Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [VRZ] Nvidia's Green Light Program Overclocking Limitations - Origins and Implications
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[VRZ] Nvidia's Green Light Program Overclocking Limitations - Origins and Implications - Page 13

post #121 of 182
Quote:
Originally Posted by Domino View Post

No, what they do is that their engineers are told that they want to build the best they can with the least cost possible, so they skimped on VRM design. So they design the chips to handle a voltage set for. It's shoddy engineering work; making it just reach the minimal spec. It's actually quite against our ethics training. We aren't suppose to but typically, we always end up with what is requested. It's obvious that nvidia doesn't care, they will skimp on anything they can just to save a few cents.
At least AMD have better standards.

I'd say that's false unless you work for NVidia or have some documented proof their engineers were told this. No it's not obvious NVidia dosen't care. rolleyes.gif

What makes you think that AMD cards can handle voltage and it doesn't cause degradation? I see a lot of people who over volted RMA cards reading AMD threads. What makes you think it wasn't from over volting? It can't be proven either way. So claiming that NVidia makes less capable components is inaccurate because they want their cards to run in spec. AMD also has a ceiling with its specs your just allowed to exceed them bad or not. Wish we were too because its the principal more than the need with Kepler cards.

Last year the debacle was the 570 & 590's that had VRAM issues I will concur. Beyond that, none. Despite what AMD fans were saying last year. I had my 580 over clocked and over volted to bench no problem. Even though its not the case any longer people don't see it any other way moving forward. Like AMD drivers even though they are doing great once you have this misconception fan boys won't let go of it.

This year NVidia locked voltage in a highly controversial bold move. This year you didn't hear one story I fried my card from irresponsible over volting which isn't the card but end user fault. NVidia just announced a huge surge in profits 3rd quarter and give success in part credit to Kepler. With less RMA's 4th quarter will be even more promising.

You know AMD will take notice of free money NVidia got to keep from not RMA'ing as many cards. AMD could follow Nvidia's lead next series's and they won't be the bad guy since NVidia did it first. If AMD does this it doesn't mean it's because AMD makes shoddy parts as your suggesting Nvidia makes because they also might want to curtail lost profits running cards in spec.

You stated an observation, not fact. Your welcome to your opinion. smile.gif
post #122 of 182
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizonian View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
I'd say that's false unless you work for NVidia or have some documented proof their engineers were told this. No it's not obvious NVidia dosen't care. rolleyes.gif
What makes you think that AMD cards can handle voltage and it doesn't cause degradation? I see a lot of people who over volted RMA cards reading AMD threads. What makes you think it wasn't from over volting? It can't be proven either way. So claiming that NVidia makes less capable components is inaccurate because they want their cards to run in spec. AMD also has a ceiling with its specs your just allowed to exceed them bad or not. Wish we were too because its the principal more than the need with Kepler cards.
Last year the debacle was the 570 & 590's that had VRAM issues I will concur. Beyond that, none. Despite what AMD fans were saying last year. I had my 580 over clocked and over volted to bench no problem. Even though its not the case any longer people don't see it any other way moving forward. Like AMD drivers even though they are doing great once you have this misconception fan boys won't let go of it.
This year NVidia locked voltage in a highly controversial bold move. This year you didn't hear one story I fried my card from irresponsible over volting which isn't the card but end user fault. NVidia just announced a huge surge in profits 3rd quarter and give success in part credit to Kepler. With less RMA's 4th quarter will be even more promising.
You know AMD will take notice of free money NVidia got to keep from not RMA'ing as many cards. AMD could follow Nvidia's lead next series's and they won't be the bad guy since NVidia did it first. If AMD does this it doesn't mean it's because AMD makes shoddy parts as your suggesting Nvidia makes because they also might want to curtail lost profits running cards in spec.
You stated an observation, not fact. Your welcome to your opinion. smile.gif
applaud.gif very good points.
Annihilate!
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 2600K@ 5ghz 1.488v HT ON MAXIMUS V GENE NVIDIA GeForce GTX 670 FTW 8gb G skill Sniper @2133 10-11-10-28 1T 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Seagate Barracuda 1TB OCZ Agility 3 Intel 120gb 520 H100 push pull 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 8 Pro BenQ XL2420T with LightBoost hack (670) Asus VH238 (iGPU) Corsair K90 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
OCZ ZX 850w HAF 932 Advanced Black Edition R.A.T. 7 Logitech g930 
  hide details  
Reply
Annihilate!
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 2600K@ 5ghz 1.488v HT ON MAXIMUS V GENE NVIDIA GeForce GTX 670 FTW 8gb G skill Sniper @2133 10-11-10-28 1T 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Seagate Barracuda 1TB OCZ Agility 3 Intel 120gb 520 H100 push pull 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 8 Pro BenQ XL2420T with LightBoost hack (670) Asus VH238 (iGPU) Corsair K90 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
OCZ ZX 850w HAF 932 Advanced Black Edition R.A.T. 7 Logitech g930 
  hide details  
Reply
post #123 of 182
So now if venders want to release cards with features which allow the cards to run out of spec then they are responsible for replacing cards that rma. Is NVidia refusing to sell cards to venders who break the rules or making them responsible for their actions, idk. If that's the case it seems logical for NVidia to do.
Big Red
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 2700k Asus Maximus IV Extreme  Asus Titan/580 physx Corsair 16g quad 1866 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
OCZ Vortex3 120gb ssd/Intel 2x80g ssd/Intel 40g... external usb H110 140mm&120mm p/p-Scythe 6 fan controller Win7 Home Prem 64bit 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Asus 23" 3d ready Logitech G15 Rev.2 Seasonic 1000W Platinum AMD Limited Edition HAF 932 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Rat MMO 7 Razer Vespula Psyko Audio 5.1 headset/Logitech 5.1 pc surround 
  hide details  
Reply
Big Red
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 2700k Asus Maximus IV Extreme  Asus Titan/580 physx Corsair 16g quad 1866 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
OCZ Vortex3 120gb ssd/Intel 2x80g ssd/Intel 40g... external usb H110 140mm&120mm p/p-Scythe 6 fan controller Win7 Home Prem 64bit 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Asus 23" 3d ready Logitech G15 Rev.2 Seasonic 1000W Platinum AMD Limited Edition HAF 932 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Rat MMO 7 Razer Vespula Psyko Audio 5.1 headset/Logitech 5.1 pc surround 
  hide details  
Reply
post #124 of 182
Quote:
Originally Posted by cravinmild View Post

