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[NeoGaf/WGTC] Accept Steam Agreement Or Disable Your Account - Page 46

post #451 of 465
Does it really matter? Most of you will click the 'I Agree' button anyways, and this entire thread is a hypothetical.

The day any of you bring a EULA to court, then we can discuss what actually happens.

It won't happen - so enjoy the FREE service that STEAM or other like services provide and leave it alone.
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post #452 of 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by macro6 View Post

sent an email to valve to close my steam account... i refuse to be a slave to the system.

Get yo ass to maaars, or africa then.
post #453 of 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by kremtok View Post

No. We are talking about money.
Here's a hypothetical: You're sold something, say a baseball. That baseball is yours. Then the person who sold the baseball to you decides that you can only have the baseball if you don't throw it. You love throwing your baseball, so you disagree. So they take it from you, and don't even give you your money back from when you bought the baseball.
Does that seem right to you?

As was already stated a physical object (baseball) != a licensed IP object (software/service). Although you are correct... we are talking about money - and I said I agree that it sucks. However, I would also put forth that if the amount of money you spent on all of the games you have in Steam is an adequate amount of potential loss to make such a huge deal over (it's not an actual loss until they actually take it away for a reason other than getting banned or closing your account) then you should probably not be gaming and just go out looking for a job.

A better rewording of the analogy would be this:
You buy a baseball under a contract that stipulates that your payment does not constitute ownership but merely a license to use the baseball indefinitely under very limited terms. One of those terms, for example, is that you must not throw the baseball through a window. If you throw it through a window - then you lose the baseball and they take it back, and if you don't - you can keep playing with it. I realize that you're arguing the principle not the principal here but that's where my point lies.

If we were talking about a $30K automobile (cost-wise) or a $3K piece of durable medical equipment which was keeping you alive (importance-wise)... then the cost of the potential loss would be great and real. If you're talking about a $30 video game (or 50 of them for that matter) the cost of the loss is only a maximum of the money spent - but even that is not likely the case. In reality you're only talking about the real loss cost being the cost of replacement - losing access to video games you have no intention of playing ever again is not an actual loss until you want to play them and have to re-buy them again. After all you did get to play them when you originally purchased them didn't you?

All I'm saying is that if you are playing on a weekly allowance then I suppose I can understand making a huge deal out of this - but if you have any kind of decent job... then even if you purchased ever single game on Steam... your maximum realized loss could only be a few thousand dollars of ENTERTAINMENT. No food lost, no blood lost, no forced lobotomies, etc...

To everyone that thinks this is so wrong and once you purchased something it should be yours forever I have a question: have you gotten at least as angry that there aren't Windows 7 drivers for a video card or sound card that you purchased back in 2000? How about 2005? There's a ton of hardware that I've purchased, that had no such ToS or EULA involved that is no longer functional despite having nothing physically wrong with it. I've had 3 printers, 4 scanners, a video camera, and a pile of cards that aren't usable despite being 100% functional. Should I avoid buying anything from Intel, ATI, NVIDIA, Mustek, HP, Microsoft, Creative Labs, etc. from now on?

Also I realize that I can't go into details in regards to the terms of this forum... but you do realize that there is another option which costs nothing and allows you to play whatever game you want in offline mode. It is illegal - but so is playing a game you licensed once that license has been revoked by the issuer. wink.gif Just sayin'
post #454 of 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by DiGiCiDAL View Post

