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OCZ Vertex 4 VS Samsung 830 - Page 7

post #61 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3930K View Post

What do you get and what do you not?

AFAIK you don't get a count of how much data has been written to it.
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post #62 of 207
Wow. Some simple maths and you can work that out from the P/E cycles. confused.gif
post #63 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3930K View Post

Wow. Some simple maths and you can work that out from the P/E cycles. confused.gif

Well, I thought it was a given feature by now. but I also don't care that much! As long as my drive lasts at least the 5 year warranty I'm happy. I may even try to hammer it in year 4 and see if I can't get a replacement to last another 5 years biggrin.gif
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post #64 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by psyside View Post

No it does not, anyway i don't want to go in circles, have fun.
Yes it has performed as it was programed to.

They simply improved upon the performance of the drive with newer firmware as a "bonus," just as the Crucial M4 had a performance increase from the 0009 firmware update.

Oh and guys, all SSDs DO slow down when FULL. Want to know why? Because they have no more room to be written to. XD

Seriously tho, when a SSD is near full it will start to slow down as it may not have enough different NAND chips to write separately to, to maintain higher writes as data is written to SSDs kinda in a RAID 0 fashion. Parts are fragmented on multiple NAND chips. When near full some chips may have less or no room to be programed and thus less channels are being used and thus you get slower speeds. This is in terms of write speed however, read speeds should not be affected much if at all.
post #65 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

Yes it has performed as it was programed to.
They simply improved upon the performance of the drive with newer firmware as a "bonus," just as the Crucial M4 had a performance increase from the 0009 firmware update.
Oh and guys, all SSDs DO slow down when FULL. Want to know why? Because they have no more room to be written to. XD
Seriously tho, when a SSD is near full it will start to slow down as it may not have enough different NAND chips to write separately to, to maintain higher writes as data is written to SSDs kinda in a RAID 0 fashion. Parts are fragmented on multiple NAND chips. When near full some chips may have less or no room to be programed and thus less channels are being used and thus you get slower speeds. This is in terms of write speed however, read speeds should not be affected much if at all.

Indeed, all SSD's have firmware updates. All have some marginal slow downs when at 3/4 or full capacity. And no SSD is running full tilt speeds @ launch across all read/write conditions, all SSD's need some kind of firmware tweaks to achieve rated specs. Psyside was singling out the Vertex4 on all these conditions, which is what i had a problem with...since it's the nature of all drives not just the Vertex 4.

One advantage of the V4 is the large 1gb dram cache, something that was missing on previous sandforce based controlled drives. Partly to make smaller SSD drives possible.
 
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post #66 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3930K View Post

What do you get and what do you not?

What does it mean, I'm not too sure. This is a almost week old Vertex 4. Even one of the mods on OCZ forums openly admits that the smart data is very limited. Thats not something where Intel or Samsung cuts corners.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mhill2029 View Post

Indeed, all SSD's have firmware updates. All have some marginal slow downs when at 3/4 or full capacity. And no SSD is running full tilt speeds @ launch across all read/write conditions, all SSD's need some kind of firmware tweaks to achieve rated specs. Psyside was singling out the Vertex4 on all these conditions, which is what i had a problem with...since it's the nature of all drives not just the Vertex 4.

I don't know that is true in the case of Intel or Samsung SSDs. They spend more time with validation and it shows.
Edited by BababooeyHTJ - 8/31/12 at 3:47pm
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post #67 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by BababooeyHTJ View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3930K View Post

What do you get and what do you not?

What does it mean, I'm not too sure. This is a almost week old Vertex 4. Even one of the mods on OCZ forums openly admits that the smart data is very limited. Thats not something where Intel or Samsung cuts corners.
You missed my previous post didn't you?

The Intel 520 has issues with SMART data too. So...to say that it is only OCZ would be false. Intel apparently is cutting corners too eh?

