Overclock.net › Forums › Cooling › Water Cooling › Corsair H100 leaked onto my brand new graphics card and motherboard
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Corsair H100 leaked onto my brand new graphics card and motherboard - Page 30  

post #291 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbiker033 View Post

I just read through this whole post, I can't believe I got to the end and didn't see resolution....

Blame corsair......
Chewy's Chomper
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel I7 6700k Asis Z170 Deluxe MSI GTX 1080 Gaming x 16GB Corsair vengence DDR4 3200 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung M2 256gb nvme Custom loop, 360+120 rads Windows 10 64bit Asus 28" MG28UQ 4K 
PowerCase
Seasonic X series 750w gold Corsair 400c 
  hide details  
Chewy's Chomper
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel I7 6700k Asis Z170 Deluxe MSI GTX 1080 Gaming x 16GB Corsair vengence DDR4 3200 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung M2 256gb nvme Custom loop, 360+120 rads Windows 10 64bit Asus 28" MG28UQ 4K 
PowerCase
Seasonic X series 750w gold Corsair 400c 
  hide details  
post #292 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrpdean View Post

Yes I'm starting to think that way myself. I still intend to water cool (otherwise I wouldn't have got the 800D case) and it's looking like custom cooling is the way to go.

I just went custom too, the performance is awesome compared to closed loop (well, so is the cost). I highly recommend it.
Project Obselete
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz Asus Maximus IV Extreme R9 290 R9 290 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16GB G-Skill DDR3 1600MHz 256GB Samsung 830 SSD 512GB Samsung 830 SSD 256 GB Samsung PB22-J SSD 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
1TB Samsung Spinpoint F3 2TB Samsung Spinpoint F4 Asus BW-12B1LT Custom loop with external radbox 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Windows 7 Ultimate x64 Crossover 27Q LED-P Crossover 27Q LED-P Optoma GT720 
PowerCaseAudioOther
Corsair AX1200i Coolermaster HAF X Asus Xonar D2X Highpoint RocketRAID 2680 
  hide details  
Project Obselete
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz Asus Maximus IV Extreme R9 290 R9 290 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16GB G-Skill DDR3 1600MHz 256GB Samsung 830 SSD 512GB Samsung 830 SSD 256 GB Samsung PB22-J SSD 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
1TB Samsung Spinpoint F3 2TB Samsung Spinpoint F4 Asus BW-12B1LT Custom loop with external radbox 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Windows 7 Ultimate x64 Crossover 27Q LED-P Crossover 27Q LED-P Optoma GT720 
PowerCaseAudioOther
Corsair AX1200i Coolermaster HAF X Asus Xonar D2X Highpoint RocketRAID 2680 
  hide details  
post #293 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostrider85 View Post

CORSAIR: you should just be thankful that we are going to pay for you other parts, we are not obliged to do that,

As others have said, a perfectly valid comparison is to a car manufacturer whose faulty product causes loss, and who everyone agrees is liable for that loss. Now legally the waters are a little muddy, in that the retailer is actually responsible for a product regardless of who manufactured it (in UK law at least) - the sale of goods act puts the onus entirely on the retailer - they enter into a contract with you when they take your money and must warrant that the product they sell you is fit for purpose and not dangerous.

A manufacturer warranty actually has no legal basis whatsoever, other than that, once it is given, it is a contract and subject to the usual law of contracts. No manufacturer is obliged (in the UK) to provide any warranty at all (under the sale of goods act), although if they produce a dangerous or defective product, other law may hold them liable.

Under the sale of goods act, a retailer must support the product they sell you for a "reasonable" period of time, that is to say, they must support it for as long as you could "reasonably" expect it to last, so there is obviously a difference in how long you expect say a case fan vs a new car to last. What is "reasonable" is obviously somewhat muddy, and depends on case law to an extent, however if a manufacturer has offered a warranty on a product, then it seems fairly clear to me that this implies that you can expect the product to last as long as that warranty is for and therefore the retailer is liable for that long - never let a retailer tell you that "it's been 2 years, we are not liable, it's the manufacturer" if a product with a longer warranty goes wrong during the warranty period - in the UK at least, the retailer is responsible for what they sell you.

Regardless of whether the retailer is the one directly responsible or not, my view is that, in cases like mrpdean's and mine, Corsair aren't doing anyone a favour by compensating them for consequential damage - they are merely doing the minimum to put right the damage their faulty product caused.

