Overclock.net › Forums › AMD › AMD CPUs › [OFFICIAL] FX-8320/FX-8350 Vishera Owners Club
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[OFFICIAL] FX-8320/FX-8350 Vishera Owners Club - Page 924

post #9231 of 67229
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

8350s are just binned better. They'll hit the same OC's on less voltage. List in the OP justifies that.

Not to say 8320s can't match 8350s, it'll just take more to get them there.

Ok i appreciate your opinion thanks. I have been debating the binning thoery in my mind for a while, for that to be conclusive though i feel in my opinion the cross section of cpu`s would have to be tested in exactly the same setting from the skill of the over clocker to the hardware set up even down to the ambient room temp. This will never happen i suppose so the opening page is a decent guide

The same theory was around for the 8120/8150, my 8120 was sold by ocuk as guaranteed overclocker to the point of the 8150 and stay within warranty guaranteed by Amd. This would suggest to me the "binning" was exactly the same as the 8150 and Amd just sold procs at differing speeds out of the box for the public of which the enthusiast market makes up a miniscule %. Mr Smith who knows nothing of overclocking walks into major retailer and sees the 8120/8320 then looks at the 8150/8350 at the higher frequency and would opt for the faster cpu in most cases without the knowledge of multipliers.
Edited by Ghost12 - 3/2/13 at 3:57pm
post #9232 of 67229
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost12 View Post

Ok i appreciate your opinion thanks. I have been debating the binning thoery in my mind for a while, for that to be conclusive though i feel in my opinion the cross section of cpu`s would have to be tested in exactly the same setting from the skill of the over clocker to the hardware set up even down to the ambient room temp. This will never happen i suppose so the opening page is a decent guide

it boils down to Voltage and TDP.. they are the same chip from the same silicon. the only difference is that silicon can only become so pure. and in order to not waste money there is a binning process. You could get a 8320 that is a repackaged 8350 only because the par level for sales needed more 8320's.. aka same thing had happened with the nvidia 465's and 470's a couple years back,

next is the voltage. in order to fit into specs to run a 8350 you should be able to hit 4Ghz with no more than 1.42 volts which is almost out of spec

same thing with thermals.. they need them to fit into the 125w TDP or thermal release. . if either don't fit then the chip can be downclocked and reduce both voltage and thermal. I do believe this is also how they come up with the 6300's and 4300s by deactivating cores which reduce both voltage and thermal or there may be a bad core being silicon cannot be made 100% pure even a dust particle can create such an issue

so in short the 8350 and 8320 are from the same silicon just binned differently. In Kyad's case i think he got a repackaged chip as they had to create par levels for all chips produced.

I think that sums that up as well as possible


Also just wow this thread keeps active haha.. I just de-soldered a powerjack off of a laptop and there were 14 new posts haha
Wet Billy
(15 items)
 
PHENOM Phoenix
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX 8350 @ 5.06GHz AsUS Sabertooth R2.0 xfx 280x DD Crucial Ballistex Tactical Tracer 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 830 SSD 128GB LG BD-ROM/DVD Rewriter XSPC Raystorm RS240 kit A LOT OF FANS 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
WIN 7 ultamate AOC 23" LED LCD Microsoft wireless laser 6000 Rosewill Capstone 750w 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Coolermaster HAF 912 Microsoft wireless laser 6000 none 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
phenom II x6 1100T MSI 990FXA-GD65 GTX 460 GTX 460 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer 8GB (2 x 4GB)... Samsung SSD 830  LG Blueray Coolermaster N520 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Win 7 Ultimate x64 AOC 1080p LED Microsoft OCZ 850w 
Case
Coolermaster HAF 912 
  hide details  
Reply
Wet Billy
(15 items)
 
PHENOM Phoenix
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX 8350 @ 5.06GHz AsUS Sabertooth R2.0 xfx 280x DD Crucial Ballistex Tactical Tracer 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 830 SSD 128GB LG BD-ROM/DVD Rewriter XSPC Raystorm RS240 kit A LOT OF FANS 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
WIN 7 ultamate AOC 23" LED LCD Microsoft wireless laser 6000 Rosewill Capstone 750w 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Coolermaster HAF 912 Microsoft wireless laser 6000 none 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
phenom II x6 1100T MSI 990FXA-GD65 GTX 460 GTX 460 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer 8GB (2 x 4GB)... Samsung SSD 830  LG Blueray Coolermaster N520 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Win 7 Ultimate x64 AOC 1080p LED Microsoft OCZ 850w 
Case
Coolermaster HAF 912 
  hide details  
Reply
post #9233 of 67229
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost12 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

8350s are just binned better. They'll hit the same OC's on less voltage. List in the OP justifies that.

