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[Official] Delidded Club / Guide - Page 1189

post #11881 of 33666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joa3d43 View Post

...quick question:

When I delidded, the tail end of the affair got hurried a bit because of an injury and also bad lighting. I used CL-U (the right amount) on just the die - then put the whole thing back together quickly with a temp MX4 on the IHS, given the unique circumstances.

I know that the IHS is seated just a bit too far back by about .75mm to 1mm (I overcompensated the 'forward slide' of the IHS when closing the lever but was also literally bleeding onto the assembly so I hurried it as I could not push down on the IHS when closing the CPU locking mechanism).

I know the die is not touching any sides of the IHS, and initial temp gains (just CL-U on die; 12 to 15 C gain) have been impressive given the less-than-perfect, temporary IHS to cooler mount.

When I go back in to finish the job and also install a new custom loop, would you take the IHS off again (while leaving the CPU seated on the socket), re-apply CL-U onto the (carefully cleaned) die AS WELL AS the underside of the IHS - or just leave well enough alone...I rather not take out the CPU ever again - and it is benching with ok temps even now upwards of 5.3.

I guess I am also asking how much gain can be had from an 'extra' CL-U layer underneath the IHS, not just the die headscratch.gif

Thanks everyone for your input ! thumb.gif

if everything works like it should, i wouldnt take it apart again,
even though the ihs is not seated perfectly..

i did all sides with liquid pro, had a 30+C tempdrop
if you apply the right amount, it doesnt matter if you use 1 layer on the die only,
or 2 thin layers on the die and under/inside ihs,
i think 20-30C temp drops should be possible..

anyways, if youre happy with the temps you have now, i wouldnt change anything,
"never change a winning team" right..
i had a few situations where i thought , hmm if i do this, it might be better,
and only made things worse ...lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeG View Post

MSI's recommended voltages for VDIMM and other voltages on the Ivybridge platform

(right click, open link in new window)

thats a great chart to use MikeG, thanks alot smile.gif
looks like most of us have "fun" ...lol and some enjoy the "danger" zone (vcore wise) ..hehe
Edited by VonDutch - 2/15/13 at 12:01am
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post #11882 of 33666
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joa3d43 View Post

...quick question:

When I delidded, the tail end of the affair got hurried a bit because of an injury and also bad lighting. I used CL-U (the right amount) on just the die - then put the whole thing back together quickly with a temp MX4 on the IHS, given the unique circumstances.

I know that the IHS is seated just a bit too far back by about .75mm to 1mm (I overcompensated the 'forward slide' of the IHS when closing the lever but was also literally bleeding onto the assembly so I hurried it as I could not push down on the IHS when closing the CPU locking mechanism).

I know the die is not touching any sides of the IHS, and initial temp gains (just CL-U on die; 12 to 15 C gain) have been impressive given the less-than-perfect, temporary IHS to cooler mount.

When I go back in to finish the job and also install a new custom loop, would you take the IHS off again (while leaving the CPU seated on the socket), re-apply CL-U onto the (carefully cleaned) die AS WELL AS the underside of the IHS - or just leave well enough alone...I rather not take out the CPU ever again - and it is benching with ok temps even now upwards of 5.3.

I guess I am also asking how much gain can be had from an 'extra' CL-U layer underneath the IHS, not just the die headscratch.gif

Thanks everyone for your input ! thumb.gif

Don't even think of touching it, temps are great as it is. don't play with it for chances of ruining that. thumb.gif
post #11883 of 33666
Quote:
Originally Posted by justanoldman View Post

This is a Long post, asking for help/advice on a second build.

I put it in a spoiler in case someone doesn't want to read through it, but I would very much appreciate any help. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Hey you clicked to look! Thanks.smile.gif

I should make a thread for this at some point, but since you guys are so experienced I would appreciate any input on it. Since I can't sell my fist delidded 3770k I figured I would just build another system and give the old one I am using now to the kids. I always have two computers, just in case something goes wrong. You can see my current specs in my signature rig, and with this one I figured I would do a few upgrades. I am not really trying to stay in any specific budget, just get a nice system for a reasonable price, but at this point I have a litte more money than time. Anything that saves me time is a good thing.

