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Macbook Pro 13 Retina (now reviewed) - Is the res/scaling a marketing ploy?

post #1 of 17
Thread Starter 
I'm gonna dangle my nuts out there on this one, from what I've seen this isn't the safest site [natch] for Mac discussion rolleyes.gif, but understandable since this is community is more towards hand build machines. That said I really respect the cache of experience the people on this site have so I'm gonna throw this question out for socialization...

I won't go into a lot of back story but the short of it is I had the opportunity/timing to grab a 13" Pro retina. I had a limit to spend and it was in it so I jumped on it (I'll admit I had a little bit of shiny-rock syndrome and was concerned it would turn out great and go out of stock)

So here it is...

1. I'm ticked off when I realized that there is no onboard NIC. I misread something and jumped on the 13Pro over the Air because I thought it was built in and didn't want to bother with dongles. Some investigation into the Thunder-to-NIC dongle shows that there is a pretty heavy hit to the CPU is you use it, and that kinda was a big negative for me.

2. There's a ton of overzealous hate towards that thing pushing 2560x1600 on a HD4000. This is not a gaming laptop for me. Ever. I plan to build a new machine for that soon. From what I understand (This is where I am looking for you all to keep me honest) is that Apple scales to the DPI density. In the case of the 13R, the limit out of box is a 1680x1050 scaling OF the 2560x1600.. W T F?!

I may be way off (looking for other Retina owners experience) but if I read it correctly The laptop does not in fact have a 2560x1660 display. It has a pixel DENSITY of a 2560x1660 display, and uses software in the middle to scale to a native 1680x1050 by using a 4into1 pixel display ratio. If 'm buying a $1800 laptop (Chi-town tax be damned) that's just a pretty 1680x1050 laptop, that's really gonna pee in my Wheaties.

I'll have the laptop at my door early next week and I've already asked for a RMA sticker to ship it back. So here it is. I'm on the gamble that the tech review sites get this thing in hands and reviewed before it shows up at my door, hoping that I'm wrong and 1, the HD4000 is fine for what 90% of my use if for and 2, its really not marketing trickery using fake numbers to up-sell what is really a 1680x1050 usable desktop area.

I have looked at a lot of other laptops out there, and for those that fit into the categories I checking off they are all copy-cat of trying to match the MB Air, and all also run on HD4000 but with ****e 1368x768 etc displays (gag). the discrete GPU laptops are too far into desktop-replacement bulk/size/ergos for me to go that route again.


Help/thoughts/advice?
post #2 of 17
I'm not understanding the problem.

The retina display is a 2560x1600 display in a 13" package.

Do you have any idea how small icons would be if icons were at that scale? Scaling for icons and menus occurs to compensate for this.
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post #3 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by That Guy View Post

I'm not understanding the problem.
The retina display is a 2560x1600 display in a 13" package.
Do you have any idea how small icons would be if icons were at that scale? Scaling for icons and menus occurs to compensate for this.

I guess the question is, WHAT is scaled? just menus icons text? If I load up a RAW image from my camera, does that utilize a native 2560x1600 resultion, or is everything scaled to look like it's at 1680x1050 and your just getting a better (insert adjective) visual representation than you would on a display that is natively 1680x1050?
post #4 of 17
1600x900 resolution, 14 inches, Dedicated GPU

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834131365

Have fun! biggrin.gif
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post #5 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinman12 View Post

I guess the question is, WHAT is scaled? just menus icons text? If I load up a RAW image from my camera, does that utilize a native 2560x1600 resultion, or is everything scaled to look like it's at 1680x1050 and your just getting a better (insert adjective) visual representation than you would on a display that is natively 1680x1050?

If you load up a native 2560x1600 image, it will utilize the native 2560x1600 resolution.

About the scaling. For the 15" retina there are mods out to natively display 2880x1800 without any of the icons and texts being scaled up but unless you have a really good eye sight, I don't recommend it.
 
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post #6 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clairvoyant129 View Post

If you load up a native 2560x1600 image, it will utilize the native 2560x1600 resolution.
About the scaling. For the 15" retina there are mods out to natively display 2880x1800 without any of the icons and texts being scaled up but unless you have a really good eye sight, I don't recommend it.

Thanks. I guess I'll unbox it when it gets here and try it out. Doesn't look like the review sites will have posts up with an in depth before the delivery guy gets here. I think I have 30days to return it if it isn't something I wan to keep.
post #7 of 17
Honestly I think it is solely a marketing. I went to a display of Apple at BestBuy (I know BestBuy, but it was a shorter drive) Anyway, I looked at the MBA 11,13 MBP13, and MBPr15. At the time I only had rumors about a MBPr 13 so I had to make a decision based on what I saw. I was very tempted to get the MBPr15, but it was TOO BIG for what I needed a laptop for "Mobility" and some "Xcode." Furthermore, the idea of a laptop being a gaming platform just completely undermines the point of real PC gaming. Anyway, the size of the MBP13 was still small enough, but the screen was just disgustingly small. When placed next to the Air13 the difference was magnified 10x. My chief complaint against the Pro13 was the screen resolution, but only because other issues could be solved by upgrades later.

