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[Build Log] Merlin (Water Cooled r-atx SM8 w/dual Pedestals / Z97X-UD5H) - Page 65

post #641 of 2434
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryanisleet View Post

Nice build thumb.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerocool135 View Post

Looking good wish i had the ability to do a caselabs build but dont have the money right now but when i do i will definitely be taking some ideas from yours if thats ok.
Thanks, guys.
Quote:
Originally Posted by socketus View Post

@ zerocool135 - I'm sure that it is, but @ Mandrix - I'd pm a certain IT Diva about your electronic situation - she's on top of that kind of stuff.
Certainly an idea, but not sure how much she knows about the Aquaero, though, since she doesn't have one.
post #642 of 2434
I'll look into the issue for you, Mandrix. Electricity being my strong point. tongue.gif I don't have experience with the Aquaero, but if I can find a solid schematic and add it to the picture you put up, I can probably figure it out for you. I'll let you know.
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post #643 of 2434
Thread Starter 
Thanks, Addiction.
Here's a schematic I found of the older Aquaero showing alternate ways of wiring the relay for shutdown.The relay is NO or normally open.
Pin 1: normally open
Pin 2: normally connected
Pin 3: common connector

Wiring the relay between pin 16 makes perfect sense to me, but if the alternate way of wiring across the power switch works then that would be much easier.

What this shows is the 5VSB and ground hooked to the 5V standby on the Aquaero board, and either using a)a break in the circuit from pin 16 or b)across the power switch.

I'm trying to figure out why wiring a relay across the power switch would make any difference unless closing the relay simulates pushing and holding the power button in? In other words once the relay closes, it would be doing the same thing, right?

Only thing is that would be a time lag of 4 or 5 seconds if simulating pushing the power button instead of "instant off" I guess.

So I need to find out which two wires on the switch connect to the front panel header and connect across those.

Also I was wondering if I could pick up 5V off a USB 2.0 instead of running from the psu. I have extra headers I'm not using.
Edited by mandrix - 1/11/13 at 3:30am
post #644 of 2434
OK, so electricity is my thing, but PSU's can be a tad quirky compared to what I usually work with, so here goes. As far as I know, you should be able to pick that 5V off the USB, so long as the 5V is always on (on the PSU, which it should be when the PSU is on itself). As for the relay question, yes, that is essentially what they are, another switch just with a predetermined function and value on whether to open or close the relay. In essence it is just another power switch at its most basic level. Now that that is out of the way, I see no reasons that it would not indeed work off of the power switch, so long as a) it can attain the information that would determine when it needs to activate (from the Aquaero) and b) you find the right leads to hook into on the power switch. Personally, though, I would actually find it easier to go about it the other way (with the jumper between pins) as there is less that can go wrong with a simple jumper. There are less connections and, (depending on how long it has to travel) less resistance/impedance. Given the right size wires are used and your connections are done solidly, however, it most likely would not matter.


Now, this is just from my knowledge of general electicity. I could be wrong in my assumptions on the inner workings of the Aquaero. You could most likely hook the relay up this way, and "self trip" it to test if it works though. I imagine this really wouldn't be too much work to accomplish either. Hopefully this helps you out some, but hopefully someone else who knows electricity (and better knows the Aquaero unit) also chimes in to validate what I am saying. I cannot stress enough my overall lack of experience with the unit. Good luck and let me know how it works if you decide to go this route. thumb.gif
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post #645 of 2434
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Addiction View Post

OK, so electricity is my thing, but PSU's can be a tad quirky compared to what I usually work with, so here goes. As far as I know, you should be able to pick that 5V off the USB, so long as the 5V is always on (on the PSU, which it should be when the PSU is on itself). As for the relay question, yes, that is essentially what they are, another switch just with a predetermined function and value on whether to open or close the relay. In essence it is just another power switch at its most basic level. Now that that is out of the way, I see no reasons that it would not indeed work off of the power switch, so long as a) it can attain the information that would determine when it needs to activate (from the Aquaero) and b) you find the right leads to hook into on the power switch. Personally, though, I would actually find it easier to go about it the other way (with the jumper between pins) as there is less that can go wrong with a simple jumper. There are less connections and, (depending on how long it has to travel) less resistance/impedance. Given the right size wires are used and your connections are done solidly, however, it most likely would not matter.