Anything I should change?

What I already have:
CPU: 3770k overclocked, delidded, lapped

Thinking about:
Case:
NZXT Switch 810 (I was told this is a good choice for two radiators for the H220)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146089

Cooling:
Swiftech H220, (plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well)
http://www.swiftech.com/H220.aspx

SSD:
Crucial M4 256gb
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-148-443
or possibly
Samsung 840 pro 256gb (seems faster, but I don't know if it is more reliable or not)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147193

HDD:
Just for backups, extra storage:
Western Digital Black 7200rpm 1tb
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533

Video card: (this is something I am really not sure about)
I know most here think AMD>Nvidia, but I already have a EVGA GTX 670, so I am very inclined to go with another EVGA simply to save time when updating drivers, looking for tech support, warranty, RMA etc. It will definitely be more work for me to have Nvidia in one system and AMD in the other.
The one thing I know for sure is that I want to cool this GPU with the Swiftech H220, and I know nothing about that so I need a card that can be water-cooled without too much trouble. Will be gaming on either 2560x1600 or possibly 3 monitor surround at 1920x1200 for each of the 3.
With that in mind:
EVGA GTX 670 FTW 2gb
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130787
or more $
EVGA GTX 670 4gb FTW+
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824
or even more $$
EVGA GTX 680 4gb FTW+ w/backplate
or $$$
EVGA GTX 680 4gb Classified
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801

PSU
Corsair AX850 (I think it is more than I need now, but not sure what else I will add later)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139015&Tpk=ax850

Memory:
G.Skill Trident X 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231589

Motherboard:
I have a Maximus V Formula, which I am happy with so far. I have heard good things about Gigabyte but then I would have to learn a whole new BIOS, which doesn't seem worth the time unless I am missing something.
Asus ROG MVF
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854
or save some $
Asus ROG Maximus V Gene
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
This is a smaller board which I would put in my old case and move the MVF to the new case, if I go that way.

If you have made it this far, your help is very much appreciated. Thank you!!

...I can comment on some of the items, noting that without knowing (or even wanting to ask) re budget, it is a bit more complex re range of options

...and one good spoiler deserves another smile.gif
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

on memory G.Skill Trident X 2x*

I have been using 32 GB G.Skill in all our new machines and love the Trident X...no problems and quick, have oc'ed them before without any extra volts to 2560...make sure your Asus ROG board has the Ram options set to 'mode 2' on the Trident X thumb.gif

on the case

...very good choice, just make sure that you have room for even bigger / more radiators...the way you are going (and I mean that as a compliment), it won't be too long before you will be thinking about a custom loop for your CPU @ 5 Ghz plus with a 360 rad - in addition to another loop / rads for the graphics biggrin.gif. In ""case"" you win the lotto, the Corsair 900D (Godzilla) case will fit your decor per avatar while leaving >>> huge room for expansion

on the video cards

I like the GTX 670ies a lot...if you are courageous, they can be heavily modded via custom bios flash (on this site)... good idea to stick with the same model...I'm currently using two Asus 670 Direct CUii 670ies that are modded, with a third one ready to go in on the weekend just for fun (before that one moves to another system later)...using one model can save you a lot of headaches. The question of 2 vs 4 GB of ram per card comes down to the games you play and resolutions...most of the time, 2 GB will be ok unless you play at 5xxx x 25xx.

I am not sure whether your new build WILL inherit a EVGA 670 and you want to go SLI. Given your wish to water-cool the GPUs - and do so with the H220 - EVGA also makes 680s (and 690ies) that are both ready for that and easily connected to the H220 - look for HydroCopper 680s on their site which are also clocked very fast and will make it much easier for you to set them up with the H220 (noting a caveat on that below).