Not to say 8320s can't match 8350s, it'll just take more to get them there.

Ok i appreciate your opinion thanks. I have been debating the binning thoery in my mind for a while, for that to be conclusive though i feel in my opinion the cross section of cpu`s would have to be tested in exactly the same setting from the skill of the over clocker to the hardware set up even down to the ambient room temp. This will never happen i suppose so the opening page is a decent guide

They don't need a range of ambients at all. Hotter is hotter, for everything.

Otherwise, they are tested in the same settings. But not by overclockers. 8350s are tested to run at 4Ghz, and they have to do it inside a 125w TDP. This is why you get different VID on different chips.

Some chips are more leaky then others, and so put out more heat, but they require less voltage to run, which undoes that heat. Like the chips with 1.3v VID that have a hard time going fast due to insane temps.

Others are very cold, but require more voltage through the CPU in order to stay stable. Like ones with 1.4v VID. They have a hard time going very fast because of the shear voltage required.

And some others, have a balance. They're kinda leaky, but they don't require much voltage, and so everything balances out.

Now, the question becomes how many of those chips can actually do 4.0 inside 125w, and how many can turbo to 4.2 in the same thermal envelope. The ones that do, get branded 8350s. Ones that can't, but can do 3.5 in a 125w TDP get branded 8320s. Ones with a broken module get branded 6300s, and those with 2 broken modules get branded 4300s.

It doesn't end there however, because sometimes there's demand for your lower parts, but everything keeps binning highly. This is what happened to Bulldozer, which is why there was almost no difference between the 8150 and 8120. In this case, they will take some of the CPUs that should have been 8350s, and label them 8320s anyway. Our chips would be one of these. If there is "too much" demand for 6300s, they will even take some 8320s and turn off a module and sell it as that.

That is the process of binning. Whatever tools they use for the job, it's far better then anything we can do, they have to do it in bulk after all. Intel and nVidia do the same thing. Parts that did not make the cut for Tesla can become Quadros, and parts that don't make the cut for Quadros become GeForce (at least for Fermi).

It's not a theory, it's just something companies do to maximize profit out of what they have. Piledriver happens to have been Binned more aggressively then Bulldozer was, that's all.
Edited by KyadCK - 3/2/13 at 4:07pm
Forge
(17 items)
 
Forge-LT
(7 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i7-5960X (4.625Ghz) ASUS X99-DELUXE/U3.1 2x AMD R9-FuryX 64GB Corsair Dominator Platinum (3000Mhz 8x8GB) 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 512GB EK Predator 240 Windows 10 Enterprise x64 2x Acer XR341CK 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Corsair Vengeance K70 RGB Corsair AX1200 Thermaltake X9 Corsair Vengeance M65 RGB 
AudioAudioAudioAudio
Sennheiser HD700 Objective2+ODAC REV B Sound Blaster ZxR Audio Technica AT2020 
Audio
30ART Mic Tube Amp 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-4720HQ UX501JW-UB71T GTX 960m 16GB 1600 9-9-9-27 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
512GB PCI-e SSD Windows 10 Pro 4k IPS 
  hide details  
Reply
Forge
(17 items)
 