As someone else pointed out, anyone having suffered damage due to the failure of a product from Corsair (or anyone else) should never agree, explicitly or implicitly to any limitation of their liability.

Returning their damage claim form unmodified could be seen as implicit consent to their offer of reduced compensation, so anyone having damaged hardware and receiving that form should return it modified with a clearly worded statement to the effect that they do not consent to any limitation of liability. That way, if legal action subsequently took place, it could not be claimed that you had consented to a reduced offer of compensation.
Edited by BorisTheSpider - 10/12/12 at 6:36am
Project Obselete
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz Asus Maximus IV Extreme R9 290 R9 290 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16GB G-Skill DDR3 1600MHz 256GB Samsung 830 SSD 512GB Samsung 830 SSD 256 GB Samsung PB22-J SSD 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
1TB Samsung Spinpoint F3 2TB Samsung Spinpoint F4 Asus BW-12B1LT Custom loop with external radbox 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Windows 7 Ultimate x64 Crossover 27Q LED-P Crossover 27Q LED-P Optoma GT720 
PowerCaseAudioOther
Corsair AX1200i Coolermaster HAF X Asus Xonar D2X Highpoint RocketRAID 2680 
  hide details  
Project Obselete
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz Asus Maximus IV Extreme R9 290 R9 290 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16GB G-Skill DDR3 1600MHz 256GB Samsung 830 SSD 512GB Samsung 830 SSD 256 GB Samsung PB22-J SSD 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
1TB Samsung Spinpoint F3 2TB Samsung Spinpoint F4 Asus BW-12B1LT Custom loop with external radbox 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Windows 7 Ultimate x64 Crossover 27Q LED-P Crossover 27Q LED-P Optoma GT720 
PowerCaseAudioOther
Corsair AX1200i Coolermaster HAF X Asus Xonar D2X Highpoint RocketRAID 2680 
  hide details  
post #294 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbiker033 View Post

I just read through this whole post, I can't believe I got to the end and didn't see resolution....

Same! Well I won't be buying any of their products in the near future. Funny thing is I was actually looking at their water cooling solutions until this, since they always seem to be on sale. But F that now.
PC
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-6700K ASUS Z170M-PLUS Asus Strix 1070 Gskill 4X4GB DDR4 3000mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial MX100 512GB SSD Plextor M7VC 512GB SSD LG DVD Multi external Noctua NH-U9S + Noctua x2 + Be Quiet x2 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Win-10 Dell S2417DG  Logitech G710+ EVGA 550W Gold  
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Corsair SPEC-M2 Mionix 7000 Razer Sound Blaster Omni USB 
  hide details  
PC
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-6700K ASUS Z170M-PLUS Asus Strix 1070 Gskill 4X4GB DDR4 3000mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial MX100 512GB SSD Plextor M7VC 512GB SSD LG DVD Multi external Noctua NH-U9S + Noctua x2 + Be Quiet x2 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Win-10 Dell S2417DG  Logitech G710+ EVGA 550W Gold  
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Corsair SPEC-M2 Mionix 7000 Razer Sound Blaster Omni USB 
  hide details  
post #295 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by BorisTheSpider View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostrider85 View Post

CORSAIR: you should just be thankful that we are going to pay for you other parts, we are not obliged to do that,

As others have said, a perfectly valid comparison is to a car manufacturer whose faulty product causes loss, and who everyone agrees is liable for that loss. Now legally the waters are a little muddy, in that the retailer is actually responsible for a product regardless of who manufactured it (in UK law at least) - the sale of goods act puts the onus entirely on the retailer - they enter into a contract with you when they take your money and must warrant that the product they sell you is fit for purpose and not dangerous.

A manufacturer warranty actually has no legal basis whatsoever, other than that, once it is given, it is a contract and subject to the usual law of contracts. No manufacturer is obliged (in the UK) to provide any warranty at all (under the sale of goods act), although if they produce a dangerous or defective product, other law may hold them liable.

