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post #311 of 411
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Originally Posted by Valor958 View Post

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Originally Posted by Nick7269 View Post

One thing that never ceases to amaze me on this forum, is the amount of people that try to justify a legal reason to break the law. doh.gif
As a read through this, some people are ready to start scrapping to push there belief that breaking the law is legal! haha
I can sleep better tonight now, thanks guys for the kick!

If the only thing that can be cited is 'breaking the law'... you have to take in all of the caveats to what those 'laws' actually say and cover. Many are vague to the point of irrelevance, and others are overbearing to the point of being illegal in and of themselves. Some that were attempting to take those extreme measures national (see SOPA/PIPA..) were sticken down.

The problem with the 'law' is that it is organic, but growing and changing at a pace maybe 1/10 of the society it attempts to represent/protect. Do you really think the lawmakers have a clue about the laws they're attempting to shove through for all the current technology? They're paid, via campaign contributions and such or with lobbyist support, to support things they're told are the root of all digital evil in the world and will damage their constituency... ie: do what we say or the little man will hate you and you'll lose everything, here, have some money to show we're serious.

Laws are created and stricken down almost daily... how are you supposed to keep faith in laws that are set up in bad faith and with unjust causes? Like an example I cited before... I go buy a book, read it, let you and whoever you want borrow it. I make no profit, but wish to spread the knowledge of said book. That can almost be considered noble if the receiving parties couldn't otherwise afford or have access to the material. Libraries do this daily... NOW, change that to a digital format... buy an e-book, read it, make a personal torrent for your friends to enjoy the work you bought. Now THAT is horribly illegal and is ruining the lives of publishers and writers worldwide.. SHAME ON YOU. Yes, JK Rowling is just rotting in filth right now... poor Stephen King too.. I feel for them, really I do.

In a lot of the actual P2P, it's a matter of semantics. The original work was purchased and is being shared free of charge on a digital format. I have no problem with this, and would have no problem with my works being distributed in this fashion. I wholeheartedly agree that using this to plagiarize works for profit, recognition, whatever... IS wrong, but this is also fairly uncommon with all the digital signatures readily available to be embeded in the original work. Do you see anyone out there claiming to have created any Assassin's Creed game and having removed the devs signatures? Nope... but Ubisoft may say yes. doh.gif

For a more direct example where the flow of P2P data an easily be misinterpreted by a cursory oversight by the ISP... pay2download music services... maybe iTunes to name one. I have friends who download several songs a day (paid) from iTunes b/c they're freaking addicted to it. All of these songs coming across the ISP filters may appear suspicious.. there's no proof a payment was made based solely on packet flow and titles of the songs. If confronted, why should my friend HAVE to prove they purchased these songs, or any other digital products, simply to satisfty the whims imposed on the ISP to make them paranoid.

If the MPAA/RIAA and their affiliates were trully suffering like they'd have us believe... I doubt they could afford all of the lobbyists still in play to force through their ideals and whims. A few years back, I remember hearing about a music star (not musician...), maybe it was Britney Spears, complaining that they had to buy a cheaper personal jet due to lower sales... and blamed music piracy. Two things, since this isn't an out-there example...1) You have a private jet... **** you pretentious ****... 2) How about lost sales from people just not liking you or your music?
People need to stop blaming piracy and making excuses... how about do a better job and people will WANT to pay for it to support you. I could have EASILY pirated a copy of Wndows 7, but chose to pay for it since I liked the demo I was able to access... same for some 50 games in my game library that I bought after a demo (not including ones I bought without demo access), and tons of cds or digital albums I bought after a few sample songs to let me see what I was in store for. Torrenting is now bad/evil/illegal, nor is PirateBay for that matter... they can be abused and actually illegal torrenting/piracy CAN occur. I would argue the percentages behind this though as the average person downloading maybe a few dozen songs a year they hear on the radio is not destroying ANYONES way of life or profit margins... wait, I take that back... the MPAA/RIAA will destroy yours to make an example of you over some music...
http://www.torontosun.com/tech/news/2010/11/04/15967161.html
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,96797,00.html
... $150,000 PER SONG... yes, let us all feel relieved in the 'justice' being served in the name of music...
Even a wedding isn't safe: http://fstoppers.com/news-wedding-photog-sued-over-music-a-cautionary-tale - This is just one example... i've alwso heard the RIAA claiming fair use abuses since a wedding is somehow a commercialized affair and you have to as permission to play music at your own wedding... Sparsely inforced, sure, but done enough to make an example of people and be jerks in general.
Sorry for the rant/walls of text, but seriously... this is not some epidemic that is destroying industry wholesale... some 'damage', sure... but let me be the first to slap the first stupidly rich celeb or exec whining they can't buy a new jet for thier birthday... I can't buy a 2nd car so my wife and I don't have to share and have her have access to the world at large while I'm at work. We share plenty, but it's a real hastle to get the kids up at 6AM just so i can get to work on time so they can enjoy a day out of the apartment. Not even a house, or 6 backup houses in different states if I get wanderlust... an apartment...
Did I forget to mention how bummed I am I can't afford those $200-600 pairs of jeans either, so that I can be 'cool' and 'fashionable'... Walmart Levis work fine for me and have for many many years. How about my lack of a Rolex collection with a different watch for every day of the year, poor little me has to rely on my handy Fossil watch I was gifted a few years back or my anniversary pocketwatch inscribed at Things Remembered… I DEMAND JUSTICE madsmiley.png