So now if venders want to release cards with features which allow the cards to run out of spec then they are responsible for replacing cards that rma. Is NVidia refusing to sell cards to venders who break the rules or making them responsible for their actions, idk. If that's the case it seems logical for NVidia to do.

No Nvidia clearly is allowing vendors to use over voltage and will continue to sell their cards to their vendors. The moment Nvidia said they wouldn't cover RMA's if vendors supported unlocked cards the vendors decided they didn't want to support the RMA's either.

Any vendor can take the reference card and do what ever they want in their non-reference versions and allow for unlocked cards but at their own liability which they don't want to assume.
post #125 of 182
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

Intel has done worse things in the past....

And? What does Intel having done worse things, which I believe is true, have to do with him not liking Nvidia's business practices?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celeras View Post

This is what happens when AMD is so pathetically non-competitive, imo. And I personally have a hard time caring when their product as-is is so vastly superior.

You are crazy man, they are super close in and my opinion the AMD gpus are the more attractive options at the moment.
Edited by Mygaffer - 11/10/12 at 11:20am
SBD:
(18 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-3770k Gigabyte ga-z77x-up4 tb Unlocked Powercolor R9 290 32GB G.SKILL Trident X F3-1600C7Q-32GTX  
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD Western Digtal 2TB RE4 Plextor 24x DL Burner ThermalTake Water 2.0 Extreme 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 7 Pro 64-bit Catleap Q270 27" 2560x1440 IPS EIZO FG2421 1920x1080 VA 120Hz QuickFire Cherry Blue 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Lepa G1000 1kw Corsair 550D Logitech G400 Roccat Taito 
AudioAudio
Xonar Essence ST Niles SI-275 Amplifier 
  hide details  
Reply
SBD:
(18 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-3770k Gigabyte ga-z77x-up4 tb Unlocked Powercolor R9 290 32GB G.SKILL Trident X F3-1600C7Q-32GTX  
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD Western Digtal 2TB RE4 Plextor 24x DL Burner ThermalTake Water 2.0 Extreme 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 7 Pro 64-bit Catleap Q270 27" 2560x1440 IPS EIZO FG2421 1920x1080 VA 120Hz QuickFire Cherry Blue 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Lepa G1000 1kw Corsair 550D Logitech G400 Roccat Taito 
AudioAudio
Xonar Essence ST Niles SI-275 Amplifier 
  hide details  
Reply
post #126 of 182
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizonian View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cravinmild View Post

So now if venders want to release cards with features which allow the cards to run out of spec then they are responsible for replacing cards that rma. Is NVidia refusing to sell cards to venders who break the rules or making them responsible for their actions, idk. If that's the case it seems logical for NVidia to do.

