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[Business Insider] Apple's victory wasn't about money or lawsuits - Page 11

post #101 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by steelbom View Post

And why isn't a trade dress a legitimate claim? It is. And so are software claims.

When there is plenty of prior art, a patent should not be granted. I present you with the LG Prada, launched in 2006, before the iPhone. I see here a device with a rectangular screen with rounded corners = Prior Art.



I'm not saying Apple copied the Prada or anything, but simply that there was PRIOR art. Apple fans seem to think that Apple invented the smartphone, Apple has never invented anything, remember? ( Let's not get into that again )

Maybe because the corners weren't rounded enough????
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post #102 of 123
he sent that out so that he can keep all of it
Edited by IRO-Bot - 8/28/12 at 6:16pm
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post #103 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by QuietlyLinux View Post

Maybe because the corners weren't rounded enough????

Not sure if serious... thinking.gif
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post #104 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post

Not sure if serious... thinking.gif

Not sure if you're serious either, but nevertheless. Plenty of sources for Apple's recommendation, but bit diluted among the plethora of articles on the most recent case.

http://theapplebites.com/apple-gives-samsung-list-alternate-designs/
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post #105 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post

When there is plenty of prior art, a patent should not be granted. I present you with the LG Prada, launched in 2006, before the iPhone. I see here a device with a rectangular screen with rounded corners = Prior Art.

I'm not saying Apple copied the Prada or anything, but simply that there was PRIOR art. Apple fans seem to think that Apple invented the smartphone, Apple has never invented anything, remember? ( Let's not get into that again )

What about the entire list of UI elements that Samsung made to look "more like the iPhone"? Or Google's email to Samsung asking them to not make something so similar?

Remember, it was the sum of all parts that did Samsung in, not just the shape of the phone.


Should you be able to patent the shape of your phone? I would say no.
Did Samsung make a phone and tablet copying the well received iPhone? I would say yes, definitely.
post #106 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wek View Post

Not sure if you're serious either, but nevertheless. Plenty of sources for Apple's recommendation, but bit diluted among the plethora of articles on the most recent case.
http://theapplebites.com/apple-gives-samsung-list-alternate-designs/

hmmm, let me go through each of these points that Apple suggested to Samsung...

Following are some of the recommendations that Apple has made for Samsung’s smartphones.

1. Front Surface that should not be black.

LG Prada had black front surface. Why should Apple OWN that?

2. Overall shape that should not rectangular.

LG Prada was rectangular. Why should Apple OWN that?

3. It should not have rounded corners.

LG Prada had rounded corners. Why should Apple OWN that?

4. Display screens should not be centered on the front face and have substantial lateral borders.

LG Prada has a centered display screen. Why should Apple OWN that?

5. Speaker slots should not be horizontal.

LG Prada had a horizontal speaker slot. Why should Apple OWN that?

6. Front surfaces with substantial adornment.

Dear Samsung, please make your device ugly so it can't compete with the iPhone.

7. There should not be any front bezel at all.

LG Prada had a bezel on the front. Why should Apple OWN that?

Not gonna bother to go through the other list.

I don't get what the point of posting that was.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foolsmasher View Post

What about the entire list of UI elements that Samsung made to look "more like the iPhone"? Or Google's email to Samsung asking them to not make something so similar?
Remember, it was the sum of all parts that did Samsung in, not just the shape of the phone.
Should you be able to patent the shape of your phone? I would say no.
Did Samsung make a phone and tablet copying the well received iPhone? I would say yes, definitely.

Should you be able to patent the shape of your phone? I would say no.

I agree, but Apple did just that.

Look, I'm one of the few people who agrees that Samsung did take some inspiration from the iPhone. My beef is that Apple copies and takes inspiration from others as well including Android. For example:

5 Things IOS got from Android for IOS 5.
http://betanews.com/2011/06/07/5-things-apple-borrowed-from-android-for-ios-5/

Apple knows no shame: steals ICS camera unlock for iOS
http://androidcommunity.com/apple-knows-no-shame-steals-ics-camera-unlock-for-ios-20120217/

5 More things Apple copied from Android:
http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/165852/20110620/ios-5-apple-android-google-twitter-notification-center-pc-free-steve-jobs.htm

I could go on and on, but the point is Apple takes inspiration from others, just like others have taken inspiration from Apple.