Forge-LT
(7 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i7-5960X (4.625Ghz) ASUS X99-DELUXE/U3.1 2x AMD R9-FuryX 64GB Corsair Dominator Platinum (3000Mhz 8x8GB) 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 512GB EK Predator 240 Windows 10 Enterprise x64 2x Acer XR341CK 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Corsair Vengeance K70 RGB Corsair AX1200 Thermaltake X9 Corsair Vengeance M65 RGB 
AudioAudioAudioAudio
Sennheiser HD700 Objective2+ODAC REV B Sound Blaster ZxR Audio Technica AT2020 
Audio
30ART Mic Tube Amp 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-4720HQ UX501JW-UB71T GTX 960m 16GB 1600 9-9-9-27 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
512GB PCI-e SSD Windows 10 Pro 4k IPS 
  hide details  
Reply
post #9234 of 67229
Those two explanations above are brilliant, Thank you for taking the time to explain. I understand this now, user input from people like yourselves is invalid to people learning like me and what makes this community better "binned" than the rest
post #9235 of 67229
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost12 View Post

Ok i appreciate your opinion thanks. I have been debating the binning thoery in my mind for a while, for that to be conclusive though i feel in my opinion the cross section of cpu`s would have to be tested in exactly the same setting from the skill of the over clocker to the hardware set up even down to the ambient room temp. This will never happen i suppose so the opening page is a decent guide

The same theory was around for the 8120/8150, my 8120 was sold by ocuk as guaranteed overclocker to the point of the 8150 and stay within warranty guaranteed by Amd. This would suggest to me the "binning" was exactly the same as the 8150 and Amd just sold procs at differing speeds out of the box for the public of which the enthusiast market makes up a miniscule %. Mr Smith who knows nothing of overclocking walks into major retailer and sees the 8120/8320 then looks at the 8150/8350 at the higher frequency and would opt for the faster cpu in most cases without the knowledge of multipliers.


Ehh, you dont need to get to technical... just look at the base VIDs of 8320's vs 8350s. 8350s are generally 1.3 - 1.35v while 8320s are 1.325 - 1.4v...
FX'd
(18 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Amd FX 8350 GA-990FXA-UD3 R5 EVGA GTX 660 SC EVGA GTX 660 SC 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16gb Samsung 30nm Corsair Performance Pro OCZ Vertex 4 Samsung 840 EVO 
Optical DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Lite-on DVD/CD Swiftech H220 Win 10 + Start 10 Samsung 245BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G510 Corsair HX1050 SilverStone RV02 MS SideWinder 
Mouse PadAudio
MIONIX Propus 380 Realtek ALC1150 
  hide details  
Reply
FX'd
(18 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Amd FX 8350 GA-990FXA-UD3 R5 EVGA GTX 660 SC EVGA GTX 660 SC 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16gb Samsung 30nm Corsair Performance Pro OCZ Vertex 4 Samsung 840 EVO 
Optical DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Lite-on DVD/CD Swiftech H220 Win 10 + Start 10 Samsung 245BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G510 Corsair HX1050 SilverStone RV02 MS SideWinder 
Mouse PadAudio
MIONIX Propus 380 Realtek ALC1150 
  hide details  
Reply
post #9236 of 67229
Well Kyad, I never expected to say this, but the M5A97 R2.0 ctually clocks better then the UD3. The UD3 was unstable no matter what I did, and I just passes 2 hours of IBT on Maximum on the M5A97 with 4.52Ghz @ 1.404v - NB & HT @ 2400Mhz.

Just too bad the M5A97 doesn't wanna run with my BBSE Tridents.. It just refuses to run anything over 1866Mhz on them and it randomly reboots or gives Memory Management errors with lower speeds. Heck even 1600 10-10-10-30 crashes randomly while the chips can do 2133 7-9-7...

I'll see what i'm going to do.. Maybe i'll grab a better board, like a M5A99X EVO, and hope it'll take the Tridents, or maybe i'l just trade it for something else like a 1155 set again... I really don't know rofl.
Thundahcat.
(20 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD Athlon XP-M Barton @ 2612Mhz ASUS A7N8X-X HIS Radeon X800XL 256MB w/ V-MOD @ 585Mhz GPU 5... 3x512MB Samsung PC-3200 CL3 
Hard DriveCoolingOSOS
Maxtor 80GB IDE Cooler Master alu/copper block with a Slipstrea... Windows 98 SE Windows XP Pro SP3 
PowerCase
Cooler Master Real Power M520W OEM with great airflow and even cable management 
  hide details  
Reply
Thundahcat.
(20 items)
 
