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[PCMag] Apple's Schiller: iPhone 5 Scratching, Chipping Is 'Normal' - Page 10

post #91 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocmi_teddy View Post

I have no idea why anyone would ever have their phone without a case. , but its pretty bad if they're arriving scratched while still in the packaging.

They are starting to make most other phones more sturdy so that cases are not really needed as much. I was using an Otter Box on my Photon 4G and that thing was getting annoying and now I've since then taken off the Otter Box and my phone looks and feels so sleek and sexy biggrin.gif

Chipping is normal? (insert annoying loud laugh here- Preferable Eddie Murphy's Axel Foley laugh... reapeated for 10 hours straight on loop played consecutively in shifts for 1000 years)
    
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post #92 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

Those profit margins assume people purchase these out of contract and at full retail....
Let's be real, how many people are actually going to be doing that? A stab in the dark, I am thinking a low single digit percentage. Now let's look at the contract subsidized cost....
If Apple were to get every penny the customer spends on the 16GB model, they would be losing $8, now factor that $8 over tens of millions of units, that adds up fast. Looking at the other higher end models, Apple appears to make a small profit per device.

Actually, Apple gets full price for every device. The carrier pays for most of your phone for you when you renew your contract, thus high termination fees (They need to recoup their upfront cost). Then cell phone plan prices are calculated to recoup that cost over 2 years. This is partially why european plans are so cheap, as carriers usually offer no subsidy on phones. If you price out the Walmart $45 month to month unlimited everything plan plus the cost of an iPhone at full retail, against a subsidized iPhone on AT&T and a cheap individual plan, the difference is roughly $20 over 2 years. Note, that was a comparison I did last year on last year's prices and not factoring in 4G benefits.
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post #93 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

Those profit margins assume people purchase these out of contract and at full retail....
Let's be real, how many people are actually going to be doing that? A stab in the dark, I am thinking a low single digit percentage. Now let's look at the contract subsidized cost....
If Apple were to get every penny the customer spends on the 16GB model, they would be losing $8, now factor that $8 over tens of millions of units, that adds up fast. Looking at the other higher end models, Apple appears to make a small profit per device.

Yep, as a few others mentioned, Apple DOES get their money for their phones. The carriers cover that. Also, A LOT more than single digits are phones sold at retail price. There were millions sold the first week. I bet the majority of those people were not at the end of their contract to get the subsidized phone pricing. I know many people that went from an iPhone 4 or 4S to the iPhone 5 that couldn't have had their phone for the 2 years necessary to get the $199 pricing.
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post #94 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnrulyCactus View Post

Yep, as a few others mentioned, Apple DOES get their money for their phones. The carriers cover that. Also, A LOT more than single digits are phones sold at retail price. There were millions sold the first week. I bet the majority of those people were not at the end of their contract to get the subsidized phone pricing. I know many people that went from an iPhone 4 or 4S to the iPhone 5 that couldn't have had their phone for the 2 years necessary to get the $199 pricing.

I came really close to doing this. My 4S would have sold for $450 easy (64gb version), bringing down the out of pocket cost to $200.

Actually, I'm realizing that's less than I thought... Im literally now considering it since I have 4G LTE here...
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post #95 of 200
Why not a Lumia 920 and problem solved? why are you buying this Apple crap? They are just milking the market with this one!
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post #96 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dronac View Post

Actually, Apple gets full price for every device. The carrier pays for most of your phone for you when you renew your contract, thus high termination fees (They need to recoup their upfront cost). Then cell phone plan prices are calculated to recoup that cost over 2 years. This is partially why european plans are so cheap, as carriers usually offer no subsidy on phones. If you price out the Walmart $45 month to month unlimited everything plan plus the cost of an iPhone at full retail, against a subsidized iPhone on AT&T and a cheap individual plan, the difference is roughly $20 over 2 years. Note, that was a comparison I did last year on last year's prices and not factoring in 4G benefits.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UnrulyCactus View Post

Yep, as a few others mentioned, Apple DOES get their money for their phones. The carriers cover that. Also, A LOT more than single digits are phones sold at retail price. There were millions sold the first week. I bet the majority of those people were not at the end of their contract to get the subsidized phone pricing. I know many people that went from an iPhone 4 or 4S to the iPhone 5 that couldn't have had their phone for the 2 years necessary to get the $199 pricing.

See, I wasn't 100% on how the agreement between Apple and the carrier worked, although this does lead to another question. Are the carriers paying Apple their manufacturing cost or the full retail, up to $849 per phone? I would think it would be at or just above Apple's cost, and then Apple and the carrier split in some fashion the profit in the rare case someone purchases out of contract.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scars Unseen View Post

Just putting this out there: how is "because better materials would cost more" a valid defense of something billed as a premium product sold by a company for embarrassingly high profit margins? Apple is in this to make money, sure. But they are doing this by selling a product, and you don't (or shouldn't) screw over your customers by using an unsuitable material for what is supposed be a high quality piece of equipment.
I love how Apple is the modern Bose.