In general on video cards, you are looking to do this when the NVidia 'Titans' are just about to come out...from what I have seen, one Titan = two 680s, and it apparently also comes with 6 GB of Vram which solves a lot of other problems down the road, such as the intro of 4k monitors. On the other hand, for the first few months, Titan's will be very expensive - yet their introduction will push the prices down of the video cards you are looking at. I picked my 3rd 670 up last week when it dropped by $40, following some news about Titan.

All said and done, if EVGA drops the prices on their 680 HydroCoppers, that might be your best option re integration with your planned system. Otherwise, a company called 'EK' (Slovakia I think) makes all kinds of full water blocks for 670ies and 680ies, with a price tag of between 90 to 110 EUROs, depending on the specific model.

HDD

WD 1TB "Blacks" are the drive of choice for what you are planning in conjunction with SSDs - I use between 3 and 5 of them per system and SSD arrangement.

Water Cooling

There you might have a bit of an issue...you mentioned 'Swiftech H220, ("...plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well")'. The Swiftech 220 is the best closed-loop solution now and it does allow you to add GPU cooling...I was thinking along the same lines, re a custom loop I am building that has a 360 double-thick radiator and an industrial strength Swiftech pump (MPC655). But someone with a lot of experience with this pointed out to me that running two GPUs that are oce'ed (never mind 3) AND an oc'ed 5 Ghz PLUS CPU is too much for even that arrangement that has more capacity than the H220. In my case, I will run only a CPU loop now and add a second loop later just for the GPUs....for you, it comes down to whether:

a.) you plan to run SLI 670ies (never mind 680s). Even in stock form, 670ies will use up to 144 watts each...just pushing that 'power target slider' in the video options to 122% will add, well, 2x 22% to that.
b.) how far you want to push your 3770K. In stock form, its 'TjMax is 77 watts...by 5.1 Ghz, its - hard to believe - almost three times as much, and that assumes a chip that can do that at relatively low volts.

All this adds quickly to a massive amount of heat energy you will try to get rid off - just invest $20 or so in a kill-a-watt meter and hook it in between the wall and your current system and run some heavy video benchmarks like ' 3D M Vantage - you will be surprised (I was).

I am saying this because you will spend a lot of time to get rid of heat with an IvyBridge running at about 5 Ghz (+ -), yet reintroduce extra heat in a loop that also includes the GPUs - I know you mentioned TWO 240 mm rads which is a big step in the right direction, but I would NOT be surprised that you sooner or later will consider a full-on custom loop each for CPU and GPUs. One quick item for you to check (as I genuinely don't know) is if you can add a separate pump to assist the H220 pump and may be add a 3rd 240 mm (or a smaller 120) rad. This would allow you to run the H220, but allow it to dissipate close to 1000 watts...and that brings me to the PSU...

PSU

I upgraded 3 mth ago from a 650w to an 850w Corsair...after having delidded and benching at 5.3+ as well as adding a 3rd 670, I am looking at that AX1200 lying on the floor waiting for my attention...per above, you want to create some extra headroom for future upgrades, and changing a PSU can be a pain (think of all that cable management... biggrin.gif ). I would recommend that you spend the extra dollars and go up to a AX1200

Motherboard

I make no secret of the fact that I am an 'Asus' fan (I run 3 different models across 5 machines just in my home office, including a Sabertooth Z77 I like - psst, don't tell TD smile.gif ), even though Gigabyte for example also makes some great, fast and solid boards. But as you say, you already know the Bios setup; besides, Asus has the most corporate muscle to maintain great services over long periods, i.e. things we need to download etc., including for their boards that are 8 years old or older. Just as as an example, I have to run some older boards re software compatibilities, and I can always find the 'latest' set of drivers, BIOS and utilities from Asus for boards they have not produced for close to a decade.

