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Input on a friend's build

post #1 of 14
Thread Starter 
He is going for a system specifically to play Borderlands 2 on a 24" 1920x1080. I'd like to give him as much bang for his buck as possible so I'd like as much extra in the gpu as possible without breaking the bank. He also specifically wanted to future-proof the ram with 16gb (2x8gb). He liked the idea of a black case without a side window. Air cooling only.


CPU: Core i5 2500K $200
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D14 $84.32
Mobo: AsRock Z77 Pro3 $95
Ram: G-Skill Ripjaws 16gb (2x8gb) 1600mhz cas10 $80
GPU: Gigabyte 660Ti 2gb $300 (Includes Borderlands 2) ($15 MIR)
PSU: Corsair TX650 V2 $90 ($10 MIR)
Case: NZXT Source 210 Black $40
DVD Burner: Sony Optiarc 24x $17.99
Monitor: Asus 24" 1920x1080 LED HDMI $170 ($15 MIR)
Speakers: Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 THX $93.98
SSD: Samsung 830 128gb $94
HDD: Seagate 1tb 7200rpm $80
Keyboard/Mouse: Generic Microsoft Wired $20

Shipping $11.53

Rough Total: $1376.82

-$40 Total MIRs

Total $1336.82

Can we do better?
Edited by ChickenInferno - 9/15/12 at 6:07pm
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post #2 of 14
16GB is not going to future proof anything.
post #3 of 14
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by azeem40 View Post

16GB is not going to future proof anything.

It will future proof his need for ram. With 16gb being much more than he needs (but not substantially increasing the cost), it means that even if applications in the next ten years start exploding in their need for ram, then he shouldn't need to upgrade. Also since it's 2x8gb, it leaves 2 slots open for future upgrading if absolutely necessary. He's planning on using this computer for 10 years without upgrading anything besides the OS. The difference in ram from 2002 to 2012 was huge; we are hoping that 16gb will be enough until 2022.

Edit: Typo
Edited by ChickenInferno - 9/15/12 at 3:25pm
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post #4 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChickenInferno View Post

It will future proof his need for ram. With 16gb being much more than he needs (but not substantially increasing the cost), it means that even if applications in the next ten years start exploding in their need for ram, then he shouldn't need to upgrade. Also since it's 2x8gb, it leaves 2 slots open for future upgrading if absolutely necessary. He's planning on using this computer for 10 years without upgrading anything besides the OS. The difference in ram from 2002 to 2012 was huge; we are hoping that 16gb will be enough until 2022.
Edit: Typo

You still aren't going to future proof your RAM. Your logic you are missing some important factors, such as ram speed, DDR3 vs DDR4, the manufacturing process of the ram itself, and etc.

RAM itself will change, and the programmers will take advantage of newer ram technology, not more ram.

Taking the money and putting it into getting a GTX 660 ti or a AMD 7950 would be a much more practical application of your friends money then on ram. Or if you save enough, newegg is having a sale on GTX 670s that you could take advantage of.

Lastly, your hope that the PC is going to last ten years is not going to happen.....period. In ten years we will have budget laptops that would be more powerful then that desktop. Seriously, even in 4 years we will have skylake CPUs from intel and god only knows what from nvidia and this desktop will look like a joke by comparison. Heck even my rig would be a joke by comparison.

Long story short, you either need to dump about 5K into a build to have a slight hope of future proofing the system, or give up trying to future proof all together. No one can really future proof a gaming computer. You might be able to future proof a basic family computer, but as soon as you start playing games, you are looking at paying 200 bucks every two years on upgrades or more.
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post #5 of 14
Thread Starter 
Let me make this clear: My friend is building a computer now and will use it for 10 years. We are not trying to make sure that it is still good in 10 years; we are simply attempting to make it still run basic operations respectably in 10 years. Again, we are not attempting to make a computer that would be able to play new games in 10 yrs.

With the idea in mind that the computer will not be changed (as in the motherboard will not be changed), we are set to max out the ram slots (they can handle 8gb sticks are we are using 8gb sticks). Posting about the ram is irrelevant anyways. The only reason I said anything about it at all was to stop people from saying that I should cut it down to 8gb (2x4gb) and save money there. The difference in price here is also $30 between 8gb and 16gb...that difference is small enough that he is opting to go with more.

So to the real point of this thread, what if any parts would you consider changing and why?


