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Need help on gaming rig

post #1 of 10
Thread Starter 
Right now I am seriously considering the xeon 1240

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117285&SortField=0&SummaryType=0&PageSize=10&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&IsFeedbackTab=true#scrollFullInfo

I need to know what everone thinks I have read some reviews that say that as a gamer the xeon isnt right but honestly look at the stats on that thing its like a 3770k.

it is = or > an 3570k at 4.2gh overclocked i mean come on why not? grab it

The only things I need to know are

A. I have read that you can get it up to 3.8 stable if you up the voltage, is this true and would it require liquid cooling?

B. Is it worth going with the xeon over the 3570k ? I mean i dont see the point in getting a 3570k and overclocking it to 4.2 when the base xeon hits those stats anyway.

People say desktop cpus are for desktops, servers are for servers when you get down to the raw stats of it all right now i can pick up the base xeon that matches the 4.2 overclocked 3570k in stats for $240 while a 3570k is at $229. The 3.4 gh xeon is comparable to a I7 3770k at base stats and even out preforms it in some areas for $255?

Honestly who needs intergated graphics if i wanted to I could get the xeon with graphics but I am throwing down 2x 7970s with lifetime warranties?

I just need to know that its going to work?

I am pretty sure that one of the nastiest gaming comps out there today is a dual xeon mobo'ed comp someone got each xeon chip from 2.3 gh (4000 dollar chip 8 cores per) to 3.8 stable on each chip.

If your comment is going to be stay with desktop cpus cause servers are for servers please save it unless you have more info then that

Thanks for all the help smile.gif
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post #2 of 10
I may be wrong on this, however it is my understanding that you cannot overclock Xeon's like their i3,i5,i7 counterparts.
A) If you increase the voltage too much you risk damaging your chip, whatever chip you have - so yes, make sure to cool adequately and not push volts past 1.4 - 1.5.
B) IMO, it's really not worth spending extra for the Xeon, i know you don't want me to say this, but at the end of the day it is a server designed chip. Buy a chip for it's intended use.
The only time you will achieve the greatness out of Xeons is when you put 2 of them together with, say an EVGA SR2 motherboard.
SO - go with the 3570k as it provides a greater gaming chip as it can be overclocked greater than the turbo on the xeon, and it is designed for this type of use. thumb.gif
post #3 of 10
Thread Starter 
But how can you argue those stats man, even if you overclock an i5 3570k to 4.2 ghz its still wont reach a score of 9819. My understanding of things is that both server cpu and desktop cpu's are exactly the same minus you can overclock the K series freely and server cpus are built to be put under brutal stressful situations and are built better and stronger then desktop counterparts. Btw the reason why intel doesnt allow you to overclock the xeon series is probably because if you could throw down 2 of them in an SR-2 classified and not only over volt but had an unlocked multiplier there wouldnt be a K series cause everyone would jump on the xeon bus I mean non overclocked it is better hands down then the i5 unless you are throwing hardcore liquid in your system to overclock your i5 to 5.0+ ghz.

So just based off the numbers the xeon is better then an i5 overclocked and an i7 base. I mean yeah its a crazy notion or must sound like one to put a server cpu in gaming rig but to be honest there is absolutely no difference between an SR-2 with 2 xeon chips in it and a regular mobo with an xeon chip in it, you know why? no game on the face of this earth has the capability to utilize dual gpu's so all those sick red dawns people built are really only running 1x xeon chip while gaming cause those server mobo's ultilze the second chip mainly if the first one fails or if the demand on the first one is so great it needs to. I could stream live on top of 2 open full screened game (more having to do with graphics card) on 3 monitors and that xeon chip would be at max 30%-40% usage and thats what really matters brah
(for red dawn specs see youtube)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9WZ2EDH-Kk

(benchmarks for a non-turbo'ed 3.4 gh xeon ivy)
http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Xeon+E3-1240+V2+%40+3.40GHz
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post #4 of 10
Thread Starter 
Check it bro the top preforming cpu out of all intel and amd cpu's is a xeon meaning that cpu out preforms all others meaning if you were to replace it for any other chip you would see a performance increase of 23.35% over the highest scoring non xeon chip (the i7- 3960x) (dont believe me all you have to do is subtract the highest xeon by the i7's score then divide that number by the xeons score which is 23.35%) honestly thats ridic also the fact that the top 10 chips are all xeon's? you think thats a mistake? xeons are better intel made them better the are built better they are built to preform above the flagship gaming chips and mainstream chips with 0 overclocking (which is why you cant overclock them cause then you would literally have no reason to buy anything else)


Check the complete list of cpu benchmarks check the xeons bro its all there
http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu_lookup.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i5-3570K+%40+3.40GHz
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post #5 of 10
Like i said, i'm probably not the best qualified to answer because i haven't dealt or know too much about xeons, so please, if someone knows better, chip in.
Anyway, Based off of numbers, Piledriver beats ivy and sandy bridge. Does it in reality? No chance. You can't compare the 2 chips based of their clock speed etc. You have to look into what they are designed to do. Xeons are designed to be run 24/7 at 100% load.
Some boards are not compatible with xeons, you would have completely redesign your build to suit the chip; it makes more sense to stick with the 3570k and hold onto that than it is to go with a xeon, which can't be overclocked.
Yes, Xeons are the best perfoming chips overall, but not generally for gaming. They are specific to servers. If you want to get a xeon, get a xeon, ensure your mobo can take it and enjoy it. At the end of the day, you probably won't notice a great deal of change between that or a 3770k.
post #6 of 10
The Xeon E3-1200 and E3-1200V2 series are, architecturally and performance wise, near-identical to the i7 sandy/ivy chips. They have hyper-threading just like their i7 brothers, but either lack, or have their iGPUs disabled (my guess is that they take "i7s" that came out of QC with GPU errors, or that couldn't meet TDP figures at consumer clock rates, and flash them to various E3 series chips. )

The 4.2GHZ clock rate is made possible by turbo-core overclocking, which, has 800MHZ worth of overhead on *most* turbo-core enabled chips (including the non-k i5 and i7 chips). Some boards give more flexibility than others for forcing the use of higher turbo-core frequencies all the time. ASRock recently released a BIOS update for many of their boards that allows user to force turbo-core operating frequencies in the 600-800MHZ range over base rates, ALL the time across ALL cores. I'm sure other boards support similar options. Most people with consumer overclock-able (via turbocore or unlocked multiplier) sandy/ivy chips report being able to hit 600-800MHZ over base clocks with little or no change to voltage from stock. I would expect similar results from an E3 personally.

