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[Ars] Windows 8 privacy complaint misses the forest for the trees - Page 3

post #21 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzleBoy View Post

Oh god.
"trade information with MS servers"?
"Relinquishing control"?

Really
?
Even though I am quite capable of not getting virus' on my systems without the use of third party software, I haven't even bothered disabling smartscreen.
If trading information with MS servers was a huge deal, installing Microsoft Windows is ten times more the problem than smartscreen is.
I'm also not any less able to control my machine so...
Care to elaborate?

What do you require elaboration on?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi View Post

Maybe you should try rereading the article more closely then.
It sends a hash and the name of the file, which is often just "setup.exe". The hash can potentially be used to identify the program, only if Microsoft compiled a database of all the setup programs in the world. Considering how many programs are out there, this would be a massive use of resources for little to no gain.
What the smartscreen looks for is certain hash sequences that indicate a virus might be present. Or, if the hash is known to install malicious applications.

And that is expressly the problem. send hash and often

Apparently MS see's some gain or they wouldn't have initiated it in the first place.
 
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post #22 of 88
Another one of these threads, nuhoboy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warmonger View Post

Pointless? SmartScreen is essentially an extension to UAC. The collecting of information, sending a request, and receiving a response from Microsoft servers is near instant (you wont notice any difference between SmartScreen and UAC speed) with DSL internet or faster (which most people have cable today). Its a new approach to AntiVirus protection, without having anything actively running on your machine. This makes the OS faster, lighter, and you never have to worry about updates (definition updates are completely server side). Is it as effective as AV guards behavior detection? No. But it does add a second layer of UAC protection. Microsoft wanted to make Windows 8 secure, and so far its the most secure Windows yet. With it being written into the OS, Microsoft can use this for a way to protect their Windows 8 phones from infections.
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post #23 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by GermanyChris View Post

Apparently MS see's some gain or they wouldn't have initiated it in the first place.

We have a winner!

+rep for spotting the obvious when so many are refusing to open their eyes.


Microsoft is getting something out of this, otherwise they wouldn't be going through the time and money of programming all this in and having a server farm to track it all. Not to mention, just like everything else in software, it's not like this can't evolve into something much more down the road with a stealth patch.
post #24 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

We have a winner!
+rep for spotting the obvious when so many are refusing to open their eyes.
Microsoft is getting something out of this, otherwise they wouldn't be going through the time and money of programming all this in and having a server farm to track it all. Not to mention, just like everything else in software, it's not like this can't evolve into something much more down the road with a stealth patch.

Alrighty then, while you're over giving rep to people for agreeing with you go make yourself one of those tinfoil hats.

You are completely paranoid, there have been numerous justifications and explanations given but you're like the little kid on the playground with his fingers in his ears shouting 'LALALALALALALA' when anyone else disagrees with you.

They are sending minimal information WHICH IS COMPLETELY OPTIONAL AND IS OPT-IN (made sure you didn't miss that one) which is used to check the hashes for any signatures that are marked as bad.

They are not forcing you to use it.
They are not trying to take over the world (WAKE UP SHEEPLE!1!!one!)

They are implementing it because people cry about them having next to no security so they are implementing security measures to help the end users.

I really don't see why you are making such a fuss - don't want to send them information? Don't turn it on.

It is that simple.
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post #25 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by lynnperformance View Post

To be honest, I don't really see the issue. As some of the above poster's have said you really have to take this into context and this Kobeissi guy seems to have missed most of it. While I don't necessarily like the fact that my OS sends info to Microsoft every time I run a program, but I honestly don't think Microsoft has the time, money or manpower to not only collect the hash tags and file names (which can be changed arbitrarily most of the time) but to then go troll the internet for similar files, compute their hashes, and then compare the hashes for the applications to those sent by the user. And if they were to do that they would need to do it for the 500 million + potential Windows 8 Users (Source)
What I think they will most likely do, is that if there is a need to know what a particular user is running they will drill down and identify the user, then identify the programs they were using, which would require that person being under suspicion of something illegal or something. Then again, they aren't the police so I believe they'd need a search warrant to do that or something equivalent. (Not sure on the legal issues there, just speculating)

Knowledge is power which is why the government tried so hard to cripple MS, I think they DO have the time,power, and resources and I DO think they will keep this data and sell it off. They wouldn't have this massive privacy invasion setup if they didn't plan to use it against you. Anyone who thinks otherwise must be too trusting or shouldn't reproduce.