   
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD Athlon XP-M Barton @ 2612Mhz ASUS A7N8X-X HIS Radeon X800XL 256MB w/ V-MOD @ 585Mhz GPU 5... 3x512MB Samsung PC-3200 CL3 
Hard DriveCoolingOSOS
Maxtor 80GB IDE Cooler Master alu/copper block with a Slipstrea... Windows 98 SE Windows XP Pro SP3 
PowerCase
Cooler Master Real Power M520W OEM with great airflow and even cable management 
  hide details  
Reply
post #9237 of 67229
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost12 View Post

Those two explanations above are brilliant, Thank you for taking the time to explain. I understand this now, user input from people like yourselves is invalid to people learning like me and what makes this community better "binned" than the rest

no problem
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadGoat View Post

Ehh, you dont need to get to technical... just look at the base VIDs of 8320's vs 8350s. 8350s are generally 1.3 - 1.35v while 8320s are 1.325 - 1.4v...

thats one way to look at it.. however there are a couple other things that come into play,, and it had seemed to want a more in depth answer..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imprezzion View Post

Well Kyad, I never expected to say this, but the M5A97 R2.0 ctually clocks better then the UD3. The UD3 was unstable no matter what I did, and I just passes 2 hours of IBT on Maximum on the M5A97 with 4.52Ghz @ 1.404v - NB & HT @ 2400Mhz.

Just too bad the M5A97 doesn't wanna run with my BBSE Tridents.. It just refuses to run anything over 1866Mhz on them and it randomly reboots or gives Memory Management errors with lower speeds. Heck even 1600 10-10-10-30 crashes randomly while the chips can do 2133 7-9-7...

I'll see what i'm going to do.. Maybe i'll grab a better board, like a M5A99X EVO, and hope it'll take the Tridents, or maybe i'l just trade it for something else like a 1155 set again... I really don't know rofl.

I wouldn't say that.. Kyad is running 5.2 on a ud3.... also you are doing a small OC.. im sure there has to be something going on or you just got a bunk board. I even got 4.5 on the MSI GD65 but anything after that it just faltered.. so TBH i seriously doubt that board is better than the ud3..

before getting another board I would check out the ram QVL that may be in part why its not working that great.. in addition since you are running a lower grade board you may have to hit that timing with FSB overclocking to get it stable. I know with the GD65 thats what I had to do to even run my ram at 1866
Edited by F3ERS 2 ASH3S - 3/2/13 at 4:31pm
Wet Billy
(15 items)
 
PHENOM Phoenix
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX 8350 @ 5.06GHz AsUS Sabertooth R2.0 xfx 280x DD Crucial Ballistex Tactical Tracer 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 830 SSD 128GB LG BD-ROM/DVD Rewriter XSPC Raystorm RS240 kit A LOT OF FANS 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
WIN 7 ultamate AOC 23" LED LCD Microsoft wireless laser 6000 Rosewill Capstone 750w 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Coolermaster HAF 912 Microsoft wireless laser 6000 none 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
phenom II x6 1100T MSI 990FXA-GD65 GTX 460 GTX 460 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer 8GB (2 x 4GB)... Samsung SSD 830  LG Blueray Coolermaster N520 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Win 7 Ultimate x64 AOC 1080p LED Microsoft OCZ 850w 
Case
Coolermaster HAF 912 
  hide details  
Reply
Wet Billy
(15 items)
 
PHENOM Phoenix
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX 8350 @ 5.06GHz AsUS Sabertooth R2.0 xfx 280x DD Crucial Ballistex Tactical Tracer 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 830 SSD 128GB LG BD-ROM/DVD Rewriter XSPC Raystorm RS240 kit A LOT OF FANS 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
WIN 7 ultamate AOC 23" LED LCD Microsoft wireless laser 6000 Rosewill Capstone 750w 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Coolermaster HAF 912 Microsoft wireless laser 6000 none 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
phenom II x6 1100T MSI 990FXA-GD65 GTX 460 GTX 460 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer 8GB (2 x 4GB)... Samsung SSD 830  LG Blueray Coolermaster N520 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Win 7 Ultimate x64 AOC 1080p LED Microsoft OCZ 850w 
Case
Coolermaster HAF 912 
  hide details  
Reply
post #9238 of 67229
Quote:
Originally Posted by F3ERS 2 ASH3S View Post

no problem
thats one way to look at it.. however there are a couple other things that come into play,, and it had seemed to want a more in depth answer..

