayd that of gourse it never harms to have extra power but i dont like to pay extra for the power i wont neccerly have use for. And don't really like how manufactuers gives you fals infromation about the true power needs and so on. Itse the principle that counts. smile.gif but of gourse this is just my opinion

PS sorry for the bad english drinking some sahti. biggrin.gif so my typing aint so correct anymore. tongue.gif
post #7435 of 7931
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrinus View Post


yeah off gourse but still you dont need to have like 500w just for the gpu like the manufactuares are claiming and i haven been having any problems whit my gear whit this power source. Of gourse it never harms to have the extra but you dont need to have 500w power source just for the gpu. Overall is pretty easy to count your power needs like trough that side i give link to. Off gourse it aint the 100% true but gives pretty good idea. instead beliving what the manufactueres claim to be needed sens Its the money that do the talks. And like i sayd that of gourse it never harms to have extra power but i dont like to pay extra for the power i wont neccerly have use for. And don't really like how manufactuers gives you fals infromation about the true power needs and so on. Itse the principle that counts. smile.gif but of gourse this is just my opinion

PS sorry for the bad english drinking some sahti. biggrin.gif so my typing aint so correct anymore. tongue.gif

i believe i just admitted this. My above statement is that if you are doing the math on how many watts  you need in a psu then go by this.  If you are a overclocker you almost always want to go way higher than this as you will consume way more than this and you should always have way more than you need as your psu may fold from drawing max all the time as it is not optimal regardless of efficiency rating.

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Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
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Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
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post #7436 of 7931
But you also has some valid points,

1. Cheap PSUs do not need certification, thus they are actually overrated. But even 80+ certifications were also cheated.

Read some PSU reviews and you'll find them barely making their indicated ratings.
post #7437 of 7931
Quote:
Originally Posted by djthrottleboi View Post

i believe i just admitted this. My above statement is that if you are doing the math on how many watts  you need in a psu then go by this.  If you are a overclocker you almost always want to go way higher than this as you will consume way more than this and you should always have way more than you need as your psu may fold from drawing max all the time as it is not optimal regardless of efficiency rating.


yeah of gourse if you are doing hard OC it another thing. i was mearly talking about the basic power consumption. But like in my case i havent need to rise cpu volt pretty much for nothing to gain the 1 GHZ oc. Of gourse using you brain is allowed. tongue.gif that side altough have the oc options too where you can but your oc volts and it will give you a some kind of idea also how much it will suck power.
post #7438 of 7931
Here is a simple way to solve this, No OC, give at least 20 percent headroom on the PSU.
OC and you should consider more headroom to give.

Details:

Power is equal to the product of Voltage and Current.

Example:

1 volt x 20 amperes = 20 watts at stock.

At 20% OC without adding Voltage would mean 20% more current.

1 volt x 24 amperes = 24 watts. Thus 20% more power needed.

At 20% OC needing 20% more voltage;

1.2 volts x 24 = 28.8 watts. Thus 44.4% more power needed.
That's a fact to consider.

If rated for 500 watts as you calculated, no OC, you need 600watts.
20 OC, you'll need more than 850 watts.
Edited by mus1mus - 3/17/14 at 10:08am
post #7439 of 7931
Am I overkillin?

Remember this, a PSU will suffer at 100% duty cycle even for as quick as a minute.

If your PSU dies during that, cool, only the PSU died.

If your PSU sends 120 volts to your system, boom!! Everything dies!!

Lol
post #7440 of 7931
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrinus View Post

true true. maybe the 600 was little high tongue.gif But my point was nearly that you dont need to have 600w even the manufactuer would claim it to be so. They always tell to have like 500 for just the gpu wich is bull****. And iu wouldnt recoment to get any kind of cheap power source no matter how high the w would be. sens they are usually made so pad parts that they wont last for **** in real high end computers. Whit bad luck brake mainboard at the same time they brake down. I think power source is the one thing you dont wanna start to get cheap when building a computer..

The only way to know is to have Watt-O-Meter in between your power outlet and power supply and get an estimate of the load power that is being drawn by your system. For example, my system with two 670's and 2500 overvolted/overclocked would draw around 550W when playing Tomb Raider. Multiply that value by 90% (approximate efficiency of my Seasonic Platinum PSU) and that would equate to 495W (system load). So a 660W PSU should be more than enough for my system to accommodate 495W system load.

I'm thinking that 350W is really on the borderline side of things for your PSU but like I said we can be more accurate if you have a power meter to measure.
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