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VERY cheap gaming computer advice - Page 2

post #11 of 25
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yeroon View Post

Missed the question about the a8 vs a6- tri core
The a6 loses about 30% gpu performance compared to the a8, probably more in cpu but the gpu is where the goal seems to be.
Any a8 will have the 400 shaders/600mhz clock, a6 goes down to 320/443. 1866 mem is important to the gpu, so if you do find other deals on the sites you would pick from, try to keep the mem speed up. Timings isn't as big a deal for the igpu, but the cpu will benefit from lower timings.

A8 it is then!

Quote:
I am pretty sure most flight sims do better with single threaded performance. You may want to look into a used Sandybridge Pentium Dual core with a 7750 or similar, that will give you about the same graphical performance as an A8 w/ 6670, but it will have much better single threaded performance.

I did some digging on that game and the recommended processors are quad cores. So maybe only some flight sims take advantage of quad cores.

Quote:
Alternatively, though at higher cost (but worthwhile IMO)

AMD A8-5600k + ASRock A55 board - $156 shipped [Newegg]
Crucial Ballistix 2x2GB DDR3-1866 - $25 shipped [Newegg]

$181 shipped

This appears to be the best deal so far. Not much different than the other one posted, but it looks like at this price point there isn't going to be much variation. I'll probably grab this deal or the other one Yeroon made along with a 350w Rosewill psu just to be on the safe side. I believe he is using a 300w Diablotek psu.
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post #12 of 25
In FSX, for the longest time, the 9800GT was considered the best card, no idea what second hand ones go for but it can't be much. FSX isn't graphically intensive really, it's more, as someone else said, affected by single threaded performance. You didn't mention FSX, but I thought I would since it might also be on his list of stuff he wants to run. Oh, and by the way, if he does want to run FSX and it's a new install, screw FSX and get Prepar3D instead which is the same code base under new ownership but now actively developed.
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post #13 of 25
Thread Starter 
I'll definitely ask him about that. I wish I could remember more games that he plays but the one I mentioned was the only one that really stood out, mostly because I could barely spell it.

Would there be an advantage to going to something Intel Dual Core based vs the A8? Or would the differences not be great enough to really matter?

I'd rather not lose performace in the long run (the computer he has now is from '03, so you can see how long it will be til his next upgrade) if games decide to move towards multiple cores.
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post #14 of 25
Sorry but I'm not sure about those CPUs. I do know that FSX makes use of multiple cores, but in a different way to most games - the core runs only on the first thread, but the texture loaders run on any other available cores. Not sure if Prepar3D is better in this regard yet. AVSIM would be a good place to ask about CPU choices if it's something he plans to run, and people there may also be able to suggest other budget GPUs to consider.
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post #15 of 25
I dont see an intel build capable of matching an a8 cpu/gpu wise within budget. You'd need an i3 and a 6570, which is already $160 minimum. doesn't seem budget possible.
If he's playing with what he has now, both a8's will be a large improvement single thread, and have 4 cores for multi. The apu cpu cores arent slouches, nor are they powerhouses.
post #16 of 25
FM2 is the much better route. AMD will be using it for 3 years or so, so it will be future proof and allow meaningful upgrades.
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post #17 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yeroon View Post

I dont see an intel build capable of matching an a8 cpu/gpu wise within budget. You'd need an i3 and a 6570, which is already $160 minimum. doesn't seem budget possible.
If he's playing with what he has now, both a8's will be a large improvement single thread, and have 4 cores for multi. The apu cpu cores arent slouches, nor are they powerhouses.
wrong .. an intel build + a discrete gpu is more than capable of matching a llano or trinity build.
as for i3 costing $125 you dont need an i3 for gaming .. most games dont even use hyperthreading.. an intel pentium is more than enough for gaming ..
a G860 goes for $80 and provides the exact same performance as a $125 i3..
add a discrete hd7750 for $100 and a decent H61 or H67 mobo for $60.
total $240 .. which will beat an equivalent trinity build ..
i have a G630 , a gigabyte H61 mobo and a a radeon hd7750.. its a decent budget gaming build..
no need for i3.. or trinity when you are looking to go cheap..
    