Under the sale of goods act, a retailer must support the product they sell you for a "reasonable" period of time, that is to say, they must support it for as long as you could "reasonably" expect it to last, so there is obviously a difference in how long you expect say a case fan vs a new car to last. What is "reasonable" is obviously somewhat muddy, and depends on case law to an extent, however if a manufacturer has offered a warranty on a product, then it seems fairly clear to me that this implies that you can expect the product to last as long as that warranty is for and therefore the retailer is liable for that long - never let a retailer tell you that "it's been 2 years, we are not liable, it's the manufacturer" if a product with a longer warranty goes wrong during the warranty period - in the UK at least, the retailer is responsible for what they sell you.

Regardless of whether the retailer is the one directly responsible or not, my view is that, in cases like mrpdean's and mine, Corsair aren't doing anyone a favour by compensating them for consequential damage - they are merely doing the minimum to put right the damage their faulty product caused.

As someone else pointed out, anyone having suffered damage due to the failure of a product from Corsair (or anyone else) should never agree, explicitly or implicitly to any limitation of their liability.

Returning their damage claim form unmodified could be seen as implicit consent to their offer of reduced compensation, so anyone having damaged hardware and receiving that form should return it modified with a clearly worded statement to the effect that they do not consent to any limitation of liability. That way, if legal action subsequently took place, it could not be claimed that you had consented to a reduced offer of compensation.

Great post especially as I live in the UK. I see the grey area with the use of the word 'reasonable' but considering I only got mine last month, I shouldn't need to worry just. So, do you think the retailer would be liable to replace all of your damaged parts (UK) ?
Animus
(22 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 3770K Asus Maximus V Formula Z77 EVGA GTX980Ti SC+ ACX 2.0+ 2 x 4GB Corsair Dominator GT 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 840 Pro 128GB 2 x WD 1TB Blue EZEX RAID0 EK Supremacy - Copper / Acetal EK Titan X & Backplate - Copper / Acetal 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK 360XTX EK Spin Reservoir - Acetal Liang DDC / EK Top EK PSC Compression Fittings 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Professional 64bit 3 x Samsung P2450H 24" Filco Majestouch 2 - Cherry Blues Corsair TX750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Corsair 800D Razer Deathadder 2013 Razer Destructor 2 Creative Titanium HD 
AudioAudio
Fiio E9 Amplifier Beyerdynamic DT880 Premium (600 Ohm) 
  hide details  
Animus
(22 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 3770K Asus Maximus V Formula Z77 EVGA GTX980Ti SC+ ACX 2.0+ 2 x 4GB Corsair Dominator GT 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 840 Pro 128GB 2 x WD 1TB Blue EZEX RAID0 EK Supremacy - Copper / Acetal EK Titan X & Backplate - Copper / Acetal 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK 360XTX EK Spin Reservoir - Acetal Liang DDC / EK Top EK PSC Compression Fittings 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Professional 64bit 3 x Samsung P2450H 24" Filco Majestouch 2 - Cherry Blues Corsair TX750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Corsair 800D Razer Deathadder 2013 Razer Destructor 2 Creative Titanium HD 
AudioAudio
Fiio E9 Amplifier Beyerdynamic DT880 Premium (600 Ohm) 
  hide details  
post #296 of 592
I'd say "this".

usually companies decide to reduce the extent of warranty when the losses are too heavy based on their RMA % and coverage. as many people noticed, Corsair's QC and product quality (cost cutting) went down some time ago and that always results in higher RMA % following. that being said, they cannot afford the full coverage warranty (including collateral damage coverage for leaking sealed water cooling kits), not anymore at least.
Other thing is that warranty on those products got changed without notice, but what about people who bought those products when "full" warranty was part of the product they paid for? I would refuse new warranty terms based on purchase date and date of warranty modification <- that could be a win for people that don't blindly accept the modified terms while returning any singed forms to Corsair.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkstalker420 View Post

I kinda just hope they help this guy out just to save face imho. I would say one of the +'s for these kits IS the fact they are supposed to be SEALED for life so other than if you tamper with them (then i would say you are on your own) OR if there is a FAULT then i feel it is down to the manufacturer because THEY failed to catch the fault in QC so because of there in effect "failure" your parts are damaged.
If the official word from the off was IF IT LEAKS WE REFUND $xxx's That would have been fair enough BUT most of the time people have been getting the FULL cost of the replacement parts. So why now go cheap and start limiting the amount? I would say it's because the failure rate's are starting to go up (you will never get the "official" REAL % of failures). But i have heard more people talking abut failed H80/H100's than ANY of the others (fan controllers/pumps grinding/fans not working/leaks etc).
So that to me says the OEM is cheaping out and going for the cost option rather than quality. BUT if Corsair are continuing to purchase from them/getting them to build the units imho they are asking for it. Pay the better money and get a better OEM to make them. If you have to charge MORE just say "hey guys/gals we have had to go to another OEM fro the H units because of quality issues BUT we will have to put another $xx's on the price BUT for this you will get a better and safer product and the original 100% damages cover will return".
If Corsair put some more money on the price BUT the units were better and the guarantee was reinstated i personally would not mind imho. I have to say though looking at that Cooler Master unit IF they officially state the guarantee WILL cover your rig for leaks i will be all over one:D. It looks like a quality piece of kit AND i would take German engineers over some factory in China any day.
Thanx.
post #297 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