However, the R13 solved this one issue but raises others. Long story short I went with the base Air13 with I5-1.8/4GB/128GB

Although, the CPU on the r13 is faster, I don't believe it will give a real world advantage against the Air. Now if it had a quad, I would be all over it.

I think we will see a new version soon enough to accommodate a CPU refresh sometime in mid 13. Maybe then Quads will take hold, and change the game. Or maybe a 14 air in a 13 body. Who knows?

Try it on a form follows function basis and if your needs are meet, keep it until the next batch comes around. Your resale value will still be high enough to offset the cost.
post #8 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinman12 View Post

I'm gonna dangle my nuts out there on this one, from what I've seen this isn't the safest site [natch] for Mac discussion rolleyes.gif, but understandable since this is community is more towards hand build machines. That said I really respect the cache of experience the people on this site have so I'm gonna throw this question out for socialization...

I won't go into a lot of back story but the short of it is I had the opportunity/timing to grab a 13" Pro retina. I had a limit to spend and it was in it so I jumped on it (I'll admit I had a little bit of shiny-rock syndrome and was concerned it would turn out great and go out of stock)

So here it is...

1. I'm ticked off when I realized that there is no onboard NIC. I misread something and jumped on the 13Pro over the Air because I thought it was built in and didn't want to bother with dongles. Some investigation into the Thunder-to-NIC dongle shows that there is a pretty heavy hit to the CPU is you use it, and that kinda was a big negative for me.

2. There's a ton of overzealous hate towards that thing pushing 2560x1600 on a HD4000. This is not a gaming laptop for me. Ever. I plan to build a new machine for that soon. From what I understand (This is where I am looking for you all to keep me honest) is that Apple scales to the DPI density. In the case of the 13R, the limit out of box is a 1680x1050 scaling OF the 2560x1600.. W T F?!

I may be way off (looking for other Retina owners experience) but if I read it correctly The laptop does not in fact have a 2560x1660 display. It has a pixel DENSITY of a 2560x1660 display, and uses software in the middle to scale to a native 1680x1050 by using a 4into1 pixel display ratio. If 'm buying a $1800 laptop (Chi-town tax be damned) that's just a pretty 1680x1050 laptop, that's really gonna pee in my Wheaties.

I'll have the laptop at my door early next week and I've already asked for a RMA sticker to ship it back. So here it is. I'm on the gamble that the tech review sites get this thing in hands and reviewed before it shows up at my door, hoping that I'm wrong and 1, the HD4000 is fine for what 90% of my use if for and 2, its really not marketing trickery using fake numbers to up-sell what is really a 1680x1050 usable desktop area.

I have looked at a lot of other laptops out there, and for those that fit into the categories I checking off they are all copy-cat of trying to match the MB Air, and all also run on HD4000 but with ****e 1368x768 etc displays (gag). the discrete GPU laptops are too far into desktop-replacement bulk/size/ergos for me to go that route again.


Help/thoughts/advice?
No it is a 2560x1600 pixel display but the actual workspace is only 1280x800 because of the scaling. That way everything is still large enough to view comfortably, but it's so much sharper. You can increase the workspace up to 1680x1050 (which is actually rendered at 3360x2100 and downscaled to fit on the 2560x1600 panel). There is some kind of hack to get it to run at native resolution with no scaling but everything is tiny so it may or may not be too small for you.
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post #9 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelbom View Post

No it is a 2560x1600 pixel display but the actual workspace is only 1280x800 because of the scaling. That way everything is still large enough to view comfortably, but it's so much sharper. You can increase the workspace up to 1680x1050 (which is actually rendered at 3360x2100 and downscaled to fit on the 2560x1600 panel). There is some kind of hack to get it to run at native resolution with no scaling but everything is tiny so it may or may not be too small for you.

That's in line with what I was thinking. UPS should be dropping it off in a couple hours at my house so I'll do the unpacking tonight and see how it looks. It got decent reviews (if you ignore the price rolleyes.gif) for the few sites that have it in hand so I'm thinking it will probably still blow me away going from a ~4yr old dell e6500 to that but we'll see. I'll post up a couple shots and do a short write up once I get it setup.
post #10 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinman12 View Post

That's in line with what I was thinking. UPS should be dropping it off in a couple hours at my house so I'll do the unpacking tonight and see how it looks. It got decent reviews (if you ignore the price rolleyes.gif) for the few sites that have it in hand so I'm thinking it will probably still blow me away going from a ~4yr old dell e6500 to that but we'll see. I'll post up a couple shots and do a short write up once I get it setup.
My 2011 i5 13" blows my 6 year old HP TX2000 away biggrin.gif
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