No Nvidia clearly is allowing vendors to use over voltage and will continue to sell their cards to their vendors. The moment Nvidia said they wouldn't cover RMA's if vendors supported unlocked cards the vendors decided they didn't want to support the RMA's either.

Any vendor can take the reference card and do what ever they want in their non-reference versions and allow for unlocked cards but at their own liability which they don't want to assume.
This,this,this,this.
post #127 of 182
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizonian View Post

Yes I did. In fact Nvidia does 3-D vision much better. I left AMD for a 3D Vision gaming system when the 580 came out. I'm actually very pleased with Nvidia. Without voltage I got a 255 MHz overclock on my 690 Core with no voltage increase and if I want real 3-D vision I'm forced to stick with Nvidia.
So don't assume no one is buying NVidia for 3-D vision. It's a small percent albeit, but we are out here. See 3-D vision club link in signature. smile.gif

I have to agree with you here, Nvidia's 3d solution is much better than AMD's. Personally I hate the 3d we have now, both passive and active, so it does not influence my purchasing decisions but if I was into it then Nvidia would be the way to.

I don't know if 3d is ever going to be a big enough thing for AMD to really care about it, I think they only did what they have done so they can match features with Nvidia. More marketing than feature people care about.
SBD:
(18 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-3770k Gigabyte ga-z77x-up4 tb Unlocked Powercolor R9 290 32GB G.SKILL Trident X F3-1600C7Q-32GTX  
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD Western Digtal 2TB RE4 Plextor 24x DL Burner ThermalTake Water 2.0 Extreme 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 7 Pro 64-bit Catleap Q270 27" 2560x1440 IPS EIZO FG2421 1920x1080 VA 120Hz QuickFire Cherry Blue 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Lepa G1000 1kw Corsair 550D Logitech G400 Roccat Taito 
AudioAudio
Xonar Essence ST Niles SI-275 Amplifier 
  hide details  
Reply
SBD:
(18 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-3770k Gigabyte ga-z77x-up4 tb Unlocked Powercolor R9 290 32GB G.SKILL Trident X F3-1600C7Q-32GTX  
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD Western Digtal 2TB RE4 Plextor 24x DL Burner ThermalTake Water 2.0 Extreme 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 7 Pro 64-bit Catleap Q270 27" 2560x1440 IPS EIZO FG2421 1920x1080 VA 120Hz QuickFire Cherry Blue 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Lepa G1000 1kw Corsair 550D Logitech G400 Roccat Taito 
AudioAudio
Xonar Essence ST Niles SI-275 Amplifier 
  hide details  
Reply
post #128 of 182
So Nvidia will allow their vendors to sell unlocked cards but only if they offer RMA support for them?
post #129 of 182
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizonian View Post

I'd say that's false unless you work for NVidia or have some documented proof their engineers were told this. No it's not obvious NVidia dosen't care. rolleyes.gif
What makes you think that AMD cards can handle voltage and it doesn't cause degradation? I see a lot of people who over volted RMA cards reading AMD threads. What makes you think it wasn't from over volting? It can't be proven either way. So claiming that NVidia makes less capable components is inaccurate because they want their cards to run in spec. AMD also has a ceiling with its specs your just allowed to exceed them bad or not. Wish we were too because its the principal more than the need with Kepler cards.
Last year the debacle was the 570 & 590's that had VRAM issues I will concur. Beyond that, none. Despite what AMD fans were saying last year. I had my 580 over clocked and over volted to bench no problem. Even though its not the case any longer people don't see it any other way moving forward. Like AMD drivers even though they are doing great once you have this misconception fan boys won't let go of it.
This year NVidia locked voltage in a highly controversial bold move. This year you didn't hear one story I fried my card from irresponsible over volting which isn't the card but end user fault. NVidia just announced a huge surge in profits 3rd quarter and give success in part credit to Kepler. With less RMA's 4th quarter will be even more promising.
You know AMD will take notice of free money NVidia got to keep from not RMA'ing as many cards. AMD could follow Nvidia's lead next series's and they won't be the bad guy since NVidia did it first. If AMD does this it doesn't mean it's because AMD makes shoddy parts as your suggesting Nvidia makes because they also might want to curtail lost profits running cards in spec.
You stated an observation, not fact. Your welcome to your opinion. smile.gif

No one knows what Nvidia told it's engineers but it's pretty clear from all the commentary on these cards that Nvidia's reference designs are cheaper then AMD's at this point.