This isn't unique to Apple, not by a long shot. As has been stated many times, the choice of material was done for very good reason. You can only go so thin and so light with glass and other materials. Eventually you are going to have to make a decision as to what features you want and you will have give and take. There are materials that can be just as thin, as light, and stronger than the route they chose. Unfortunately for all parties the cost to use these materials would be ridiculous, and as you said, Apple is in it to make money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsm106 View Post

Here you are defending them over and over. thumb.gif

I am not defending Apple, I am defending the material they used. Frankly every phone I have purchased, all of the premium level, have scratched or chipped. Admittedly I am a bit rough on my devices, so it doesn't concern myself, but I also understand certain materials and do my research before a purchase. I wouldn't expect an aluminum phone to hold up, aluminium is soft, it scratches, it bends, it can chip. People want thinner and lighter, always wanting the next to be thinner and lighter. Well guess what? You can't get it all, there are going to be trade offs, want ultra thin and ultra light at a reasonable price? There are only so many materials that a manufacturer is going to use.....

Are there better materials? Yea, there are! Do they cost more? Many times more! Not just in initial acquisition but in working costs, all adding up. Aluminum is low cost, light, thin, and easy to work with. It will hold up, but a ultra thin anodizing coating isn't. Could Apple used a process that had a more durable result on the anodizing? Maybe.
Edited by PostalTwinkie - 9/25/12 at 10:06pm
    
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post #97 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

Those profit margins assume people purchase these out of contract and at full retail....
Let's be real, how many people are actually going to be doing that? A stab in the dark, I am thinking a low single digit percentage. Now let's look at the contract subsidized cost....
If Apple were to get every penny the customer spends on the 16GB model, they would be losing $8, now factor that $8 over tens of millions of units, that adds up fast. Looking at the other higher end models, Apple appears to make a small profit per device.
Because........ They do. In the usa, carriers subsidize the cost to make their data plans more appealing and accessible... Apple still gets their money even if only some of its from u
    
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post #98 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Xeb View Post

IT IS ALUMINUM! i tell you what, take an aluminum ball and anodize it. Then drop it on concrete a few times. IT IS NORMAL FOR IT TO SCRATCH AND CHIP. Take a piece of aluminum wire and bend it over and over again. It will break rather quickly. Now take a coat hanger (made of iron) and do the same thing. it will bend back and forth a LOT before breaking. it is just what it does. I expected this from reading about it. The ipads chip all the time, but because it is all the same color, it goes unnoticed by most people. Same for Macbook Pros and whatnot. 

This is not a design flaw or an oversight. Anodized aluminum just shows all its dents, nicks, chips, and scratches much easier. 

What about the ones coming out of the box that are chipped?
    
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post #99 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrews2547 View Post

What about the ones coming out of the box that are chipped?
Just defective units.
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post #100 of 200
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardv View Post

Why not a Lumia 920 and problem solved? why are you buying this Apple POS? They are just milking the market with this one!

Mostly because of the OS. Throw iOS on it natively and it'd be a viable option. I use OS X primarily, and iOS provides a level of effortless integration that I can't get anywhere else.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post


See, I wasn't 100% on how the agreement between Apple and the carrier worked, although this does lead to another question. Are the carriers paying Apple their manufacturing cost or the full retail, up to $849 per phone? I would think it would be at or just above Apple's cost, and then Apple and the carrier split in some fashion the profit in the rare case someone purchases out of contract.

This isn't unique to Apple, not by a long shot. As has been stated many times, the choice of material was done for very good reason. You can only go so thin and so light with glass and other materials. Eventually you are going to have to make a decision as to what features you want and you will have give and take. There are materials that can be just as thin, as light, and stronger than the route they chose. Unfortunately for all parties the cost to use these materials would be ridiculous, and as you said, Apple is in it to make money.
I am not defending Apple, I am defending the material they used. Frankly every phone I have purchased, all of the premium level, have scratched or chipped. Admittedly I am a bit rough on my devices, so it doesn't concern myself, but I also understand certain materials and do my research before a purchase. I wouldn't expect an aluminum phone to hold up, aluminium is soft, it scratches, it bends, it can chip. People want thinner and lighter, always wanting the next to be thinner and lighter. Well guess what? You can't get it all, there are going to be trade offs, want ultra thin and ultra light at a reasonable price? There are only so many materials that a manufacturer is going to use.....
Are there better materials? Yea, there are! Do they cost more? Many times more! Not just in initial acquisition but in working costs, all adding up. Aluminum is low cost, light, thin, and easy to work with. It will hold up, but a ultra thin anodizing coating isn't. Could Apple used a process that had a more durable result on the anodizing? Maybe.

Yeah, the carriers pretty much make nothing off phones. It's the same as other retailers selling consoles and TV's. You make more selling the extended warranty and accessories than you do off the device itself.
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