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post #18 of 25
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-fx-pentium-apu-benchmark,3120-10.html

check this link out..
the pentium chips beat out the A6, A8, athlon2 x4 , phenom 2x4 955 as well as the fx-4100 in gaming benchmarks..
thats a 70$ chip beating the $120 amd bulldozer ..
the fact that these pentiums are dual cores make no.difference in gaming performance at all..
thats an.amazing showing by intel pentiums..
    
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post #19 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by mohit9206 View Post

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-fx-pentium-apu-benchmark,3120-10.html
check this link out..
the pentium chips beat out the A6, A8, athlon2 x4 , phenom 2x4 955 as well as the fx-4100 in gaming benchmarks..
thats a 70$ chip beating the $120 amd bulldozer ..
the fact that these pentiums are dual cores make no.difference in gaming performance at all..
thats an.amazing showing by intel pentiums..
Yeah, and that's a review that makes an unrealistic comparison that pits them all against each other with an HD 7970 which is not only a ridiculous, unbalanced pairing with such a low budget CPU but not to be expected for the same reason that people buy low budget CPUs: to build on a budget. A $200 GPU would not pose the same performance differences because it is not held back by the same platform restrictions.

Rest assured if you use this review again in a comparison recommendation, you may be discredited. This is a horrible reference and Tom's has mislead people time and time again with similar reviews - a recent one featured the FX-4170 against the i3 3220 again with just a 7970.

I consider the AM3 platform to be a far more balanced and superior gaming option for price as opposed to the low-budget LGA1155 platform because it is more sensible for modern PC users - PC users who may wish to multitask and transcode a video or browse the web in the background running alongside the game. A true quad-core processor will provide for a far more consistent experience. Honestly, for productivity's sake, I discourage the use of anything less than a quad core CPU unless the budget really does not accomodate one or there will be little to no multitasking.
post #20 of 25
For ~$150-200 I would do the following:


AMD discrete:

CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103886
That's $60 with $10 off promo code.

GPU: http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=GT440-PCIE-15DDR3-CO&cat=VCD
This will be ~$65 with shipping. This is not the regular retail version of the GT440, this is the higher end version of the various OEM versions out there with 24 ROPs and an ~800MHZ core clock. Use an overclocking utility to bump up the GDDR3 speed on this as high as it will run stable to help unleash some of the available grunt from all of those ROPs.

MOBO: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131795R
Open box, should be fine since this is going into a machine that should already have SATA cables so even if it's missing accessories it won't matter.

RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820313086
Use 20% off promo code. No need for high performance memory here since it will just be the CPU using it.

That's $195 shipped give or take. I like this build because it comes with 8GB of RAM right off the bat, and I am confident it would eek out a better gaming performance than similar priced APU options in DX9/10 games due to the more robust discrete GPU. The downside to this build, is that the MOBO and GPU may have fairly limited warranties for various reasons.


Intel discrete:

CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116397

GPU: Same as suggested above.

MOBO/RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1085450

$198 shipped. I like this build because the G850 provides very good per-core performance, which in most games is preferable. The downside here, is that the mobo is made by ECS (bleh), and it only starts off with a single channel 4GB RAM configuration.


AMD Trinity APU:

CPU/GPU: http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=76269
On sale for $120
OR: http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=76271&vpn=AD560KWOHJBOX&manufacture=AMD&promoid=1258
$100

MOBO: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B009HP42J4/?tag=pcpapi-20
$50 board, free shipping, makes this the lowest cost FM2 board I am aware of. The updated VRMs on this board from MSI should make for an acceptable platform for future mild overclocking if heatsinks are added.

RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226288&name=Desktop-Memory&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-na-_-na-_-na&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID=
This build (IMO) requires both 8GB of RAM, and modules that you can get to 1866 speeds or better. These low voltage modules should have the OCing headroom to run at 1866 speeds and tighter timings than they are listed at. Experiment in the 1.5-1.6V range to get the speeds up.

$185 or $205 shipped. (depending on CPU selection). The A8 is the better value for playing older DX9 games as the extra shader cores of the A10 will go mostly un-used except in more modern titles.

I would suggest working on finding a stable under-volted setting for the CPU, which will help free up some watts for the iGPU, which should be overclocked a bit. Work on those RAM speeds as well and hope for the best.


