Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Rumors and Unconfirmed Articles › [Tom's Hardware] Apple Considering Moving Macs Away From Intel Chips
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[Tom's Hardware] Apple Considering Moving Macs Away From Intel Chips - Page 26

post #251 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelbom View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Domino View Post

Consider what a typical mac users, let alone, university engineering student in their early years, use for "demanding" applications. There is no issues with running office work and Youtube. Throw in GPU accelerated layers and processes, and even 3d rendering won't be an issue, considering what work we usually get thrown at us in engineering. The code we run isn't even demanding in itself. Not until you start getting into the research fields in engineering and the other sciences where you would even need the horsepower of x86 from a mac user, which isn't even used 90% of the time. Heck, most CAD work isn't that demanding either. Unless you're in civi. But most people will have access to university computers for that work anyways.

Case and point, mac users don't do anything demanding, even in the education sectors. Pushing their own, purchased, and relabeled, ARM arch, clock them much higher to improve performance, which they won't need, is perfectly suited for this application.
You don't (and can't) know that, you're just speculating. There's over a hundred million Mac users and a certain percentage of them are bound to use intensive applications, and no one knows what that percentage is.

Anyway I don't want Macs getting slower, which is exactly what would happen. Aside from an overall slow down, any application which can really push the processor is going to suffer, e.g., Pro Tools, Final Cut, CS6, etc., to name a few.

The worst of it all though is the loss of compatibility, that's simply unacceptable. It's not worth it.

I don't and can't? That's your argument. Can you explain to me how I won't know this, after observation classmates, teachers, and researchers? Most reserachers use the MacPro line up and head off to university super computers to do any heavy lifting. It is a niche market.

As said, Macs don't need the horse power as they don't do anything demanding. MacPros, do. Most are not bound to an intensive application environment. You're a mac user and you don't even know this. frown.gif

There are hundred of millions of non-mac users that use something other then OSX to do their research in. Why? Because it is cheaper and more convenient with better security features, functionality, customization, and user friend interfaces. The Photoshop and other media programs are easily accelerated off of an Intel IGP. The work I see students do in the arts are able to accomplish their tasks, quickly, on old core2duo systems, with ease. 3D renders and CAD software have beastlier machines available to them and Mac would still offer their pro line up to satisfy those needs for the less than a million users that use it for those purposes. You'll be surprised just how little macs are used in the professional world outside of media.
Edited by Domino - 10/11/12 at 3:14am
post #252 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by noobhell View Post

I do no see a point in that since macs have no native directx support so it seems like a 7970 is a waist of technology and money.

OpenGL for games...

OpenCL for all that fancy video editing...

Using a good GPU as an excuse to raise the price 3 times the cost of the GPU itself, because OEMs and especially Apple like to do that kind of thing...
Forge
(17 items)
 
Forge-LT
(7 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel i7-5960X (4.625Ghz) ASUS X99-DELUXE/U3.1 EVGA 1080ti SC2 Hybrid EVGA 1080ti SC2 Hybrid 
RAMHard DriveCoolingOS
64GB Corsair Dominator Platinum (3000Mhz 8x8GB) Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 512GB EK Predator 240 Windows 10 Enterprise x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
2x Acer XR341CK Corsair Vengeance K70 RGB Corsair AX1200 Corsair Graphite 780T 
MouseAudioAudioAudio
Corsair Vengeance M65 RGB Sennheiser HD700 Sound Blaster AE-5 Audio Technica AT4040 
Audio
30ART Mic Tube Amp 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-4720HQ UX501JW-UB71T GTX 960m 16GB 1600 9-9-9-27 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
512GB PCI-e SSD Windows 10 Pro 4k IPS 
  hide details  
Reply
Forge
(17 items)
 
