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[Business Insider] Apple's victory wasn't about money or lawsuits - Page 7

post #61 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by jellis142 View Post

It's business, it was about money.
post #62 of 123
Apple got money and use it to ban Samsung devices. But guess what, Samsung will counter by not producing chips in later Apple products. I hate to say this, but Apple sure knows how to lure people into buying their products. Seen that at my university and think Apple is a premium product who knows how to market their products. I call it brainwashing and manipulation of human psyche. Other countries do not like Apple for being a troll on their patents. It wouldn't surprise me to see other nations going after Apple for its marketing strategy and frivolous lawsuits against companies. Google wants to stop Apple from doing that anyway.
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post #63 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by drbaltazar View Post

samsung will probably go to supreme court showing the rulling achieved in korea!

I doubt it. The Appellate Court will be the stopping point. This will get settled before then anyway.
    
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post #64 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelbom View Post

They can't cut them off, they have contracts. If they did, Apple would be able to sue them for tens of billions of dollars for damages. And Samsung probably makes a lot more off Apple than they've lost from being sued by Apple.
It wouldn't have invalidated Apple's claims at all. The conversation between Samsung execs which basically said to make their smartphone more iPhone-like pretty much damned them, and it's why they lost so much, since it proved that they wilfully and purposefully copied the iPhone.

I love this argument since Apple's foundation is based on copying others.

Why do Apple fans have a hard time understanding that Apple's products are based on copying, stealing others' ideas, and or buying technologies? They then patent those ideas, and use them to eliminate any competing products from the market.

In other words, it's ok for Apple to copy and rip off others' ideas, but if anyone ever copies Apple, they sue. The hypocrisy of Apple is what annoys me the most about the company.

I know since you're Apple biased, you love the outcome of this trial. IMO, there was a lot of shady happenings that went on that brought this outcome.

1. The F700 wasn't allowed to be submitted. We don't know what type of outcome that would have had. Regardless if they look at the iPhone or not, they already had a device that had a rectangular screen with rounded corners, which should invalidate the trade dress claims.

2. While I agree that Samsung looked at the iPhone for inspiration, Apple did the exact same thing and looked at others for inspiration. That evidence was not allowed to be entered into the trial either.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-57482258-38/former-apple-designer-i-wont-testify-at-samsung-trial/
Quote:
Samsung alleged that Apple had changed direction after reading an interview with two of Sony's product designers and submitted images of Apple-created concept designs featuring the Japanese company's logo to back up its claims.

However, Samsung was not permitted to present evidence of this - including a filing showing Apple designs incorporating Sony's logo - because it had presented the documents at a late stage in the legal process.



Look at that mock up, it even has a SONY logo on it!

That's 2 key pieces of evidence that were denied to be entered into the trial.

I find it odd that Apple gets granted a victory for "Trade Dress", but Samsung gets denied compensation for real technology like 3G, which the iPhone relies to MAKE PHONE CALLS with. Apple has yet to pay Samsung anything for 3G.
Edited by 2010rig - 8/25/12 at 5:42pm
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post #65 of 123
The Korean company is a joke. Every Korean and Chinese companies are good at one thing that is making clones and the plus point they make it cheaper with less reliability.
post #66 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post

I love this argument since Apple's foundation is based on copying others.

I really see where you come from regarding Apple and hypocrisy.  This whole claim of their actions being about "values" is a huge show of it.

 

I will use this example: If Apple had values, they would value the people making their products. They would value the poor laws governing the work standards at Foxconn and in China and try doing something about it. The fact that Apple is even relying on Foxconn in China for the sole purpose of the cheaper manufacturing costs as a direct result of lower working standards whereas they actually have the money to invest in either: A. giving these people better working conditions, or B. relying on workers in a different country that may demand higher wages but create iPhones in good condition, goes far to show that Apple's actions are indeed very much bended by the prospect of greed for money.

 

I think it's ridiculous because the greed is absolutely out of control.  Apple is already demanding some of the world's highest profit margins.  There's plenty of money to go around, I mean... look at their profits! I also find myself wondering where is all that money actually going.  It could be going to the workers to make their lives better but not a single cent is headed in that direction.


This whole claim of "wasn't about the money" goes all too far to show their hypocrisy, a hypocrisy that's already present in the "innovative" designs of many of their technological products, as you have pointed out very well.

 

I have a hard time believing that Apple has any sort of "values" because they are so selfish. They do not give. Apple steadfastly refuses to give to charity as a company (at least until recently?), and Steve Jobs personally never gave to charity.


Edited by xd_1771 - 8/25/12 at 6:13pm
post #67 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by meetajhu View Post

The Korean company is a joke. Every Korean and Chinese companies are good at one thing that is making clones and the plus point they make it cheaper with less reliability.

