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[Bit-Tech] Nvidia accused of crippling board partners' designs - Page 11

post #101 of 252
Nvidia trying to bend over end users, and manufacturers? What a surprise rolleyes.gif

ATI got the right idea, not gimping their GPU ranges and encouraging OC'ing.

I take Nvidia's attitude to be, we give you this shiz and you leave it how it is, you don't like it? Go and make AMD cards.

Msi/Asus/Gigabyte will just put more effort onto AMD Cards, and Sapphire/Powercolor, VTX3D will get a stronger foot into the market.
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post #102 of 252
Quote:
Originally Posted by feniks View Post

scrambling is what most people in this thread do, I sit well assured playing games on my single 670 reference at similar performance level I could get from 570 SLI in past ... not defending nvidia, just trying to state that the "problem" you all are worried about is of course about money and it exists between vendors and nvidia and eventually may touch the end consumers, especially the ones interested in buying a warrantied highly overclockable products (with components overvolted way above reference design).

And let the future-proofing that overclocking provides be limited to nearly none once those boards get outdated (still it's almost an empty argument unless you play Crysis 2 on six monitors with everything on ultra).
The problem is the lack of coverage of your overclocked product. If you plan on sticking with it for a while, forget pushing it a little over the edge. What they want is for you to buy higher tier products or more of the lower tier ones instead of overclocking a mid-range product to get a high-end performance (watercooling allows that).
Quote:
with all do respect I trust more an official statement of NVIDIA than some unofficial snippets from some insider who was not authorized to even release them - it's not officially confirmed and may change before final version a dozen times.

Sorry, but you sound VERY naive there. It's like expecting cigar companies to confirm on every study that state how harmfull cigars are.
They will not publicly confirm and probably won't even comment on anything remotely negative to the company's image, thats not how marketing is done.
Quote:
for now it looks to me like vendors try boycotting nvidia by dropping the factory overclocked and modified products from fear of paying for potential RMAs on those products and sticking to "safe" ones. I am not affiliating with ANY company in question and I could care less what they all come up with in the end, but knowing all corporations exist to make money, I am confident they will find a resolution pretty quickly. most likely the extra warranty/RMA cost will get shifted onto end-consumers, wouldn't be surprised if it comes to that if someone want to run a vendor modded design with unlocked voltage limits up to potentially unsafe levels.
I can understand nvidia's official position (reference products in warranty - vendor gets paid for RMA, modded designs no warranty - vendor covers the cost of RMA) as it's sound and very logical to me.

The end consumer (us) is harmed either way. If the vendor covers for the RMA, it will result in money loss, all their profit from selling a board would end up flushed down the RMA Service drain, so I highly doubt it would happen, since most of the times, their profits are somewhat slim.
The one profiting the most is Nvidia itself, since it produces the chips, decides the pricing and the supply. The partners end up with whatever else they can add to the price, be it because of a better cooling solution or better board engineering.
In the end, if you overclock a product, you do it at your own risk, since the manufacturer isn't backing you up on that, nor the partners. If you try and future-proof yourself with a light OC, you lose their support.
Not doubting the quality of the product here, but if the chips are made and tested to offer at least some safety overhead, then that shouldn't be much of a worry (except in extreme cases).
As a consumer and the guy PAYING for the product, I expect a bit more of assurance of it's quality, its my hard-earned cash being poured in, so if the manufacturer isn't up to guarantee me that the board can handle a bit more than it's original specs, it sounds like a "not worth buying" sign.
Sound like they want you to stick with the vanilla product and, if you want more performance, give them more cash. I like to get a bit more performance from my stuff, so I really don't like that.
And what is the pointing of branding a product as "enthusiast level" and pricing it accordingly if you can't even overvolt/OC it.?
post #103 of 252
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMD2600 View Post

My guess is that some manufacturers allowed OVing to unexceptable levels of what the power circuitry that Nvidia designed can handle. Resulting in a huge number of RMA's.

yeah, that's my point too smile.gif it's just B2B fuss and people are almost pissing themselves about it.
however be careful with such opinions around here, because you may get punched for that, thinking that we might have some vendors reps around here trying to start a revolt in their defense wink.gif
post #104 of 252

Nvidia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi View Post

/facepalm
WHAT PART OF NVIDIA THREATENING TO CUT OFF CHIP SUPPLY DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND? The point this article was making is that regardless of whether the vendor chooses to opt out of the warranty or not, if they make an overvolting board, nVidia will cut off their supply, or at least reduce it.

I'd be willing to bet that is what happened.

Nvidia said, "If you allow overvolting we won't warranty it." But board partners made overvolting boards anyways. So Nvidia needed a new threat to get the boards pulled off the market and it worked.

Nvidia wouldn't cut partners off from chips, but they could give them lower priority. (eg you don't get any chips until all other orders are filled)
Edited by erunion - 10/5/12 at 6:27pm
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post #105 of 252
Quote:
Originally Posted by feniks View Post

show me an OFFICIAL public and confirmed statement from nvidia on this and I WILL believe that it means the vendors drop such products from the line up.
Let's use simple to solve this. What's smarter, and better for everyone, limiting the card's BIOS voltage, so that they have to lose warranty coverage to overvolt, or the card's physical voltage, so that no one can overvolt ever?