Honestly Arizonian I'm surprised to see you defending this. I know you like Nvidia cards (I do to) but this really is just a giant F U to the overclocking community regardless of whether it makes business sense or if you can still get a decent overclock out of current cards.
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k @ 4.5ghz / EK Supremacy Nickel/Acetal Asrock Z87m Extreme 4 - Asus Z97 pro Sapphire 290 CF / Aquacomputer Kyrographics Nickel G Skill 16gb 2133 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Crucial M4  WD Data Drive Aquacomputer Aqualis 450 ML D5 / 360 XT45 / 240... 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine 3 TKL  AX 850 750D Deathadder 2013 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k @ 4.5ghz / EK Supremacy Nickel/Acetal Asrock Z87m Extreme 4 - Asus Z97 pro Sapphire 290 CF / Aquacomputer Kyrographics Nickel G Skill 16gb 2133 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Crucial M4  WD Data Drive Aquacomputer Aqualis 450 ML D5 / 360 XT45 / 240... 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine 3 TKL  AX 850 750D Deathadder 2013 
  hide details  
Reply
post #130 of 182
I feel bad now that I got a GTX670, and it is only a 2GB version. For what I payed back then, I can get a 4GB model.

But the card came with Diablo 3 and runs cool.
Navy Beast
(14 items)
 
Brother's PC
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[INTEL] Core i7 3770K @ 4.5 GHz w/ 1.225V [ASUS] P8Z77-V [GIGABYTE] GTX 670 Windforce Edition [CORSAIR] Vengeance 8GB 1866MHz CL9 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
[Intel] 520 120GB [WD] Green 1TB SATA II [SAMSUNG] SH-222BB [NOCTUA] NH-U12P-SE2 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
[MICROSOFT] Windows 7 Ultimate 64 Bit [ASUS] VH242 24" 1920 x 1080 [BENQ] A800  [CORSAIR] AX750 
CaseMouse
[NZXT] Switch 810 Microsoft Windows Optical Mouse 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[AMD] Athlon II x2 240 @ 3.0GHz [MSi] 785GM-E51 [MSi] AMD Integrated HD 4200 Kingston 2 x 2GB DDR3 Dual Channel @ 1064MHz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
Western Digital Caviar Green 1TB SATA 2 BENQ DVD DD DW1640 ATA Device IDE Windows Ultimate 64 Bit ASUS VH242 24" 1920 x 1080 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Microsoft USB Digital Media Keyboard (IntelliType) Eurocase 400 watt Eurocase Middle Tower 5425 (no case fans) Microsoft USB Wheel Mouse Optical (IntelliPoint) 
Mouse Pad
N/A 
  hide details  
Reply
Navy Beast
(14 items)
 
Brother's PC
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[INTEL] Core i7 3770K @ 4.5 GHz w/ 1.225V [ASUS] P8Z77-V [GIGABYTE] GTX 670 Windforce Edition [CORSAIR] Vengeance 8GB 1866MHz CL9 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
[Intel] 520 120GB [WD] Green 1TB SATA II [SAMSUNG] SH-222BB [NOCTUA] NH-U12P-SE2 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
[MICROSOFT] Windows 7 Ultimate 64 Bit [ASUS] VH242 24" 1920 x 1080 [BENQ] A800  [CORSAIR] AX750 
CaseMouse
[NZXT] Switch 810 Microsoft Windows Optical Mouse 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[AMD] Athlon II x2 240 @ 3.0GHz [MSi] 785GM-E51 [MSi] AMD Integrated HD 4200 Kingston 2 x 2GB DDR3 Dual Channel @ 1064MHz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
Western Digital Caviar Green 1TB SATA 2 BENQ DVD DD DW1640 ATA Device IDE Windows Ultimate 64 Bit ASUS VH242 24" 1920 x 1080 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Microsoft USB Digital Media Keyboard (IntelliType) Eurocase 400 watt Eurocase Middle Tower 5425 (no case fans) Microsoft USB Wheel Mouse Optical (IntelliPoint) 
Mouse Pad
N/A 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Hardware News
Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [VRZ] Nvidia's Green Light Program Overclocking Limitations - Origins and Implications