As was already stated a physical object (baseball) != a licensed IP object (software/service). Although you are correct... we are talking about money - and I said I agree that it sucks. However, I would also put forth that if the amount of money you spent on all of the games you have in Steam is an adequate amount of potential loss to make such a huge deal over (it's not an actual loss until they actually take it away for a reason other than getting banned or closing your account) then you should probably not be gaming and just go out looking for a job.
A better rewording of the analogy would be this:
You buy a baseball under a contract that stipulates that your payment does not constitute ownership but merely a license to use the baseball indefinitely under very limited terms. One of those terms, for example, is that you must not throw the baseball through a window. If you throw it through a window - then you lose the baseball and they take it back, and if you don't - you can keep playing with it. I realize that you're arguing the principle not the principal here but that's where my point lies.
If we were talking about a $30K automobile (cost-wise) or a $3K piece of durable medical equipment which was keeping you alive (importance-wise)... then the cost of the potential loss would be great and real. If you're talking about a $30 video game (or 50 of them for that matter) the cost of the loss is only a maximum of the money spent - but even that is not likely the case. In reality you're only talking about the real loss cost being the cost of replacement - losing access to video games you have no intention of playing ever again is not an actual loss until you want to play them and have to re-buy them again. After all you did get to play them when you originally purchased them didn't you?
All I'm saying is that if you are playing on a weekly allowance then I suppose I can understand making a huge deal out of this - but if you have any kind of decent job... then even if you purchased ever single game on Steam... your maximum realized loss could only be a few thousand dollars of ENTERTAINMENT. No food lost, no blood lost, no forced lobotomies, etc...
To everyone that thinks this is so wrong and once you purchased something it should be yours forever I have a question: have you gotten at least as angry that there aren't Windows 7 drivers for a video card or sound card that you purchased back in 2000? How about 2005? There's a ton of hardware that I've purchased, that had no such ToS or EULA involved that is no longer functional despite having nothing physically wrong with it. I've had 3 printers, 4 scanners, a video camera, and a pile of cards that aren't usable despite being 100% functional. Should I avoid buying anything from Intel, ATI, NVIDIA, Mustek, HP, Microsoft, Creative Labs, etc. from now on?
Also I realize that I can't go into details in regards to the terms of this forum... but you do realize that there is another option which costs nothing and allows you to play whatever game you want in offline mode. It is illegal - but so is playing a game you licensed once that license has been revoked by the issuer. wink.gif Just sayin'

One crucial difference: In your example, the original agreement was to not throw the baseball through the window. But when I bought my baseball, that stipulation wasn't in the contract. To add it in later, then say that my choice is to agree not to throw my baseball through any windows or surrender it without a refund, is wrong. Assuming that in our hypothetical world, throwing a baseball through a window is normal behavior, there's no grounds on which to revoke my 'license.'

Furthermore, I assert that the license to play the game (or throw the baseball through windows, at my sister, or on a ballfield) is something that I own, and it cannot be taken from me without either compensation or due process of law. Otherwise, what's to prevent any company from taking their product back after you have paid for it, then not refunding the purchase price?
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post #455 of 465
who really cares about this lol.
 
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post #456 of 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by srsparky32 View Post

who really cares about this lol.

evidently, some people does. you doesn't care is not equal to no one cares
post #457 of 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by kremtok View Post

No. We are talking about money.
Here's a hypothetical: You're sold something, say a baseball. That baseball is yours. Then the person who sold the baseball to you decides that you can only have the baseball if you don't throw it. You love throwing your baseball, so you disagree. So they take it from you, and don't even give you your money back from when you bought the baseball.
Does that seem right to you?

You don't own the game. In fact this isn't just for Steam this goes for ANY software you've bought.
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post #458 of 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge Of Pain View Post

You don't own the game. In fact this isn't just for Steam this goes for ANY software you've bought.

this has been discussed extensively, what you posted has already been posted by somebody. just let this thread die.
post #459 of 465
You know not everything they put in the TOS can be legally enforced right?
I'll let the lawyers worry about it if/when it ever comes up.
    
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post #460 of 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoogins View Post

Does it really matter? Most of you will click the 'I Agree' button anyways, and this entire thread is a hypothetical.
The day any of you bring a EULA to court, then we can discuss what actually happens.
It won't happen - so enjoy the FREE service that STEAM or other like services provide and leave it alone.

That's where you're wrong!

every single game/application i made sure to read the TOS 2-3 times before hitting the "I agree" button. I also print copies of the TOS for my lawyer to read and gives the go-head to click agree.
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