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post #312 of 411
I have a feeling I'm making a name for myself here as one of the local ranters... apparently i'm being well received at least biggrin.gif
I don't always rant, but when i do...
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post #313 of 411
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post #314 of 411
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What ever are you talking about? wink.gif
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post #316 of 411
Quote:
Originally Posted by HardwareDecoder View Post

You aren't serious are you? How would the the people these companies pay to check the "peers" tab of a torrent client even know if someone was running wireless or wired? All they see is an ip.

Incorrect,

Other information is broadcast as well, and easily traceable. It is possible to actually pull and track the MAC address of the system the user is sitting at, and keep tabs on it throughout it's travels. This typically works well as very few people know you can easily change a MAC or at least spoof one.

A good example of a recent case we were involved in, sans some details....

A customer of ours was identified as trading large amounts of child pornography. Law enforcement requested his information, we provided it, and from there we, law enforcement and ourselves, monitored his traffic from our network. Once they had established a large enough evidence base they pulled the MAC, for his computer, and entered it into various systems. From these systems they were able to track his MAC pretty much anywhere he went and used his system.

This particular customer traveled a lot, and even when off our network, states away, law enforcement was able to watch for his MAC and whenever it came up on certain sites, his data was capture. Notifications sent to authorities, and more evidence built up.

Eventually when the hammer was brought down on him the charges were harsher, as he transported illegal materials across state lines, etc. Since he also sent the content in multiple states each state had legal ground to charge him in each state.

So...no, an IP isn't all that is seen.
    
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post #317 of 411
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

A customer of ours was identified as trading large amounts of child pornography. Law enforcement requested his information, we provided it, and from there we, law enforcement and ourselves, monitored his traffic from our network. Once they had established a large enough evidence base they pulled the MAC, for his computer, and entered it into various systems. From these systems they were able to track his MAC pretty much anywhere he went and used his system.
This particular customer traveled a lot, and even when off our network, states away, law enforcement was able to watch for his MAC and whenever it came up on certain sites, his data was capture. Notifications sent to authorities, and more evidence built up.
Eventually when the hammer was brought down on him the charges were harsher, as he transported illegal materials across state lines, etc. Since he also sent the content in multiple states each state had legal ground to charge him in each state.
So...no, an IP isn't all that is seen.
And the moral is: don't look at child pornography.
post #318 of 411
Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Vanelay View Post

And the moral is: don't look at child pornography.

If you think it stops at child pornography...You shouldn't be on these forums.

In Jan/Feb, the company I was working for was DDOS'd hard, we went to the ISP with an authority...Those individuals were persecuted with the assistance of the ISP.

Like I always say: There's no such thing as anonymity on the internet.

You all believe that by loading VPS's and Proxy servers that it's impossible to trace you...It's really not...Difficult, maybe...Impossible? No. ~ Hit someone with enough time on their hands, they'll find you.

This bill, streamlines that process, among other things...
post #319 of 411
Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Vanelay View Post

And the moral is: don't look at child pornography.

You either have a dark sense of humor or a deeply troubled sense of morality.
post #320 of 411
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

Incorrect,
Other information is broadcast as well, and easily traceable. It is possible to actually pull and track the MAC address of the system the user is sitting at, and keep tabs on it throughout it's travels. This typically works well as very few people know you can easily change a MAC or at least spoof one.
A good example of a recent case we were involved in, sans some details....
A customer of ours was identified as trading large amounts of child pornography. Law enforcement requested his information, we provided it, and from there we, law enforcement and ourselves, monitored his traffic from our network. Once they had established a large enough evidence base they pulled the MAC, for his computer, and entered it into various systems. From these systems they were able to track his MAC pretty much anywhere he went and used his system.
This particular customer traveled a lot, and even when off our network, states away, law enforcement was able to watch for his MAC and whenever it came up on certain sites, his data was capture. Notifications sent to authorities, and more evidence built up.
Eventually when the hammer was brought down on him the charges were harsher, as he transported illegal materials across state lines, etc. Since he also sent the content in multiple states each state had legal ground to charge him in each state.
So...no, an IP isn't all that is seen.


You said it your self, a mac address is easily changeable I know on linux it is one command to change it, thus it is easily spoofable. Making it not much evidence in a court of law...... its not like some kind of computer DNA

Its not like having a supposed mac ADDRESS of a machine doesn't leave infinite reasonable doubt to anyone who knows / is explained how you can change one as many times as you want to any address you want at any time you want.
Edited by HardwareDecoder - 10/18/12 at 1:02pm
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