Anyone who isn't scared of the route the world is going is a idiot, devices that can hack your thoughts and that spy on you, drones, and even high-end real time facial recognition software to be planned everywhere. Makes me wanna get a tin foil cap and remove all the tech crap out of my home. You ask any American what he thinks of the US and you will get "Freedom" more than anything....whats free about us anymore?
Edited by Twist86 - 8/27/12 at 12:03pm
    
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post #26 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twist86 View Post

Knowledge is power which is why the government tried so hard to cripple MS, I think they DO have the time,power, and resources and I DO think they will keep this data and sell it off. They wouldn't have this massive privacy invasion if setup if they didn't plan to use it against you.

I think you should read the article (or re'read it properly if you already have).

How is an opt-in screening a 'massive privacy invasion' ?

Stop spreading FUD from completely baseless conjecture.

Of course they have the capabilities to do so, but doing so would be the start of the nail in the coffin for Microsoft, no company is stupid enough to do that.
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post #27 of 88
Geez, it's opt-in.

Why are you kids throwing a temper tantrum over absolutely nothing?
post #28 of 88
Top comment of the comments section:
Quote:
I remember reading the post referenced in this article yesterday and thinking how much pointless supposition it contained to make this sound like some kind of big deal.

He scanned Microsoft's servers and deduced from the response that the server would accept SSL2.0 connections; he made no attempt to verify whether or not SmartScreen (or, indeed, *any* Windows feature) used SSL2.0 as the transport protocol. Following this, he assumes Microsoft is logging details necessary for this service to function, purely because they *could* be.

Finally, extrapolating from these "could"s and "maybe"s, he goes on to suggest that Microsoft is using Windows 8 as a platform to spy on every one of its users, many of which will be business users, without their consent, not even considering the overwhelming amount of data that would need to be stored and tracked for little (no?) benefit to the company.

It sure seems like he's trying to ride the Windows 8 hate train with an inflammatory post which is light on facts and heavy on assumption
s, all of which will be used by the uninformed as "yet another reason" to dislike Windows 8. It's Vista all over again, and not because of the software quality, but by the would-be journalists who can't get their facts straight before mouthing off on the internet. Props to ars for debunking this so swiftly and succinctly.

I almost want to sig this.

Facts > Baseless scaremongering.

Every, time.
Edited by GrizzleBoy - 8/27/12 at 12:07pm
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post #29 of 88
This is actually "opt-out" not "opt-in". Since it's enabled by default.

Although, having read this article it doesn't seem at all sinister.
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post #30 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Browncoat View Post

Alrighty then, while you're over giving rep to people for agreeing with you go make yourself one of those tinfoil hats.
You are completely paranoid, there have been numerous justifications and explanations given but you're like the little kid on the playground with his fingers in his ears shouting 'LALALALALALALA' when anyone else disagrees with you.
They are sending minimal information WHICH IS COMPLETELY OPTIONAL AND IS OPT-IN (made sure you didn't miss that one) which is used to check the hashes for any signatures that are marked as bad.
They are not forcing you to use it.
They are not trying to take over the world (WAKE UP SHEEPLE!1!!one!)
They are implementing it because people cry about them having next to no security so they are implementing security measures to help the end users.
I really don't see why you are making such a fuss - don't want to send them information? Don't turn it on.
It is that simple.

Yes, I read that it is NOW, completely optional.

Just like 15 years ago, no smoking signs were all you needed. Then they changed it so that you had to have a separate "section". Then they changed it so that "separate section" had to have it's own air handling system. Then they changed it to no smoking inside. Then they changed it to no smoking in front of buildings.

You get the idea. I've lived way too long to NOT know how things work.

Things are more often done SLOWLY, with incremental changes, that way when you do start to complain (or rather YOU, not me), it's too late.


BTW, I do like the "They are not trying to take over the world." comment. I had to laugh out loud on that one. Did you REALLY say that with a straight face about MICROSOFT?!?!?!
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