AMD llano APU build:

MOBO: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138333
This MOBO comes with a free 2x4GB memory kit. The motherboard here has the VRM capability to do some overclocking of both the CPU and iGPU here. Pick one of the K edition A6 or A8 combo specials to go with this MOBO. (example: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1068228 )

Price: $165 or $185 shipped depending on whether the A6 or A8 CPU is selected in the combo. Either way is good here since the iGPUs should have similar enough performance once overclocked.


Alternate llano APU:

MOBO: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138361
This MOBO comes with a free 2x4GB memory kit. This motherboard would be best paired with non-K edition chips and is available in combo specials like the board above with the various llano chips. Pick a non-K A6 or A8 chip to pair with this. (Example: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1068040 )
Prices range from $130 to $152 depending on the chip chosen and I would absolutely suggest the A8-3850 here in order to get the 6550D iGPU since these iGPUs can not be OCed. You can technically pair this MOBO with the "K" option CPUs, just have to be responsible about how you go about OCing. I would suggest a similar approach as what I suggested with the trinity build: leave the CPU clock alone for the most part, just find a stable under-volt, then work on cranking only the iGPU speeds instead.


These llano builds with the free memory are easily the best value option right now. In either llano build option, I highly suggest tweaking the memory. Crank it to ~1.6V - 1.7V and try to run it at 1866 speeds or higher. The fact that a full (and respectable) CPU/GPU/MOBO/RAM combo can be bought for around or under $150 on the FM1 platform right now is absolutely awesome. If you need to keep the budget down around here, these llano build options are absolutely the ticket right now with that free memory special. (not sure how long that will last so hurry!).
Edited by mdocod - 10/17/12 at 12:03am
     
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FX-8350 990X EVO R2.0 Sparkle GTX460 768MB ballistix tactical 2 x 8GB 
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Manjaro Linux Samsung 21.5" LCD E2009WFP E2009WFP 
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Seasonic G 550W Modular Fractal Design Core 3500 
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FX-6300, 4.7 GHZ@1.43V GA-970A-UD3P GTX 460 768MB Mixed DIMMs. 2x4GB + 2x8GB @ 1600-8-8-8 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Toshiba THNSNH 19nm 256GB 1TB Spinpoint F3 WD RE3 1TB WD RE3 1TB 
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yes CM Seidon 120V SolydK OpenSuse 13.1 
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Linux Mint 9-32 bit // Linux Mint 17-64 bit  Manjaro Xfce Samsung 21.5" HannsG 21.5" sideways! 
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Sticky ATNG Rosewill Green 630W NZXT Gamma Basic Microsoft corded 
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A10-6800k 4.8GHZ @ 1.375V, 1.2GHZ iGPU Gigabyte GA-F2A85XN-WIFI HD8670D Ripjaws 
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Seagate ST1000DM003 Asus BC-12B1ST/BLK/B/AS Zalman CNPS5X Linux Mint 15 
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LG IPS224V-PN Logitec K360 FSP 400W Aurum S 80+ gold Prodigy 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
FX-8350 990X EVO R2.0 Sparkle GTX460 768MB ballistix tactical 2 x 8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Toshiiba THNSNH 256GB Enterprise RE3 1TB Asus BD combo drive Artic A30 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Manjaro Linux Samsung 21.5" LCD E2009WFP E2009WFP 
PowerCase
Seasonic G 550W Modular Fractal Design Core 3500 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
FX-6300, 4.7 GHZ@1.43V GA-970A-UD3P GTX 460 768MB Mixed DIMMs. 2x4GB + 2x8GB @ 1600-8-8-8 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Toshiba THNSNH 19nm 256GB 1TB Spinpoint F3 WD RE3 1TB WD RE3 1TB 
Optical DriveCoolingOSOS
yes CM Seidon 120V SolydK OpenSuse 13.1 
OSOSMonitorMonitor
Linux Mint 9-32 bit // Linux Mint 17-64 bit  Manjaro Xfce Samsung 21.5" HannsG 21.5" sideways! 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Sticky ATNG Rosewill Green 630W NZXT Gamma Basic Microsoft corded 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
A10-6800k 4.8GHZ @ 1.375V, 1.2GHZ iGPU Gigabyte GA-F2A85XN-WIFI HD8670D Ripjaws 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Seagate ST1000DM003 Asus BC-12B1ST/BLK/B/AS Zalman CNPS5X Linux Mint 15 
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LG IPS224V-PN Logitec K360 FSP 400W Aurum S 80+ gold Prodigy 
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logitec M235 
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