Why would Nvidia not just choose the first option, I don't understand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xoleras View Post

Are you kidding me dude? That's like asking for an honest press release from a political campaign. Their AIB partners stated anonymously through reputable websites (with inside contacts) that allocation will be cut if they mod voltage, in other words -- nvidia is not being completely upfront about the situation. If that isn't enough for you, I don't know what is.
Nvidia won't state anything publicly that makes the company look bad. I hope you understand this.
lachen.gif

Nvidia releasing an honest statement like that. Only EA would have the balls to do that.
Quote:
yeah, that's my point too it's just B2B fuss and people are almost pissing themselves about it.
however be careful with such opinions around here, because you may get punched for that, thinking that we might have some vendors reps around here trying to start a revolt in their defense
Do people who flash the BIOS actually ever RMA it if it breaks? I'd hope that it is at least a small minority of people who OC this way and actually return it to the manufacturer when it's that far out of spec.
Edited by Art Vanelay - 10/5/12 at 6:28pm
post #106 of 252
well, despite all your lovely replies to my posts, I will not bother with typing a reply to each, sorry too tired for that after a week of work. got better things to do on Friday night biggrin.gif

it all only looks like the days of hardware mods will return quickly IF nvidia truly intends to do what so many people believe in (I believe nothing so far). you can call me names as you like, it's just my own approach, seeing is believing to me, since I can't see any specifics only gossips and rumors then I am not going to discuss about anything further, sorry, this discussion seems pointless to me and I probably shouldn't have taken part in it in first place. not a fan of sensational news.

all I can say is that IF nvidia does what is said they will, then they must have a good (FINANCIAL) reason for it, perhaps too high losses related to RMA of modded designs versus lower incomes with "locked" approach after limiting the supply to some vendors. as I said, corporations calculate every penny coldly ...
post #107 of 252
People aren't going to bother with hardware mods when they could just switch to AMD, and basically get a card that's built for overclocking. I sure as know that if I'm paying up to 1k on GPU's I'm not going to touch any of the hardware. Especially when I could just pick a side where I don't have to.

Funny how some board partners embrace overclocking, and others completely voltage lock their cards, it tells you who's really care's about their cash. (Well they all do but,... some less than others)
post #108 of 252
Quote:
Originally Posted by RB Snake View Post

People aren't going to bother with hardware mods when they could just switch to AMD, and basically get a card that's built for overclocking. I sure as know that if I'm paying up to 1k on GPU's I'm not going to touch any of the hardware. Especially when I could just pick a side where I don't have to.
Funny how some board partners embrace overclocking, and others completely voltage lock their cards, it tells you who's really care's about their cash. (Well they all do but,... some less than others)
And that's why everyone loves EVGA.
post #109 of 252
Quote:
Originally Posted by feniks View Post

well, despite all your lovely replies to my posts, I will not bother with typing a reply to each, sorry too tired for that after a week of work. got better things to do on Friday night biggrin.gif
it all only looks like the days of hardware mods will return quickly IF nvidia truly intends to do what so many people believe in (I believe nothing so far). you can call me names as you like, it's just my own approach, seeing is believing to me, since I can't see any specifics only gossips and rumors then I am not going to discuss about anything further, sorry, this discussion seems pointless to me and I probably shouldn't have taken part in it in first place. not a fan of sensational news.
all I can say is that IF nvidia does what is said they will, then they must have a good (FINANCIAL) reason for it, perhaps too high losses related to RMA of modded designs versus lower incomes with "locked" approach after limiting the supply to some vendors. as I said, corporations calculate every penny coldly ...
So AMD is sort of working against their investors? Because companies like nvidia it looks like and EA often have people in them that just care about the money, and not about just creating really good products, with money a secondary option. Maybe AMD is like this too but they just arent as good.

It's like V-MODA. Val Kolton (CEO) is coming out with new headphones, the M100, and he often posts on head-fi. One thing he said is that he doesnt want tons of advertising (just word of mouth unlike Beats or other companies. He didnt specifically say this of course), and that he just wants to make really good products. The money isnt the reason he made this company. And the amount of work he puts in shows how true this is. Granted he still has a lot of money and V-MODA is privately owned.
Edit: i just realized im doing that word of mouth thing. I swear that wasnt intentional. I thought of V-MODA first because I've been all over the M-100. tongue.gif

Valve is also privately owned. And I dont know if they work the same way, but they seem to care more about the consumers.

Is AMD like this too? Which would be weird since they are a public company. I dont understand why some public companies are like this, and some arent.
Edited by iEATu - 10/5/12 at 6:55pm
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post #110 of 252
Quote:
Originally Posted by iEATu View Post

So AMD is sort of working against their investors? Because companies like nvidia it looks like and EA often have people in them that just care about the money, and not about just creating really good products, with money a secondary option. Maybe AMD is like this too but they just arent as good.
It's like V-MODA. Val Kolton (CEO) is coming out with new headphones, the M100, and he often posts on head-fi. One thing he said is that he doesnt want tons of advertising (just word of mouth unlike Beats or other companies. He didnt specifically say this of course), and that he just wants to make really good products. The money isnt the reason he made this company. And the amount of work he puts in shows how true this is. Granted he still has a lot of money and V-MODA is privately owned.
Valve is also privately owned. And I dont know if they work the same way, but they seem to care more about the consumers.
Is AMD like this too? Which would be weird since they are a public company. I dont understand why some public companies are like this, and some arent.
Nah, Gabe Newell is just a marketing genius.

AMD is probably not like this either, they probably just realize how great it is to be able to win over the enthusiasts.
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