Dieter Rams once said: "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.” When asked how he felt that Apple was stealing from him.
http://www.macstories.net/links/fast-company-our-interview-with-dieter-rams-the-greatest-designer-alive/

It's too bad Apple didn't steal Dieter Rams' philosophy along with his designs.

In case you don't know what I'm talking about.



Samsung innovated the smartphone beyond the iPhone. The Galaxy Note alone is an example of this innovation. Samsung phones have larger screens, Micro SD Card slots, removable battery, more powerful processors, more RAM, an open OS, and too many things to list that the iPhone lacks.

You really think people buy Samsung phones for features such as "bounce back" or "Pinch to Zoom"? Speaking of those 2 features, should devices really get banned because they have them?

People here argue over getting an HTC One X or GS3, because some of us can't stand a small 3.5" screen that has been standard on the iPhone for the past 5 years. On that note, the iPhone 5 is supposed to have a 4" screen. Should Samsung sue Apple because they've had 4" screens before Apple? kookoo.gif

Apple sees a demand in 7" tablets, so they're going to follow suit with the iPad Mini. Should Amazon and Google sue Samsung for making a 7" tablet?

Should Samsung sue Apple for implementing a DUAL CORE processor, which THEY make for Apple? ( The Galaxy S2 had a Dual Core processor before the iPhone )

The answer to my questions is NO.

It's called natural progression. All companies copy each other, and improve on existing ideas, Apple loves to copy and steal, but does everything in their power to prevent others from doing the same, that right there is my and many others' beef with Apple as a company and their tactics.

If Apple INVENTED everything they've done, rather than innovating on existing ideas, I could see them having a case. Instead, they found loop holes in the patent system and are using it to their advantage to stifle competition.

Apple is making it very difficult for other companies to innovate. Right now, they might have gotten this victory if it stands, but what's going to happen 1 - 3 years from now? All these companies that Apple has sued are learning their lesson, and they're going to patent each and every little thing they do, and if Apple dare copies it, they're going to get sued. And they're going to take a queue from Apple and claim that they're not interested in cross licensing. Long term, all Apple is doing is making enemies.

If they have the audacity to sue their supplier who provides 26% of the parts of the iPhone, they really have no shame in their game.
Edited by 2010rig - 8/28/12 at 8:10pm
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post #107 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foolsmasher View Post

What about the entire list of UI elements that Samsung made to look "more like the iPhone"? Or Google's email to Samsung asking them to not make something so similar?
Remember, it was the sum of all parts that did Samsung in, not just the shape of the phone.
Should you be able to patent the shape of your phone? I would say no.
Did Samsung make a phone and tablet copying the well received iPhone? I would say yes, definitely.

If you want your product to be successful, and your competitor's product is successful, why won't you imitate what made your competitor's product a success?

Google's email was to try and avoid pointless Apple litigation, but it happened anyways.

They did not copy the iphone. They took ideas from preceding designs and what the public liked and incorporated it into their own design.

Point is, Apple did not come up with these things. These ideas existed in science fiction long before smartphones were even viable. Technology in those years wasn't good enough to make a smartphone successful. Apple was just the first to come to the ring with a successful smartphone, but does that mean they invented the idea and the look? No, they did not. Therefore, they should not even have those patents in the first place, and if they didn't have the patents, they can't sue Samsung.
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post #108 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post

hmmm, let me go through each of these points that Apple suggested to Samsung...
Following are some of the recommendations that Apple has made for Samsung’s smartphones.
1. Front Surface that should not be black.
LG Prada had black front surface. Why should Apple OWN that?
2. Overall shape that should not rectangular.
LG Prada was rectangular. Why should Apple OWN that?
3. It should not have rounded corners.
LG Prada had rounded corners. Why should Apple OWN that?
4. Display screens should not be centered on the front face and have substantial lateral borders.
LG Prada has a centered display screen. Why should Apple OWN that?
5. Speaker slots should not be horizontal.
LG Prada had a horizontal speaker slot. Why should Apple OWN that?
6. Front surfaces with substantial adornment.
Dear Samsung, please make your device ugly so it can't compete with the iPhone.
7. There should not be any front bezel at all.
LG Prada had a bezel on the front. Why should Apple OWN that?
Not gonna bother to go through the other list.
I don't get what the point of posting that was.