I ordered an 8GB (2x4) Corsair ram kit the other day, when it arrived I found one of the modules to be completely DOA. I RMA'ed it and had another sent, Amazon shipping is crazy fast, and received the replacement today. Guess what? Another bad module in this one as well, it wasn't DOA like the other, it just wasn't stable and failed every test thrown at it....
I have grown to dislike Corsair, they seem to have slipped a long way.

If this is the continuing trend, looks like my last purchase of Corsair will remain from 2010.
Quote:
Originally Posted by feniks View Post

I'd say "this".
usually companies decide to reduce the extent of warranty when the losses are too heavy based on their RMA % and coverage. as many people noticed, Corsair's QC and product quality (cost cutting) went down some time ago and that always results in higher RMA % following. that being said, they cannot afford the full coverage warranty (including collateral damage coverage for leaking sealed water cooling kits), not anymore at least.
Other thing is that warranty on those products got changed without notice, but what about people who bought those products when "full" warranty was part of the product they paid for? I would refuse new warranty terms based on purchase date and date of warranty modification <- that could be a win for people that don't blindly accept the modified terms while returning any singed forms to Corsair.

I can't believe the times have changed. Corsair was that company I always recommended to friends for their hardware and now it appears it's no longer that company. I've been buying their ram since 2003 while some others have more or less went the full route. Case, ram, psu, cooler and fans.
post #298 of 592
It's that that narks me the most. That no one from Corsair made us aware of the change it seems to have been slipped in under the radar. If some guy whos rig got drenched a year ago got FULL compensation why shouldn't this guy NOW?

Thanx.
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD RyZen R7 1700 ASUS ROG Strix B350-F Gaming XFX R9 390 16GB Corsairs Vengence DDR4@3200Mhz 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 840EVO 256GB & Seagate 1TB Corsairs H110i GT Windows 10 Pro SONY 40" V3000 1080p HDTV 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech Wireless Corsairs HX750W K62 Dragonlord Logitech Wireless 
Mouse PadAudio
Steelseries Xonar DSX 
  hide details  
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD RyZen R7 1700 ASUS ROG Strix B350-F Gaming XFX R9 390 16GB Corsairs Vengence DDR4@3200Mhz 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 840EVO 256GB & Seagate 1TB Corsairs H110i GT Windows 10 Pro SONY 40" V3000 1080p HDTV 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech Wireless Corsairs HX750W K62 Dragonlord Logitech Wireless 
Mouse PadAudio
Steelseries Xonar DSX 
  hide details  
post #299 of 592
This whole situation makes me sad considering half of my rig is from Cosair.

Case, PSU, RAM, SSD, CPU cooler....
Animus
(22 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 3770K Asus Maximus V Formula Z77 EVGA GTX980Ti SC+ ACX 2.0+ 2 x 4GB Corsair Dominator GT 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 840 Pro 128GB 2 x WD 1TB Blue EZEX RAID0 EK Supremacy - Copper / Acetal EK Titan X & Backplate - Copper / Acetal 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK 360XTX EK Spin Reservoir - Acetal Liang DDC / EK Top EK PSC Compression Fittings 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Professional 64bit 3 x Samsung P2450H 24" Filco Majestouch 2 - Cherry Blues Corsair TX750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Corsair 800D Razer Deathadder 2013 Razer Destructor 2 Creative Titanium HD 
AudioAudio
Fiio E9 Amplifier Beyerdynamic DT880 Premium (600 Ohm) 
  hide details  
Animus
(22 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 3770K Asus Maximus V Formula Z77 EVGA GTX980Ti SC+ ACX 2.0+ 2 x 4GB Corsair Dominator GT 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 840 Pro 128GB 2 x WD 1TB Blue EZEX RAID0 EK Supremacy - Copper / Acetal EK Titan X & Backplate - Copper / Acetal 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK 360XTX EK Spin Reservoir - Acetal Liang DDC / EK Top EK PSC Compression Fittings 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Professional 64bit 3 x Samsung P2450H 24" Filco Majestouch 2 - Cherry Blues Corsair TX750 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Corsair 800D Razer Deathadder 2013 Razer Destructor 2 Creative Titanium HD 
AudioAudio
Fiio E9 Amplifier Beyerdynamic DT880 Premium (600 Ohm) 
  hide details  
post #300 of 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crooksy View Post