Now, this is just from my knowledge of general electicity. I could be wrong in my assumptions on the inner workings of the Aquaero. You could most likely hook the relay up this way, and "self trip" it to test if it works though. I imagine this really wouldn't be too much work to accomplish either. Hopefully this helps you out some, but hopefully someone else who knows electricity (and better knows the Aquaero unit) also chimes in to validate what I am saying. I cannot stress enough my overall lack of experience with the unit. Good luck and let me know how it works if you decide to go this route. thumb.gif

The relay is activated through the software. I program an alarm, the conditions are met, boom, the relay closes for xx seconds. The 5VSB is so that the relay will open again after it times out, I believe.

Really all I needed to know was closing the circuit across the power switch would force shutdown. It should be much simpler to run the wiring across the switch as I wouldn't have to redo the pin 16 wire with the extra length to reach the Aquaero relay. Whether or not that's the optimal way to do it, I don't know, although I have seen other people posting that they use this method.
If it's on the internet, it has to be right, right? lol.

Not really understanding the pin 16 method as the wire is split with two lengths running to attach to two different poles of the relay. What I mean is, if the relay is normally open, it seems to me it works backwards? That the relay would have to be closed until you want to shut down, then signal the relay to open?

Thanks for the input!
post #646 of 2434
Quote:
Originally Posted by mandrix View Post

The relay is activated through the software. I program an alarm, the conditions are met, boom, the relay closes for xx seconds. The 5VSB is so that the relay will open again after it times out, I believe.

Really all I needed to know was closing the circuit across the power switch would force shutdown. It should be much simpler to run the wiring across the switch as I wouldn't have to redo the pin 16 wire with the extra length to reach the Aquaero relay. Whether or not that's the optimal way to do it, I don't know, although I have seen other people posting that they use this method.
If it's on the internet, it has to be right, right? lol.

Not really understanding the pin 16 method as the wire is split with two lengths running to attach to two different poles of the relay. What I mean is, if the relay is normally open, it seems to me it works backwards? That the relay would have to be closed until you want to shut down, then signal the relay to open?

Thanks for the input!


Using the pin 16 method, you have to use the NC contact on the relay, (cut the green wire and connect one end to common and the other to the NC pin) and when the software says :Danger Will Robinson", the Aquero powers up the relay opening the contacts and the "power-on conection for the PSU, (pin 16) is broken, shutting it down.


If you use the power switch method, you likely need to use the NO contacts on the relay, as when an overtemp condition exists, the software powers up the relay and works like holding down the power button to shut the system down.

You'd be best to power the Aquero from the 5VSB as it suggests, as trying to take power from a USB may be problematic, as they usually have over-current protection circuitry, and / or other types of protective of circuitry.


Darlene
post #647 of 2434
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by IT Diva View Post

Using the pin 16 method, you have to use the NC contact on the relay, (cut the green wire and connect one end to common and the other to the NC pin) and when the software says :Danger Will Robinson", the Aquero powers up the relay opening the contacts and the "power-on conection for the PSU, (pin 16) is broken, shutting it down.


If you use the power switch method, you likely need to use the NO contacts on the relay, as when an overtemp condition exists, the software powers up the relay and works like holding down the power button to shut the system down.

You'd be best to power the Aquero from the 5VSB as it suggests, as trying to take power from a USB may be problematic, as they usually have over-current protection circuitry, and / or other types of protective of circuitry.