The use of an E3-1200 chip, on a consumer motherboard, is obviously going to be hit and miss depending on whether the bios will recognize it correctly. Look carefully, some consumer class boards actually list support. It's a viable option in many cases.


ALL of the above, is purely academic for your purposes though, and here is why: Games, do not present enough parallel, mixed floating point and integer workloads for hyper-threading to have a meaningful effect. The i7/E3 chips, DO perform up to ~30% better than the i5 in all sorts of multi-threaded benchmarks and big productivity/creation apps, because those situations present the CPU with very parallel workloads that can heavily load both the integer and FPU side of each core. The i5, without hyper-threading, is forced to run EITHER a floating point calculation, OR and integer instruction, for each cycle on each core, not both at the same time. Hyper-threading allows each core to run both a FP and integer instruction at the same time on each core. The passmark score you are seeing, creates a sort of "ideal" workload that paints fairly unrealistic picture of performance for real world use for most people.

Some games, have parallel enough mixed workloads, that the hyper-threading in a dual core i3, can be advantageous. In the case of a quad core, I'm not aware of ANY game that can produce a CPU workload parallel enough to benefit in a noteworthy way from hyper-threading.

The reality is that, in GAMES specifically, an i5-3570K overclocked to 4.5GHZ, is going to be slightly better than an e3-1240V2/3770 clocked to 4.2/4.3GHZ.

That said, the difference would be pretty minuscule regardless, and if you want to do something, for the sake of doing something different, I encourage you to do the research, and figure out what board you could use to build your E3 based gaming rig. It will perform just fine, and would give you a little performance bump over an i5 if you ever decide to do some video editing or media creation.

Best Regards,
Eric

PS: http://www.asrock.com/mb/overview.us.asp?cat=CPU&Model=Z77%20Extreme4
Not a bad choice right there, listed support for the full range of E3 sandy/ivy chips, good price, SLI/CFX 8x8x capability. ASRock has non-K OC feature that should let you force a turbo frequency all the time across all cores. -ENJOY!
PSS: E3 V2 series chips ending in "5" are 77W TDP with the HD4000 iGPU intact. E3 series chips ending in "0" are 69W TDP with the iGPU disabled.
PSSSSSS: The E3-1225 and lower (both SB and Ivy).. things get tricky, read specs, this is basically the "i3 and i5" arena for these chips.
Edited by mdocod - 10/24/12 at 8:34am
     
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post #7 of 10
Thread Starter 
Thanks, I was looking at asrock but this board http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157330 (since it supports pcie 3.0 x16 + x8 instead of x8 x8 not sure if that matters much
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post #8 of 10
Not a big deal since PCIe 3.0 x8 = PCIe 2.0 x16 and single-GPUs don't even saturate it.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/07/18/pci_express_20_vs_30_gpu_gaming_performance_review
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post #9 of 10
Hi Faelore,

Funny, I actually had meant to link to the Extreme3 smile.gif Man, the price on that thing keeps dropping, what a killer steal of a MOBO eh!

The way the PCIE speeds are listed on newegg for those 2 boards is misleading to an amateur builder. It's likely a translation problem, both the extreme3 and extreme4 should have the exact same PCIE bandwidth for dual GPU solutions (x8x8). The Extreme3 and Extreme4 product pages were likely created by different people who interpreted the ASRock specifications differently.

In it's traditional configuration, an 1155 socket intel chip has 16 PCIE lanes (3.0 for Ivy, 2.0 for Sandy), a Z77 chipset has an additional 8 lanes of PCIE (2.0 regardless of cpu type.) The CPU controlled lanes are typically used for the slots intended for GPUs, while any auxiliary PCIE slots use the additional lanes supplied by the Z77 Express chipset. The 16X/8X 3.0 listing is misleading because it implies that there are up to 24 PCIE 3.0 lanes available, there are not. In fact, the translation mistake is obvious if you go read the manufacture product spec page.

Regards,
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post #10 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faelore View Post

Check it bro the top preforming cpu out of all intel and amd cpu's is a xeon meaning that cpu out preforms all others meaning if you were to replace it for any other chip you would see a performance increase of 23.35% over the highest scoring non xeon chip (the i7- 3960x) (dont believe me all you have to do is subtract the highest xeon by the i7's score then divide that number by the xeons score which is 23.35%) honestly thats ridic also the fact that the top 10 chips are all xeon's? you think thats a mistake? xeons are better intel made them better the are built better they are built to preform above the flagship gaming chips and mainstream chips with 0 overclocking (which is why you cant overclock them cause then you would literally have no reason to buy anything else)
Check the complete list of cpu benchmarks check the xeons bro its all there
http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu_lookup.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i5-3570K+%40+3.40GHz


Yeah and by that logic an AMD Opteron 6272 is better than the 3770K and the Xeon 1270 in gaming too....redface.gif

doesn't work that way bro. passmark is crap for judging real-world apps.
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