So, do you think the retailer would be liable to replace all of your damaged parts (UK) ?

It's a tough one - yes, the retailer is entirely responsible under the sale of goods act. The problem is that you likely can't afford what it would cost to undertake legal action in the event it was necessary, the cost of replacing your damaged build yourself could easily be dwarfed by the cost of legal action.

Sure, in the UK, you could represent yourself in the small claims court - I believe the current limit for the small claims court is up to £5000. The problem is that without adequate legal representation, and against a company that can afford expensive lawyers (and may subsequently try to pursue you for their costs if they win the case, which they likely will just because they have more money and therefore better lawyers), you are pretty much shafted - the risk of being pursued for outrageous legal costs that will not just see you out of your PC, but also your house, is just too high - it's my view that the legal system is completely broken in this regard. I do understand that it's not normal practice in the small claims court for the winning party to be awarded costs, but I don't know enough about it to know with what frequency it does happen - if it was even 1%, do you want to take a risk of getting landed with a huge bill for someone elses lawyer?

The only hope for most people would be some sort of no-win-no-fee lawyer, with indemnity insurance against the other parties legal costs if you lose.

So yeah, perhaps the retailer are responsible for compensating you, but good luck actually getting your money...

I may seem gloomy about all this, but it's not without cause - I had a retailer refuse to comply with the very clear requirements of the Distance Selling Regulations a year or two back, believe me, once you've seen how Trading Standards treat consumers in cases like this, you will exercise greater caution in your buying decisions rather than assuming that if you need to resort to the law it will support you. I ended up selling my brand new items on ebay at a 40% loss, because despite the absolutely clarity of the case, and the extensive documentation I had, and the pristine condition of the products I wanted to return, no-one with the ability to bring any pressure to bear on the retailer would do so.

I suspect, perhaps, the reason Corsair have stopped offering full compensation is what others have speculated - the manufacturing standard may have gone down, hence RMA claims have gone up, and they are in tough financial times. I have no idea of Corsairs financial state, but if the reason for this cost-cutting exercise was that they are close to the bone, this whole exercise seems to have backfired rather badly.
Project Obselete
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz Asus Maximus IV Extreme R9 290 R9 290 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16GB G-Skill DDR3 1600MHz 256GB Samsung 830 SSD 512GB Samsung 830 SSD 256 GB Samsung PB22-J SSD 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
1TB Samsung Spinpoint F3 2TB Samsung Spinpoint F4 Asus BW-12B1LT Custom loop with external radbox 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Windows 7 Ultimate x64 Crossover 27Q LED-P Crossover 27Q LED-P Optoma GT720 
PowerCaseAudioOther
Corsair AX1200i Coolermaster HAF X Asus Xonar D2X Highpoint RocketRAID 2680 
  hide details  
Project Obselete
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
i7 2600k @ 4.6GHz Asus Maximus IV Extreme R9 290 R9 290 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16GB G-Skill DDR3 1600MHz 256GB Samsung 830 SSD 512GB Samsung 830 SSD 256 GB Samsung PB22-J SSD 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
1TB Samsung Spinpoint F3 2TB Samsung Spinpoint F4 Asus BW-12B1LT Custom loop with external radbox 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Windows 7 Ultimate x64 Crossover 27Q LED-P Crossover 27Q LED-P Optoma GT720 
PowerCaseAudioOther
Corsair AX1200i Coolermaster HAF X Asus Xonar D2X Highpoint RocketRAID 2680 
  hide details  
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Water Cooling
This thread is locked  
Overclock.net › Forums › Cooling › Water Cooling › Corsair H100 leaked onto my brand new graphics card and motherboard