Basically don't make a phone period .... hahaha apple is a joke I can't wait to see what happens considering the jury messed up the whole trial biggrin.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi View Post

If you want your product to be successful, and your competitor's product is successful, why won't you imitate what made your competitor's product a success?
Google's email was to try and avoid pointless Apple litigation, but it happened anyways.
They did not copy the iphone. They took ideas from preceding designs and what the public liked and incorporated it into their own design.
Point is, Apple did not come up with these things. These ideas existed in science fiction long before smartphones were even viable. Technology in those years wasn't good enough to make a smartphone successful. Apple was just the first to come to the ring with a successful smartphone, but does that mean they invented the idea and the look? No, they did not. Therefore, they should not even have those patents in the first place, and if they didn't have the patents, they can't sue Samsung.

People are idiots if they don't understand how their current phone was revamped from the F700. I mean it's perfectly clear but I guess people are just too blind.
Edited by theturbofd - 8/28/12 at 7:55pm
post #109 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post

When there is plenty of prior art, a patent should not be granted. I present you with the LG Prada, launched in 2006, before the iPhone. I see here a device with a rectangular screen with rounded corners = Prior Art.



I'm not saying Apple copied the Prada or anything, but simply that there was PRIOR art. Apple fans seem to think that Apple invented the smartphone, Apple has never invented anything, remember? ( Let's not get into that again )

From what I can tell the D '677 patent has nothing to do with a rectangular screen with rounded corners, it's about the ornamental design of the iPhone. The D '087 patent is again about the ornamental design of the iPhone. (Perhaps I've missed it, I've little experience with reading patents, but I can't see where in those patents they list the rectangle design as a part of the patent.) The D '305 patent is for the ornamental design for a GUI for a display screen or a portion thereof, so the design of the icons and such. (I haven't mentioned the claim for the iPad which the Jury rejected.)

Then there's these patents, of which a lot of Samsung's devices infringed upon:
Quote:
'381 patent
Besides the "rubber band" effect where a page "bounces" when a user scrolls to the bottom, '381 also includes touch-screen actions like dragging documents and multi-touch capabilities like pinch to zoom and twist to rotate.
Quote:
'915 patent
Also a touch-screen patent, '915 relates to a device capable of distinguishing between a single-touch scroll operation and a multi-touch pinch-to-zoom operation.
Quote:
'163 patent
You know how you can double-tap a touch screen to enlarge and center portions of Web page, photo, or document? That's what this patent covers. The jury found that the Intercept did not violate patents '915 or '163.

Reference: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-57500273-37/apple-v-samsung-the-infringing-device-scorecard/
Quote:
Originally Posted by theturbofd View Post

People are idiots if they don't understand how their current phone was revamped from the F700. I mean it's perfectly clear but I guess people are just too blind.
They may have been heading in that direction, but Samsung's own documents show that they did copy the iPhone. The meme between Samsung execs show them praising the iPhone and saying they should make something more like it. The comparison between the S1 and iPhone show that they thoroughly examined the iPhone's UI and made corrective changes to the S1. And then you've got Google saying to them in an email that their devices or UI look too much like the iPhone. This isn't all one big happy coincidence.
Edited by steelbom - 8/28/12 at 9:16pm
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post #110 of 123
Quote:
"For us this lawsuit has always been about something much more important than patents or money. It’s about values. We value originality and innovation and pour our lives into making the best products on earth."

The hypocrisy here is staggering.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jellis142 View Post

It's business, it was about money.

Exactly. I'm eager to see what this'll do to their relationship with Samsung, because afaik, Samsung do provide Apple with components for their devices.
Edited by Thingamajig - 8/28/12 at 10:08pm
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