agreed, you all jumped on with great "indepth" answers. I was going for the "easy" explanation rolleyes.gif

Anyhoo, you are still playing the lottery with the chips no matter what. My first 8350 being worse than any 8320 I've seen here....
FX'd
(18 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Amd FX 8350 GA-990FXA-UD3 R5 EVGA GTX 660 SC EVGA GTX 660 SC 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16gb Samsung 30nm Corsair Performance Pro OCZ Vertex 4 Samsung 840 EVO 
Optical DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Lite-on DVD/CD Swiftech H220 Win 10 + Start 10 Samsung 245BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G510 Corsair HX1050 SilverStone RV02 MS SideWinder 
Mouse PadAudio
MIONIX Propus 380 Realtek ALC1150 
  hide details  
Reply
FX'd
(18 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Amd FX 8350 GA-990FXA-UD3 R5 EVGA GTX 660 SC EVGA GTX 660 SC 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
16gb Samsung 30nm Corsair Performance Pro OCZ Vertex 4 Samsung 840 EVO 
Optical DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Lite-on DVD/CD Swiftech H220 Win 10 + Start 10 Samsung 245BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G510 Corsair HX1050 SilverStone RV02 MS SideWinder 
Mouse PadAudio
MIONIX Propus 380 Realtek ALC1150 
  hide details  
Reply
post #9239 of 67229
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadGoat View Post

agreed, you all jumped on with great "indepth" answers. I was going for the "easy" explanation rolleyes.gif

Anyhoo, you are still playing the lottery with the chips no matter what. My first 8350 being worse than any 8320 I've seen here....

what batch number was your 8350?
Wet Billy
(15 items)
 
PHENOM Phoenix
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX 8350 @ 5.06GHz AsUS Sabertooth R2.0 xfx 280x DD Crucial Ballistex Tactical Tracer 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 830 SSD 128GB LG BD-ROM/DVD Rewriter XSPC Raystorm RS240 kit A LOT OF FANS 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
WIN 7 ultamate AOC 23" LED LCD Microsoft wireless laser 6000 Rosewill Capstone 750w 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Coolermaster HAF 912 Microsoft wireless laser 6000 none 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
phenom II x6 1100T MSI 990FXA-GD65 GTX 460 GTX 460 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer 8GB (2 x 4GB)... Samsung SSD 830  LG Blueray Coolermaster N520 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Win 7 Ultimate x64 AOC 1080p LED Microsoft OCZ 850w 
Case
Coolermaster HAF 912 
  hide details  
Reply
Wet Billy
(15 items)
 
PHENOM Phoenix
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX 8350 @ 5.06GHz AsUS Sabertooth R2.0 xfx 280x DD Crucial Ballistex Tactical Tracer 1866Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 830 SSD 128GB LG BD-ROM/DVD Rewriter XSPC Raystorm RS240 kit A LOT OF FANS 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
WIN 7 ultamate AOC 23" LED LCD Microsoft wireless laser 6000 Rosewill Capstone 750w 
CaseMouseMouse Pad
Coolermaster HAF 912 Microsoft wireless laser 6000 none 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
phenom II x6 1100T MSI 990FXA-GD65 GTX 460 GTX 460 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer 8GB (2 x 4GB)... Samsung SSD 830  LG Blueray Coolermaster N520 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Win 7 Ultimate x64 AOC 1080p LED Microsoft OCZ 850w 
Case
Coolermaster HAF 912 
  hide details  
Reply
post #9240 of 67229
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadGoat View Post

agreed, you all jumped on with great "indepth" answers. I was going for the "easy" explanation rolleyes.gif

Anyhoo, you are still playing the lottery with the chips no matter what. My first 8350 being worse than any 8320 I've seen here....

Ditto, FX-8350 here - 4.5ghz @ 1.46875v. Anything less in voltage will cough up F@h.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: AMD CPUs
Overclock.net › Forums › AMD › AMD CPUs › [OFFICIAL] FX-8320/FX-8350 Vishera Owners Club