Also, a lot of SSDs are limited on SMART data as well. My Plextor M3 is, however they can add more to it I believe via firmware updates later.
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mhill2029 View Post

Indeed, all SSD's have firmware updates. All have some marginal slow downs when at 3/4 or full capacity. And no SSD is running full tilt speeds @ launch across all read/write conditions, all SSD's need some kind of firmware tweaks to achieve rated specs. Psyside was singling out the Vertex4 on all these conditions, which is what i had a problem with...since it's the nature of all drives not just the Vertex 4.

I don't know that is true in the case of Intel or Samsung SSDs. They spend more time with validation and it shows.

The Intel 520 has had a firmware release to update early bought 520s. The Samsung 830 has had 2 firmware updates, one was simply to fix an issue with the newer firmware when flashing.
post #68 of 207
I am not going to jump into any arguments, but I just feel like I have to say this...

OCZ, like any company, has developed a reputation for producing unreliable drives. The reputation was certainly well earned, but that doesn't mean that it is something that is forever and permanent. It just takes a lot more to recover from a bad reputation than it does to destroy a good one. I can absolutely understand the hesitation for many, myself included, when such a company comes out with a new product saying essentially "buy our awesome new drive that is faster, stronger, and more reliable, but don't worry we have fixed absolutely everything! Trust us".
Time will tell if the drive is one of the best or has some fatal flaw where, a exactly two years from release, it sprouts legs, rapes your dog, and sets fire to your home before running away giggling maniacally. I doubt that this will happen, but hey, maybe that's what the Mayans predicted... wink.gif

I have the Samsung drive because of the fact that I simply think a full in-house design and production is the ideal way to go about producing these types of drives, as well as the fantastic performance and apparent reliability (according to the SSD torture test). To me, reliability is absolutely the most important part of a storage medium, and when a company can make a (thus far) incredibly reliable drive that also happens to sit atop charts across the Web in terms of speed, that is what I buy.

I have nothing against the V4, but I would be very reluctant to spend the money on one when I see a different drivers that better meets MY needs. OCZ is fighting an uphill battle, one that some companies never fully recover from and one that has driven countless others into the annals of history forgotten by the fast paced world we live in.

I do hope that OCZ regains their reputation, and while I may or may not ever purchase from them, I certainly don't want the market to be out one less competitor. Imagine what the CPU and GPU markets would be like if there were even half as many players as in the storage market? I want progress, and the best way to do so is by having multiple companies produce excellent products.

Also, outright speed doesn't mean much now that even budget drives are hitting well over 400MBs Read/Write. I look forward to seeing how companies innovate to set themselves apart.

I hope that this came across as rational and as level headed as I intended, and know that not a single thing I said was out of spite or to flame.
   
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post #69 of 207
I vote for Samsung 830 2cents.gif Just because I had to RMA 2 Agility 2s with OCZ and they tried to deny tongue.gif
PS:I think their stuff is fixed now..I hope.
I just bought 2 Agility 3s ninja.gif
 
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post #70 of 207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

You missed my previous post didn't you?
The Intel 520 has issues with SMART data too. So...to say that it is only OCZ would be false. Intel apparently is cutting corners too eh?
Also, a lot of SSDs are limited on SMART data as well. My Plextor M3 is, however they can add more to it I believe via firmware updates later.

You really should be more specific when you accuse something of having issues. I posted pictures to explain what I was talking about. Also intel has software to test their devices much like every HDD manufacturer has. With OCZ you're stuck with just smart data.
Quote:
The Intel 520 has had a firmware release to update early bought 520s. The Samsung 830 has had 2 firmware updates, one was simply to fix an issue with the newer firmware when flashing.

and how many has the one month old Vertex 4 had? Come on now, don't be ridiculous. There is a reason that Apple uses the 830. There is a reason that Intel's drives are so popular in enterprise applications.

Why do you think Intel took so long to release the 520? Validation, which clearly OCZ doesn't take as seriously. They just attempt to hotfix issues as they pop up in the wild. If you buy a Vertex 4 now, you're beta testing. Thats just the way that OCZ has been with every drive in the past. The Vertex 3 had the notorious sandforce issues. I've heard of issues with the Vertex 2. I was plagued by issues with a first gen Vertex. Their track record is not on par with Samsung and Intel.
Edited by BababooeyHTJ - 8/31/12 at 6:14pm
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