Guess you never used a samsung phone *awaits amazing story of how you owned a samsung phone and totally hated it*
post #68 of 123
If this were a fair and just world Apple would never have been given those patents to begin with...
post #69 of 123
Apple's "victory" was about stifling innovation. It simply amazes me that they can get away with murder like this.

Apple took something that already existed and put their own spin on it. Samsung did the same thing. Yet Samsung has to pay Apple.

There simply is no justice.
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post #70 of 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post

I love this argument since Apple's foundation is based on copying others.

Why do Apple fans have a hard time understanding that Apple's products are based on copying, stealing others' ideas, and or buying technologies? They then patent those ideas, and use them to eliminate any competing products from the market.

In other words, it's ok for Apple to copy and rip off others' ideas, but if anyone ever copies Apple, they sue. The hypocrisy of Apple is what annoys me the most about the company.

I know since you're Apple biased, you love the outcome of this trial. IMO, there was a lot of shady happenings that went on that brought this outcome.

1. The F700 wasn't allowed to be submitted. We don't know what type of outcome that would have had. Regardless if they look at the iPhone or not, they already had a device that had a rectangular screen with rounded corners, which should invalidate the trade dress claims.

2. While I agree that Samsung looked at the iPhone for inspiration, Apple did the exact same thing and looked at others for inspiration. That evidence was not allowed to be entered into the trial either.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-57482258-38/former-apple-designer-i-wont-testify-at-samsung-trial/
Quote:
Samsung alleged that Apple had changed direction after reading an interview with two of Sony's product designers and submitted images of Apple-created concept designs featuring the Japanese company's logo to back up its claims.

However, Samsung was not permitted to present evidence of this - including a filing showing Apple designs incorporating Sony's logo - because it had presented the documents at a late stage in the legal process.

~snip~

Look at that mock up, it even has a SONY logo on it!

That's 2 key pieces of evidence that were denied to be entered into the trial.
Buying technologies is something every company does. And every company copies, to an extent. But Samsung literally tried to make their smartphone(s) look more like the iPhone and that damned them. They deserved to lose, because they did do what they were accused of, and that's their fault. Ultimately the outcome of this was pretty fair. Samsung refused to license Apple's patents relating to multi-touch gestures, and they did copy the iPhone.

1) Why would the fact that Samsung had a smartphone with a "rectangular screen with rounded corners" invalidate all the other listed violations in Apple's trade dress claims? It doesn't.

2) There's a big difference between "looking at others for inspiration" and saying "make our smartphone more like the iPhone". That's just blatant copying. And it's completely irrelevant whether Apple copied other companies products or not in a case about Samsung copying Apple's products. Even if it was true, it doesn't get Samsung off the hook. There were internal documents from Samsung execs that said to copy the iPhone. You just can't come back from that in a trade dress law suit.

Apple had a lot of mock-ups, and they didn't end up going with the Sony one.
Quote:
I find it odd that Apple gets granted a victory for "Trade Dress", but Samsung gets denied compensation for real technology like 3G, which the iPhone relies to MAKE PHONE CALLS with. Apple has yet to pay Samsung anything for 3G.
That sounds as if you think a trade dress law suit is insignificant. It's not. What do you mean they got denied compensation for their 3G patent? Apple refused to pay what Samsung was wanting for a standards-essential patent. They'll end up licensing it but the amount will be decided by the court.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I don't know how anyone could possibly defend Samsung after knowing that they purposefully tried to copy the iPhone. I mean have you guys even thoroughly looked at the documents?

Samsung’s 2010 Report Says Its Galaxy Would Be Better if It Were Just More Like the iPhone

The above article has at the bottom of it a 132 page PDF from Samsung which Apple managed to get into court. It's a comparison between the iPhone and the Galaxy S1, and it compares pretty much every app and every little bit of UI between the two and then suggests what should be done to rectify the situation for the S1.

iPhone Caused “Crisis of Design” at Samsung (Memo)

And at the bottom of this one is the internal memo between Samsung execs. Here's a small quote:
Quote:
And the memo is rife with ammunition. Here’s Shin again, on what Samsung could do to catch up from behind:
“I hear things like this: Let’s make something like the iPhone.”
And again:
“When everybody (both consumers and the industry) talk about UX, they weigh it against the iPhone. The iPhone has become the standard. That’s how things are already.”
And yet again:
“Do you know how difficult the Omnia is to use? When you compare the 2007 version of the iPhone with our current Omnia, can you honestly say the Omnia is better? If you compare the UX with the iPhone, it’s a difference between Heaven and Earth.”

Apple v. Samsung: The infringing device scorecard

And finally this article breaks everything down. Three of these patents should have been licensed by Samsung already (or removed from their smartphones depending on the patent), and the other four are about trade dress, three for the iPhone, one for the iPad.
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