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[TF] IMAGiNE BitTorrent Piracy Group Members All Plead Guilty - Page 13

post #121 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by admflameberg View Post

As well people being too cheap to buy the music or the movie. Simply if you cant afford the cd or the movie. Then learn to do without it.

Let's assume (God forbid) that I will never ever have the money to buy a game I want. So I pirate it. Has the company lost anything? No. You know why? Because I never had the money to give them in the first place, nor will I in the future. So in either case they weren't hurt by my actions.

Now let's assume (God willing) that I will always have disposable income no matter what. I see a game I want. So I pirate it. Has the company lost anything. Yes. You know why? Because I did have the money to give them in the first place and I will in the future. So the company did lost the sale there.
post #122 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Homeles View Post


Whaaa? To me, you might as well be claiming the Holocaust never existed.

The war on drugs definitely happened, it's just that the ones fighting it aren't honest about what's really going on and what their motives are.  Same thing with this anti-piracy nonsense.

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post #123 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post

Piracy is the theft of control over distribution, not the theft of the product itself.

Best post in the whole thread, and I haven't even read the whole thread. On a related note, knocking these guys down doesn't really do much, since they're too close to the bottom of the food chain. The true targets should be those who get hold of a film before it's even hit the big screen - but that means going after the studios, and Hollywood isn't going to police itself now is it?

If you don't believe me, look here. It's a really good read from 2005. I can't imagine (*cough*) that much has changed, since the MPAA has always targeted the wrong people.

Quick quote (emphasis added):
Quote:
Once a file is posted to a topsite, it starts a rapid descent through wider and wider levels of an invisible network, multiplying exponentially along the way. At each step, more and more pirates pitch in to keep the avalanche tumbling downward. Finally, thousands, perhaps millions, of copies - all the progeny of that original file - spill into the public peer-to-peer networks: Kazaa, LimeWire, Morpheus. Without this duplication and distribution structure providing content, the P2P networks would run dry. (BitTorrent, a faster and more efficient type of P2P file-sharing, is an exception. But at present there are far fewer BitTorrent users.)

It's a commonly held belief that P2P is about sharing files. It's an appealing, democratic notion: Consumers rip the movies and music they buy and post them online. But that's not quite how it works.

In reality, the number of files on the Net ripped from store-bought CDs, DVDs, and videogames is statistically negligible. People don't share what they buy; they share what is already being shared - the countless descendants of a single "Adam and Eve" file. Even this is probably stolen; pirates have infiltrated the entertainment industry and usually obtain and rip content long before the public ever has a chance to buy it.
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post #124 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by MGX1016 View Post

A collective buy in order to rip and share is stealing. Yes these scene groups are the #1 target of the MPAA / RIAA but since the RIAA/MPAA is just lazy and damn ignorant they will chase everyday guys like you and me even if we are innocent and never pirated a single thing you might still get a threatening letter and told you will be sued.
It's complete BS look at cracker groups like RAZOR1911, SKIDROW, nHD .... those are your targets.. but at the same time don't forget the bigger the guys you attack the harder it is

I wish people would just use the correct terminology and then argue about morality or ethics.

Because it is not, legally, by definition, theft. Copyright infringement is a completely different legal term. At its most basic level theft if depriving someone of property, i.e. I steal your car, you no longer have the car and I do. Infringement is copying without permission. I did not pay the copyright owner to use their work.

Now if you want to argue that copyright infringment is morally equivelent to theft, then fine, you can make that argument. But please people, even though many will ignore this, let us try and use the correct terms, ok?
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post #125 of 202
@mygaffer

100% correct. Within the bounds of our monetary system, copyright infringement is tantamount to denial of income, but that is NOT the same as theft of income. More accurately though, copyright infringement is exactly that and no more. Even if the product being copied was available free of charge anyway, infringing the right to copy is infringing the right to copy.

It is NOT theft, and therefore by definition, not piracy either. Piracy is just a convenient term used to describe copyright infringement and the (commonly) subsequent denial of income.
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post #126 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifeshield View Post

That really depends on the film in question. biggrin.gif

Exactly ...

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post #127 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifeshield View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by joshd View Post

You can't kill someone with a .mp4 movie.

That really depends on the film in question. biggrin.gif
I saw many brave souls perish watching son of mask. Lets not forget the fallen and underestimate the killing powers of an .mp4
post #128 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Usario View Post

"PEOPLE ARE DOWNLOADING OUR GARBAGE FOR FREE??? PUNISH THE PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY PAY FOR IT!!!"

You mean like the people who legally buy firearms in the United States? It is a LOT easier for me to go out and buy an illegal M4 for $2200 than it is for me to get photographed, finger printed, pay upwards of $300 in processing fees, wait upwards of 6 months for the Local, State, and Federal Law Enforcement officers to do a background check on me (even though I have 5 Title II weapons already), then have to pay a $200 "Tax Stamp", THEN pay upwards of $15,000 for a LEGAL M4 ... even though I have a Constitutional Right to Keep and Bear Arms?

But I digress.

I won't go into how unconstitutional that process is, and that's a state issue. iirc you can buy any semi-auto no questions asked in vermont. el bloombito thinks that nyc is a city state so he's made it virtually impossible to have anything but a shotgun or rifle legally here, and you have to go through some ridiculous methods of transportation if you plan on ever taking it out of your home.
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshd View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

You mean like the people who legally buy firearms in the United States? It is a LOT easier for me to go out and buy an illegal M4 for $2200 than it is for me to get photographed, finger printed, pay upwards of $300 in processing fees, wait upwards of 6 months for the Local, State, and Federal Law Enforcement officers to do a background check on me (even though I have 5 Title II weapons already), then have to pay a $200 "Tax Stamp", THEN pay upwards of $15,000 for a LEGAL M4 ... even though I have a Constitutional Right to Keep and Bear Arms?
But I digress.

You can't kill someone with a .mp4 movie.

That too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradigm84 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by joshd View Post

You can't kill someone with a .mp4 movie.

But you can with .avi.

thegrifter.avi did result in the death of quite a few people...
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post #129 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by [Adz] View Post

Distribution is a right. You cannot steal a right, you can only infringe on it.

Now that is semantics.

By the same measure, theft is infringement of one's right of ownership/continued use.
Quote:
Originally Posted by [Adz] View Post

Thanks for playing.

cfc.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mygaffer View Post

I wish people would just use the correct terminology and then argue about morality or ethics.

Morality and ethics are subjective and barely the purview of law anyway, it's largely senseless to argue them at all.
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post #130 of 202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post

Morality and ethics are subjective and barely the purview of law anyway, it's largely senseless to argue them at all.

Lots of laws are concerned with ethics and morality. For example laws concerning murder, suicide, abortion, theft. Then in other countries, illegalising homosexuality, cutting off thieves' hands, throwing women in jail for driving...

I think morality and ethics shouldn't affect the law but they do and they will.
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