I run a Maximus V Extreme (eATX)...while a bit more expensive, it does have some unique features, including Thunderbolt and especially the 'OC Key' which you would very much appreciate, judging by your posts. That said, the Max. Formula and Gene are very similar to it in most other respects...I have 'work plans' for the Max V Extreme down the line when things like Thunderbolt and the extra PCI / Plex expansion slots that are on the Maximus V Extreme will come in handy from a work perspective.

In closing, your choices above are already very solid and very well 'informed' - just keep in mind that business about far more Watts and thus far more cooling and PSU requirements than even a person very good at math tends to assume - and that is before the assured desire to upgrade even more later biggrin.gif ....I would think that by about October, you will very seriously want to build an "IvyB-E' 15 core with Titan SLIs biggrin.gif

Edited by Joa3d43 - 2/15/13 at 1:29am
post #11884 of 33666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valgaur View Post

Don't even think of touching it, temps are great as it is. don't play with it for chances of ruining that. thumb.gif


THANKS thumb.gif - I actually want to never unlock that particular CPU lever again...do they make chastity belts for CPU sockets biggrin.gif
post #11885 of 33666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joa3d43 View Post

THANKS thumb.gif - I actually want to never unlock that particular CPU lever again...do they make chastity belts for CPU sockets biggrin.gif

Lol, not quite a lock but makes it a bit of work to get to the latch
    
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post #11886 of 33666
Quote:
Originally Posted by FtW 420 View Post

Lol, not quite a lock but makes it a bit of work to get to the latch

^^^ biggrin.gif ...but what if the CPU has to go to the toilet ?
post #11887 of 33666
Quote:
Originally Posted by VonDutch View Post

if everything works like it should, i wouldnt take it apart again,
even though the ihs is not seated perfectly..

i did all sides with liquid pro, had a 30+C tempdrop
if you apply the right amount, it doesnt matter if you use 1 layer on the die only,
or 2 thin layers on the die and under/inside ihs,
i think 20-30C temp drops should be possible..

anyways, if youre happy with the temps you have now, i wouldnt change anything,
"never change a winning team" right..
i had a few situations where i thought , hmm if i do this, it might be better,
and only made things worse ...lol
thats a great chart to use MikeG, thanks alot smile.gif
looks like most of us have "fun" ...lol and some enjoy the "danger" zone (vcore wise) ..hehe

...Thanks VonDutch thumb.gif per above, decided on a chastity belt for that CPU socket / lever smile.gif
post #11888 of 33666
Quote:
Originally Posted by FtW 420 View Post

Could just be a bum board, or the memory settings aren't playing nice. Are the VRMs getting hot to the touch?
It is possible it could be the cpu, that would just be about the worst cpu ever though...

If I had the hardware I could probably cook a rotisserie chicken off of the heat the VRM's generate.

But IDK, I think it is the board, I'd hate to dump more money into an old platform. I don't REALLY need to overclock this thing like mad, my kids just want computer access from time to time and they'd be fine with a Pentium 4. But I need to have all my hardware overclocked to the max about to explode, it's just my nature.
post #11889 of 33666
Should I just use cool liquid ultra between the core and ihs as well as between the ihs and the waterblock or should I use cool laboratory liquid metal pad or should I use Indigo Extreme?

How many times could one tube do? Could I de-lid 2 cpus and then mount 2 waterblocks with 1 tube?
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post #11890 of 33666
Quote:
Originally Posted by givmedew View Post

Should I just use cool liquid ultra between the core and ihs as well as between the ihs and the waterblock or should I use cool laboratory liquid metal pad or should I use Indigo Extreme?

How many times could one tube do? Could I de-lid 2 cpus and then mount 2 waterblocks with 1 tube?

1 tube can go a long way (as you only need a little bit) - but just remember if you put it ON THE IHS - then you might lose the markings on it.
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