Forge-LT
(7 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel i7-5960X (4.625Ghz) ASUS X99-DELUXE/U3.1 EVGA 1080ti SC2 Hybrid EVGA 1080ti SC2 Hybrid 
RAMHard DriveCoolingOS
64GB Corsair Dominator Platinum (3000Mhz 8x8GB) Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 512GB EK Predator 240 Windows 10 Enterprise x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
2x Acer XR341CK Corsair Vengeance K70 RGB Corsair AX1200 Corsair Graphite 780T 
MouseAudioAudioAudio
Corsair Vengeance M65 RGB Sennheiser HD700 Sound Blaster AE-5 Audio Technica AT4040 
Audio
30ART Mic Tube Amp 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-4720HQ UX501JW-UB71T GTX 960m 16GB 1600 9-9-9-27 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
512GB PCI-e SSD Windows 10 Pro 4k IPS 
  hide details  
Reply
post #253 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by doomlord52 View Post

lol ok.
Go to ANYTHING else and your raw CPU power goes down. Try an enter the game, and Intel will simply demolish you. Either way, it's a terrible idea.
AMD could work, if they want more battery life, but again, raw CPU power would go down. While Apple does a lot of stupid stuff, I dont see them advertising "the new Macbook - now slower than before".

As if it was hard to push the OS Apple makes...
I can see them going to AMD and advertising this:
New Macbook now with more battery life, cooler and lighter!
For only 2999$!
post #254 of 278
http://openbenchmarking.org/s/ICT%20Loongson-3A%20V0.5%20FPU%20V0.1

some test of the loongson and linux debian combo.true it is exacly conclusive but itput this in the mobile world!

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTE5OTg

16 core version of loongson-3 (aka goson-3)at 65 nm this is already promissing if this was to be shrunk to last gen 32 nm process this could spell trouble for arm and intel!cant wait t6o see test comparision vs atom and cortex 9(its main counterpart!)
Edited by drbaltazar - 10/11/12 at 5:27am
post #255 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by drbaltazar View Post

http://openbenchmarking.org/s/ICT%20Loongson-3A%20V0.5%20FPU%20V0.1
some test of the loongson and linux debian combo.true it is exacly conclusive but itput this in the mobile world!
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTE5OTg
16 core version of loongson-3 (aka goson-3)at 65 nm this is already promissing if this was to be shrunk to last gen 32 nm process this could spell trouble for arm and intel!cant wait t6o see test comparision vs atom and cortex 9(its main counterpart!)

All of those tests are IO and RAM speed tests. The sub-15W Godson 3A with only one DDR2/DDR3 memory controller (and with RAM type and speed of the chip unknown), are high results expected? The chip's primary usage is in low-power portable devices (ie, netbooks). Other chips will likely show much higher scores here.
post #256 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by hajile View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post

Temperature isn't really related to heat output, for example Ivy Bridge runs at high temperatures but it doesn't actually put out that much heat, hence why cooling it with say, a $20 Hyper TX3 (As I am, at 4.4Ghz it hits the max safe 24/7 temperatures) isn't really that far off cooling it with a decent air cooler.
It's like how often you'd get nVidia fanboys pointing out that the HD5870 ran at higher temperatures than the GTX 480, when that was due to the HD5870 having a really bad cooler compared to the GTX 480.
You can have extremely high temperatures, but not a lot of heat or a lot of heat with low temperatures, they're two different things that are intertwined but still separate like voltage and current.

I wasn't really looking for an answer. You're correct that the temperature of the heatsink is less than the temperature of the chip surface. I'm correct that the heat must transfer if it exists (that is, the joules of heat must transfer). What I think you're taking issue with is that a high J/mm^3 (energy concentration; ie temperature) on a small chip doesn't translate in to lots of total joules of heat energy. Once the energy is spread out into the heatsink, the final temperature is the amount of joules/mm^3 that can't be dissipated by the chip to the heatsink and then dissipated to the air.

