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[Official] Delidded Club / Guide - Page 1128

post #11271 of 33641
Quote:
Originally Posted by justanoldman View Post

Reset, and start from the beginning since we are all friends here:
I figured out that my IHS is not flat, and learned from one source that even lapping it does not make it completely flat while being used due to the significant force caused by clamping it down on the mobo. Taking those two pieces of information into account, I wondered if going direct to die would be better simply because you eliminate the interference of the IHS which apparently cannot be made completely flat on the top and bottom while being used and clamped down. Unless, of course you could find a way to lap it while in your mobo.

It is only logical that removing the IHS which is never perfecly flat, and removing one of two layers of TIM would lower your temps. Lowering them how much is the question, and then the other questions are what are the risks of direct die contact and are they worth the temp drop. For his setup, MikeG has answered those questions.

Has anyone else tried direct to die so we could compare results?
If I am being dumb with these questions, that's OK, then I will learn something by figuring that out.

That is a good theory too, if the clamping has enough force to make the ihs concave, which is possible i would think as it is supposedly made of copper and copper is maleable then the more "gentle" force of a "thumbtight" waterblock would be a better contact surface. Let me rephrase then, It is 100% about the contact of the surface between the die and whatever it contacts as long as it has a higher heat transfer, i.e. copper definitely does and would be found in waterblocks and the ihs. I will give you a +1 for that smile.gif
post #11272 of 33641
Speaking of waterblocks and such, does anyone else have a Phanteks PH TC14PE in the delidded club for comparing results?
Also I just noticed on page 1, unless Im blind, in the main table with all the results there isn't a column showing which cooling solution is being used!?!? i.e. air/water/etc
Surely that should be included for reference?
post #11273 of 33641
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronicfx View Post

Val gets pretty busy sometimes. He took more than a month and a reminder to get me on the list. This thread moves several pages a day and keeping up with every post while participating in other parts of the community and hopefully maintaining n active "life" is probably tough.

Yeah, sorry about that guys in college and having 3 tests in 2 days isn't fun especially accounting tests... eeew. Plus I've really been trying to get into the benching area a lot more lately than normal I want to be a bencher, I just don't have hardware or money right now.

However I've missed the last few days post back in here. Also Illl comment on the submission format as well. I made the submission to join the way I did so I could tell a submissions from a normal post but sometimes this place moves so fast that I can't even keep up when reading through 130+ posts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeG View Post

I really didn't want to start a debate, but as a "well trained scientist", where is your empirical evidence? Certainly a " well trained scientist" would do some kind of testing before speculating that it "doesn't make any scientific sense"

I have done some testing, not a whole lot, as I was not expecting to get published, but just enough to convince myself. I have done several mounts both with and without the IHS and each time they are consistent with the following table:
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

  • Did I get a reduction in temperature -- Absolutely, 7 to 8 degrees off my hottest core at 5.0GHz.
  • Did it allow me to lower my VCore -- Absolutely, 0.20V at 5.0GHz.
  • I want to use LN2, will going direct die help me? -- I don't think so, my testing at 0 degrees showed no improvement, direct die vs IHS.
  • If I go direct die does it mean I can run 24/7 at 5.3 GHz? -- Probably not, as frequencies go up, so does the voltage required to gate those circuits at those speeds.


Here is a chart I did for my own research. It shows the minimum VCore required to pass 10 passes of IBT for my chip. The results are from a delidded chip before going direct die, but it should give you some general idea of what kind of voltages you will need to reach the next increment in speed:
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I likee the info you posted even if it isn't fuly proven insight from members is information in my eyes no matter if its from a 12 year old or a 70 old triple phd. ANYWAYS lol avoiding the heat of this, Im glad to see that you even had a vcore drop, that's pretty tough to get like most people actually know. I had a good vcore drop on my 4.7 but that was it. I couldn't get it any lower though.

But that's just me, humans are all different and are a communitative group, we always view things differently as we each have our own validation and credentials and experience.