Darlene
Pin 1: normally open
Pin 2: normally connected
Pin 3: common connector

OK Darlene, so just to verify:
using pin 16 method I would connect to Pins 2 & 3 on the relay
using power switch I would connect to Pins 1 & 3 on the relay

Thanks for the heads up on the USB! Your expertise is always welcome, especially in anything electrical. smile.gif

I was going to contact you, but got sidetracked on another project.
post #648 of 2434
Thread Starter 
Yesterday I had a fan that wasn't working, and that led me to pull out one of the radiators where I discovered one of the fans where I did not hot glue the leads had come loose. One thing led to another and I decided to pull out all the internal push fans, and reorient the outside fans as push fans. In other words there is 4 fans on each pedestal radiator, on the outside blowing in. With the fan rotors now exposed to the outside it looks much better.

WTH you say, mandrix?
Well after some piddling with the fans and the very tight space constraints inside I wanted to see how much impact on temperatures pulling the 8 fans would make. Also I have here a spare D5........
So I did some test fitting with the D5 variable pump but did not actually mount it yet. It would be pretty straightforward, though, as I would pick up the loop coming into the pedestal as a straight shot to the pump top, then again a straight shot to a radiator. It would sit on the floor of the pedestal, in other words.

I tried to do some stress testing but I had a serious boot loop/ no overclock problem. Finally I switched to the secondary BIOS and the overclock is working again. I guess I'll have to flash the main BIOS to fix it as it probably got corrupted somehow.

Then I had the problem of a temperature sensor that reads the ambient temp drifting up and down a lot. Since the pump speed is tied to the air/water Delta t there was too much variability.
So I finally gave up for the night and settled in to watch Gold Rush.

This morning after swapping temperature probes the unit seems to be reading a little more stable, and later I will do some more testing to see how the temps are impacted.
But I'm not sure if the best thing is having the fans push to the inside (where there is now more open space) or pull to the outside. I would normally think push would be better but since there is no exhaust except through either end of the pedestal (i.e., no fans helping) I'm not really sure until I do more testing.

Either way I like that the pedestal isn't so crowded, and still don't know if I want to install the D5. I mean I know I don't need it, but what's wrong with overkill? I do know it's much easier to get to all the fittings now with the inside fans removed.
Edited by mandrix - 1/12/13 at 3:57am
post #649 of 2434
Quote:
Originally Posted by mandrix View Post

Pin 1: normally open
Pin 2: normally connected
Pin 3: common connector

OK Darlene, so just to verify:
using pin 16 method I would connect to Pins 2 & 3 on the relay
using power switch I would connect to Pins 1 & 3 on the relay

Thanks for the heads up on the USB! Your expertise is always welcome, especially in anything electrical. smile.gif

I was going to contact you, but got sidetracked on another project.



As long as the software asserts the relay, (powers it on) when an alarm condition exists, that's the way to hook it up.

It is possible that the relay stays energized during normal operation, and de-energizes when an alarm condition exists, but that would have it energized 24/7, so while possible, is doubtful,

If it turns out to be that that is the case, then swap the connection at pin 2 to 3 or vice versa.


As with so many electrical things, there's multiple ways to accomplish the same task, and making a best educated guess is the best you can do without putting an ohm meter on the relay contacts before you hook up wires to them and power up the system.


Darlene
post #650 of 2434
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by IT Diva View Post

As long as the software asserts the relay, (powers it on) when an alarm condition exists, that's the way to hook it up.

It is possible that the relay stays energized during normal operation, and de-energizes when an alarm condition exists, but that would have it energized 24/7, so while possible, is doubtful,

If it turns out to be that that is the case, then swap the connection at pin 2 to 3 or vice versa.


As with so many electrical things, there's multiple ways to accomplish the same task, and making a best educated guess is the best you can do without putting an ohm meter on the relay contacts before you hook up wires to them and power up the system.


Darlene
Thanks, Darlene. I would think the relay is not energized until actuated. I do have a meter, I can check that out.
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