Yep; it means also that even with a good cooler IvB will always run hot. People also need to remember these chips can take it, IvB is safe 24/7 up to 90c max.
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 3570k @ 4.5Ghz ASRock Z77 Pro3 Powercolor Radeon HD7950 3GB @ 1150/1350 4x4GB G.Skill Ares 2000Mhz CL9 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung 840 250GB Western Digital Black 1TB WD1002FAEX Seagate Barracuda 3TB ST3000DM001 Samsung Spinpoint EcoGreen 2TB 
Optical DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Pioneer DVR-220LBKS Noctua NH-D14 Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850rpm Corsair AF140 Quiet Edition 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
Arcitc Cooling Acclero Twin Turbo II Arch Linux x86-64, amdgpu BenQ G2220HD BenQ G2020HD 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine III Year of the Snake, Cherry Blue Silverstone Strider Plus 600w CoolerMaster CM690 II Black and White SteelSeries Sensei Professional 
Mouse PadAudioOther
Artisan Hien Mid Japan Black Large ASUS Xonar DX NZXT Sentry Mesh 30w Fan Controller 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 3570k @ 4.5Ghz ASRock Z77 Pro3 Powercolor Radeon HD7950 3GB @ 1150/1350 4x4GB G.Skill Ares 2000Mhz CL9 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung 840 250GB Western Digital Black 1TB WD1002FAEX Seagate Barracuda 3TB ST3000DM001 Samsung Spinpoint EcoGreen 2TB 
Optical DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
Pioneer DVR-220LBKS Noctua NH-D14 Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850rpm Corsair AF140 Quiet Edition 
CoolingOSMonitorMonitor
Arcitc Cooling Acclero Twin Turbo II Arch Linux x86-64, amdgpu BenQ G2220HD BenQ G2020HD 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine III Year of the Snake, Cherry Blue Silverstone Strider Plus 600w CoolerMaster CM690 II Black and White SteelSeries Sensei Professional 
Mouse PadAudioOther
Artisan Hien Mid Japan Black Large ASUS Xonar DX NZXT Sentry Mesh 30w Fan Controller 
  hide details  
Reply
post #257 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by noobhell View Post

I do no see a point in that since macs have no native directx support so it seems like a 7970 is a waist of technology and money.
I doubt it. They've had amd/ati in their imacs forever.

i said i was guessing. oh well time will tell lol
 
Pur Esprit
(23 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Core i5-5257U Logic Board Iris Graphics 6100 8GB  
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOS
128GB My Passport 1TB easyStore 4TB OSX Sierra 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Retina Display 13" Backlit Keyboard Magsafe 2 60W MacBook Pro Retina 13" 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
MX Master QCK JBL Flip 3 Karakao H1 Bluetooth  
AudioOtherOtherOther
Status Audio CB-1 TechnoShield Blue Marble Skin Magsafe to Magsafe 2 Adapter Thunderbolt Ethernet Adapter 
OtherOther
Apple Mini Displayport to VGA Adapter Griffin Mini Displayport to HDMI/DVI Adapter 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Pentium G4560 B250i Gaming Pro AC GTX1050Ti 4GB Vengeance LPX 2x8GB 2666MHz 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung 840 Pro 256GB Sandisk Ultra II 480GB Sandisk Ultra II 480GB BarraCuda 2TB 3.5" 
Optical DriveCoolingCoolingOS
Samsung External Cryorig H7 NZXT Grid Windows 10 Education 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Insignia 39"  Happy Hacking Keyboard Professional 2 EVGA 450BT Phanteks Enthoo Evolve ITX 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
Corsair Harpoon RGB KupX Extended Edition V-Moda Crossfade LP Phantom Chrome InnoGear MU007 Microphone 
AudioOtherOther
Mudder Desk Stand Logitech K400r Excellus RGB Kit 
  hide details  
Reply
 