Basically what Im saying is that no matter what people say is that we should treat each other with respect as we don't always know who is who on here, Unless you actually know each other.

Not to point anyone out just information and clarification on how I do things, we are all different and should be treated that way. tongue.gifthumb.gif
post #11274 of 33641
As I said 4 pages back my chip needed arround 1.330V for a stable prime test @4,5Ghz

Last night I did some IBT with different vcore and different stress level, and for my surprise it passed every test, even with the same vcore that I need for 4,4ghz stable (1,275). It passed the test with standard, high and very high stress level. Then I raised the Vcore back to 1.320 and did a prime test overnight. It crashed after 3 hours.

So do you guys think this is normal when comparing stability between p95 and IBT?
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post #11275 of 33641
You are missing your calling. You should be a pilot valguar. My friends dad was a pilot then worked for the FAA. He even gave John travolta private lessons when he was learning to fly. He married a stewardess and lives a pretty nice life in a huge house. I still hang with his son from time to time he always promised to take us up in a Cessna but it never happened. Well the son went all the time but I never went with them. He had a stroke a few years back so no more flying anymore. I bet he would have let me grab the yoke when we got up in the air!
post #11276 of 33641
Quote:
Originally Posted by prest0 View Post

As I said 4 pages back my chip needed arround 1.330V for a stable prime test @4,5Ghz

Last night I did some IBT with different vcore and different stress level, and for my surprise it passed every test, even with the same vcore that I need for 4,4ghz stable (1,275). It passed the test with standard, high and very high stress level. Then I raised the Vcore back to 1.320 and did a prime test overnight. It crashed after 3 hours.

So do you guys think this is normal when comparing stability between p95 and IBT?
Not saying this is the same for everyone, but IBT is not of much use to me. Prime95 with 90%+ memory usage for 24 hours with no WHEA logger warnings is my first level of stability. I have found that IBT is too easy to pass vs. that.

Some people use IBT for a quick check to see temps and find a level to do longer testing. I actually like Prime95 using 8 for min and max FFT for 15 minutes tells me what I need to know about temps and to find a level appropriate for a longer test.
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post #11277 of 33641
Speaking of Prime95, I have searched and found nothing but conflicting information about setting the priority of your Prime95 tests. For those who don't know, you can click on Test then Worker Windows, then choose a priority from 1 to 10. Default is 1 so that your screen saver and other background tasks can function normally.

If you choose 10 then most of your other programs including CPU-Z and other temp monitoring programs will go blank while Prime95 is running.

The internet "lore" is that you have to set it to 10 for a real stability test, but others disagree and say the workers will stop the same when encountering errors whether priority is 1 or 10.

In my brief testing I have not seen setting it to 10 make Prime95 a better stability tester. Anyone have any opinions on this?
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post #11278 of 33641
Dare I say I shouldn't have de-lidded...

post #11279 of 33641
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeG View Post

Yes the temperature on core 1 spiked up to 70c at one point, but I'm not sure when that was. I could have been testing my GPU or loading an application. My average temps for the past 11.5hrs is 56c and AIDA 64 is still running.

When referring to "ambient" temps, are most people talking about the idle temperature of the CPU, the temperature within the case, or the ambient temperature of the room? The temperature of my room at desk level, and on the floor near the intake of my computer is 20.6c (69F) .

When I post temp results, the ambient temp is the temp inside the case. I have a temp sensor that measures room temp which also has a probe that I placed next to the motherboard. My fan controller also has 4 temp sensors at various places around the inside of the case
post #11280 of 33641
Quote:
Originally Posted by tw33k View Post

When I post temp results, the ambient temp is the temp inside the case. I have a temp sensor that measures room temp which also has a probe that I placed next to the motherboard. My fan controller also has 4 temp sensors at various places around the inside of the case

Agreed. You can't take room temperature as ambients. The temps inside of your case can differ largely because of the hear all your components produce. Example being my ambient temps are usually between 23 and 25 where as my room temps are usually between 15 and 20 degrees.
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