Edit: Also remember that programmers do indeed utilize more ram. In 2003ish, I built with a huge excess of ram at 1gb in RIMM sticks. 1gb is barely enough to run windows now. With an excess (16gb) in 2012, hopefully he will still be able to run windows easily in 2022.
Edited by ChickenInferno - 9/15/12 at 4:31pm
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Gaming PC / HTPC
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 7700k Asus Prime Z270-A GB Auros-X 1080 Ti G-Skill (2x8gb) 3000mhz  
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Samsung 850 Western Digital 5900rpm Seagate 7200rpm LG 22x DVD Burner 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Noctua NH-D14 Win 10 x64 Pro LG 55" 4k B6 OLED Microsoft Desktop 400 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair TX750 V2 NZXT Source 210 Microsoft Desktop 400 Black 
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Custom Surround 5.1 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel 2120T Biostar H61MH Intel HD 2000 G-Skill F3-12800CL9D-8GBXL  
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post #6 of 14
Ok......

well if nothing else newegg is having a sale on the samsung 830 SSD for 90 bucks. It is actually a faster drive for less money, so that is a simple decision right there thumb.gif

Next, I would SERIOUSLY recommend that you get at least a GTX 660 ti or a AMD 7950. If you plan on trying to make the PC last 10 years, you can at least try to make it run new games for as long as you can. NCIX will sometimes run special sales on the 7950, and since they are very good overclockers, you should get some good mileage out of it.

Switch your ram to this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231558 the reason why is because the current ram you have won't work with the D14 air cooler.

Next, (and I have a feeling you aren't going to like this one) http://www.buy.com/prod/asus-vs239h-p-23-led-lcd-monitor-16-9-5-ms-adjustable-display-angle/233433229.html?listingId=-1 go with this screen. While the screen you picked out was a good deal and a good size, the image quality on this screen is going to be far superior. For starters the 23 inch monitor has an IPS panel which is a much better type of screen than a TN panel which is what you have in the 24 inch screen. The other factor is that you will have higher pixel density on a 23 inch monitor than you would on a 24 inch monitor. Higher pixel density plus an IPS panel will make for a much sharper image.

While it is true that you would loose an inch in terms of panel size, an inch isn't all that noticeable.

Lastly, change the PSU. http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=55515&vpn=PPCMK2S750&manufacture=PC%20Power%20%26%20Cooling&promoid=1267 Simply put, more watts, more efficiency, less money, great quality, on sale. How can you say no smile.gif

All I can say is I wish you luck in your ten year journey. If programmers get lazy and Moore's Law takes a holiday, you might make it happen.
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Yin&Yang
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post #7 of 14
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tjj226 Angel View Post

Ok......
well if nothing else newegg is having a sale on the samsung 830 SSD for 90 bucks. It is actually a faster drive for less money, so that is a simple decision right there thumb.gif
Next, I would SERIOUSLY recommend that you get at least a GTX 660 ti or a AMD 7950. If you plan on trying to make the PC last 10 years, you can at least try to make it run new games for as long as you can. NCIX will sometimes run special sales on the 7950, and since they are very good overclockers, you should get some good mileage out of it.
Switch your ram to this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231558 the reason why is because the current ram you have won't work with the D14 air cooler.
Next, (and I have a feeling you aren't going to like this one) http://www.buy.com/prod/asus-vs239h-p-23-led-lcd-monitor-16-9-5-ms-adjustable-display-angle/233433229.html?listingId=-1 go with this screen. While the screen you picked out was a good deal and a good size, the image quality on this screen is going to be far superior. For starters the 23 inch monitor has an IPS panel which is a much better type of screen than a TN panel which is what you have in the 24 inch screen. The other factor is that you will have higher pixel density on a 23 inch monitor than you would on a 24 inch monitor. Higher pixel density plus an IPS panel will make for a much sharper image.
While it is true that you would loose an inch in terms of panel size, an inch isn't all that noticeable.
Lastly, change the PSU. http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=55515&vpn=PPCMK2S750&manufacture=PC%20Power%20%26%20Cooling&promoid=1267 Simply put, more watts, more efficiency, less money, great quality, on sale. How can you say no smile.gif
All I can say is I wish you luck in your ten year journey. If programmers get lazy and Moore's Law takes a holiday, you might make it happen.

The Samsung 830 deal is definitely a go.

I've used Ripjaws with a Noctua NH-D14 before so I know that there isn't a height issue. Compatibility List

Looking at the 660TI 2gb: the problem I had was trying to convince him to spend more on a GPU. I might be able to convince him of Gigabyte 660Ti 2gb $285 after MIR and includes Borderlands 2. If I can convince him it's slightly cheaper since it includes the game he might go for it. I also looked at the 7950 3gb's but none of them include borderlands 2.

The IPS panel I completely agree with and will see what he says. I didn't think we'd be able to get a decent IPS for less than $220, which is where he starts to get iffy.