Pur Esprit
(23 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Core i5-5257U Logic Board Iris Graphics 6100 8GB  
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOS
128GB My Passport 1TB easyStore 4TB OSX Sierra 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Retina Display 13" Backlit Keyboard Magsafe 2 60W MacBook Pro Retina 13" 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
MX Master QCK JBL Flip 3 Karakao H1 Bluetooth  
AudioOtherOtherOther
Status Audio CB-1 TechnoShield Blue Marble Skin Magsafe to Magsafe 2 Adapter Thunderbolt Ethernet Adapter 
OtherOther
Apple Mini Displayport to VGA Adapter Griffin Mini Displayport to HDMI/DVI Adapter 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Pentium G4560 B250i Gaming Pro AC GTX1050Ti 4GB Vengeance LPX 2x8GB 2666MHz 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung 840 Pro 256GB Sandisk Ultra II 480GB Sandisk Ultra II 480GB BarraCuda 2TB 3.5" 
Optical DriveCoolingCoolingOS
Samsung External Cryorig H7 NZXT Grid Windows 10 Education 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Insignia 39"  Happy Hacking Keyboard Professional 2 EVGA 450BT Phanteks Enthoo Evolve ITX 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
Corsair Harpoon RGB KupX Extended Edition V-Moda Crossfade LP Phantom Chrome InnoGear MU007 Microphone 
AudioOtherOther
Mudder Desk Stand Logitech K400r Excellus RGB Kit 
  hide details  
Reply
post #258 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Domino View Post

I don't and can't? That's your argument. Can you explain to me how I won't know this, after observation classmates, teachers, and researchers? Most reserachers use the MacPro line up and head off to university super computers to do any heavy lifting. It is a niche market.
As said, Macs don't need the horse power as they don't do anything demanding. MacPros, do. Most are not bound to an intensive application environment. You're a mac user and you don't even know this. frown.gif
There are hundred of millions of non-mac users that use something other then OSX to do their research in. Why? Because it is cheaper and more convenient with better security features, functionality, customization, and user friend interfaces. The Photoshop and other media programs are easily accelerated off of an Intel IGP. The work I see students do in the arts are able to accomplish their tasks, quickly, on old core2duo systems, with ease. 3D renders and CAD software have beastlier machines available to them and Mac would still offer their pro line up to satisfy those needs for the less than a million users that use it for those purposes. You'll be surprised just how little macs are used in the professional world outside of media.
That's still opinion, not fact. I can say that all people use Windows for is to play Farm Ville outside of business and real computing is done on Linux. Blanket statements like that serve no purpose.tongue.gif
post #259 of 278
The ratio of iOS to Mac sales has got to be in the hundred to thousand fold. Of course ARM makes sense.

Apple hasn't disclosed much of anything about their custom chips as they strive to integrate the software with the hardware and sell a computer.

My recommendation would be chop off their configurations and sell the Box, with some options for more disk capacity or screen space and that's it.

Or cut the crap and sell their Intel derived OS to make their OS more relevant to the world.
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
FX-8320 Gigabyte 990FXA UD3 Powercolor AX6850 Powercolor AX6850 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Corsair Vengeance LP CAS7 1600 (2 x 4GB) Samsung 840 Series Lite-On DVD-RW Corsair H80 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Arctic Twin Turbo ll x2 Corsair AF140 x3 Corsair SP120 x2 Windows 7 Premium 64-bit 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
LG 32LH40 1080p 120Hz Interpolated 32" LCD Razer Arctosa Seasonic X650 Corsair 300R Windowed 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Razer Deathadder 2013 Razer Vespula Klipsch Promedia 2.1 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
FX-8320 Gigabyte 990FXA UD3 Powercolor AX6850 Powercolor AX6850 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Corsair Vengeance LP CAS7 1600 (2 x 4GB) Samsung 840 Series Lite-On DVD-RW Corsair H80 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Arctic Twin Turbo ll x2 Corsair AF140 x3 Corsair SP120 x2 Windows 7 Premium 64-bit 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
LG 32LH40 1080p 120Hz Interpolated 32" LCD Razer Arctosa Seasonic X650 Corsair 300R Windowed 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Razer Deathadder 2013 Razer Vespula Klipsch Promedia 2.1 
  hide details  
Reply
post #260 of 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post


OpenGL for games...
OpenCL for all that fancy video editing...
Using a good GPU as an excuse to raise the price 3 times the cost of the GPU itself, because OEMs and especially Apple like to do that kind of thing...


90% of the people who buy oem computers do not know what a gpu is and out of the 10% rest only about 20% know what the 6970m is. That takes you to 98% who are clueless about what they are buying.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Rumors and Unconfirmed Articles
Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Rumors and Unconfirmed Articles › [Tom's Hardware] Apple Considering Moving Macs Away From Intel Chips