The PSU is out of stock. If there is a different vendor or one that you recommend, I'm open to it. The corsair was picked because I've used it before and it had a $10 MIR making it only $80.
Edited by ChickenInferno - 9/15/12 at 6:58pm
Gaming PC / HTPC
(17 items)
 
Bedroom PC
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 7700k Asus Prime Z270-A GB Auros-X 1080 Ti G-Skill (2x8gb) 3000mhz  
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Samsung 850 Western Digital 5900rpm Seagate 7200rpm LG 22x DVD Burner 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Noctua NH-D14 Win 10 x64 Pro LG 55" 4k B6 OLED Microsoft Desktop 400 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair TX750 V2 NZXT Source 210 Microsoft Desktop 400 Black 
Audio
Custom Surround 5.1 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel 2120T Biostar H61MH Intel HD 2000 G-Skill F3-12800CL9D-8GBXL  
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Samsung Evo 128gb Asus 24x DVD Burner Stock Win 10 x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
LG 40" 1080p HP Wireless Keyboard/Mouse Silverstone 400W ST40F-ES Silverstone ML03B 
Other
Linksys WMP600N Wireless Card 
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Reply
Gaming PC / HTPC
(17 items)
 
Bedroom PC
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 7700k Asus Prime Z270-A GB Auros-X 1080 Ti G-Skill (2x8gb) 3000mhz  
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Samsung 850 Western Digital 5900rpm Seagate 7200rpm LG 22x DVD Burner 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Noctua NH-D14 Win 10 x64 Pro LG 55" 4k B6 OLED Microsoft Desktop 400 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair TX750 V2 NZXT Source 210 Microsoft Desktop 400 Black 
Audio
Custom Surround 5.1 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel 2120T Biostar H61MH Intel HD 2000 G-Skill F3-12800CL9D-8GBXL  
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Samsung Evo 128gb Asus 24x DVD Burner Stock Win 10 x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
LG 40" 1080p HP Wireless Keyboard/Mouse Silverstone 400W ST40F-ES Silverstone ML03B 
Other
Linksys WMP600N Wireless Card 
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post #8 of 14
Go for a Nvidia card 660 ti or higher and you'll get a free copy of Borderlands 2 with the promo going on right now.

Edit: Looks like this has already been mentioned.
post #9 of 14
Whats the max budget we got to work with chicken?
post #10 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChickenInferno View Post

The Samsung 830 deal is definitely a go.
I've used Ripjaws with a Noctua NH-D14 before so I know that there isn't a height issue. Compatibility List
Looking at the 660TI 2gb: the problem I had was trying to convince him to spend more on a GPU. I might be able to convince him of Gigabyte 660Ti 2gb $285 after MIR and includes Borderlands 2. If I can convince him it's slightly cheaper since it includes the game he might go for it. I also looked at the 7950 3gb's but none of them include borderlands 2.
The IPS panel I completely agree with and will see what he says. I didn't think we'd be able to get a decent IPS for less than $220, which is where Tom starts to get iffy.
The PSU is out of stock. If there is a different vendor or one that you recommend, I'm open to it. The corsair was picked because I've used it before and it had a $10 MIR making it only $80.

How about making that last push for a 7950 with a cheaper PSU? http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=60330&vpn=CMPSU-600CXV2&manufacture=Corsair&promoid=1267
Yin&Yang
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Soon
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 4820K Gigabyte X79 UP4 GTX 660 (waiting for new AMD cards) Samsung green  
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Adata SP900  Seagate 2TB hard drive (the power of 1 edition)  Custom WC Loop Linux (various versions) 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Samsung SyncMaster T240HD Coolermaster XT Green switches XFX 1000w Corsair 800D 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
Razer Naga Epic 2014 edition Razer Vespula Stax Lambda Nova Classic Custom DIY DAC 
AudioAudioOther
300b PP monoblocks Snell J3 NZXT Hue 
CPUCPUMotherboardGraphics
8 core xeon E6 @ 3.5ghz 8 core xeon E6 @ 3.5ghz EVGA X99 SR?  AMD 390x 
GraphicsRAMHard DriveCooling
AMD 390x 128 GB ECC DDR4  1TB PCI-e SSD Custom WC Loop 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Linux 16:10 Samsung PLS 4K monitor Corsair RGB keyboard with custom cherry MX supe... EVGA 1600 watt titanium  
CaseMouseAudio
Caselabs Magnum STH10 DIY my own mouse Snell J 3 
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Yin&Yang
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Soon
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 4820K Gigabyte X79 UP4 GTX 660 (waiting for new AMD cards) Samsung green  
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Adata SP900  Seagate 2TB hard drive (the power of 1 edition)  Custom WC Loop Linux (various versions) 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Samsung SyncMaster T240HD Coolermaster XT Green switches XFX 1000w Corsair 800D 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
Razer Naga Epic 2014 edition Razer Vespula Stax Lambda Nova Classic Custom DIY DAC 
AudioAudioOther
300b PP monoblocks Snell J3 NZXT Hue 
CPUCPUMotherboardGraphics
8 core xeon E6 @ 3.5ghz 8 core xeon E6 @ 3.5ghz EVGA X99 SR?  AMD 390x 
GraphicsRAMHard DriveCooling
AMD 390x 128 GB ECC DDR4  1TB PCI-e SSD Custom WC Loop 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Linux 16:10 Samsung PLS 4K monitor Corsair RGB keyboard with custom cherry MX supe... EVGA 1600 watt titanium  
CaseMouseAudio
Caselabs Magnum STH10 DIY my own mouse Snell J 3 
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