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Tator Tot's Big "Quiet" 120mm & 140mm Fan Round-Up - Page 137

post #1361 of 2743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alastair View Post

Tator Tot have you tested any of the coolermaster fans for us. I know BladeMaster is a tried, tested and loved design but what about Xtra Flo's and Excalibur's?

I love Blade Master's, an excellent budget fan for radiators. No bollux about them either, honest & true specs.
XtraFlo's look like a similar design to Blade Master's, not as robust in the pressure department but they don't look awful either. They'll definitely have some heavy resonance as that frame is made from a hard plastic which will translate the vibrations of the motor more readily into whatever it's mounted to.
Unlike the softer frames of the Blade Masters, as far as a translation of noise goes, it should be a mild increase but not a huge regard.

Excalibur & Turbine Master fans are an awful mess though.

Excalibur's Barometric Ball Bearing is at least an interesting design. It utilizes pressure in the chamber with a lubricated surface to enable the fan to rotate at higher speeds without a ramp up in noise.
The blade & housing design is what makes the product awful, as the housing generates an excess of hiss from the fan while killing all pressure, and the blade design isn't well optimized for airflow or pressure and creates many different tonal ranges, making it's airflow noise extreme to the ears.

The Turbine Master is a repeat of the Excalibur's but with a more sensible frame design. Still, the square frame is the best frame when it comes to fans, and the raised posts make the whole thing a mess to use. Like wise, at least fans that normally use a round frame have some form of anti-vibration mechanism built in but the Turbine Master series does not.

Sickle Flow fans are my biggest pet-peeves from Cooler Master as they were listed with inaccurate specs multiple times. Even on Cooler Master's website.
Like wise, they charged a premium for a fan with a low end sleeve bearing.

So I'd say with Cooler Master's offerings, it has been mix & match.

Blade Master's & XtraFlo's have been their best offerings.
SickleFlo's were middle of the road, and had issues due to the companies incompitance.
Their bog-standard fans were just that.

Their "unique" offerings have all been bad so far though.
If only they would now enlarge their Blade Master's and Xtra Flo's to 140mm size. It isn't as easy as that though is it? Just add 20mm on? I am sure they would have done it by now if it was really?
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post #1362 of 2743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post

In a Push config; no. You'd get a negative turn around instead, as the Akasa's are just slightly louder.

In a Pull config, it would be night & day.

So for someone who really wants a push-pull config in a high density fin radiator, with good temps and low noise, what would you suggest? A Noctua Nf-F12 pushing and what other model doing the pulling?
Edited by Paps.pt - 3/31/13 at 4:11pm
post #1363 of 2743
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alastair View Post


If only they would now enlarge their Blade Master's and Xtra Flo's to 140mm size. It isn't as easy as that though is it? Just add 20mm on? I am sure they would have done it by now if it was really?

 

For the most part, that's dead on. Some designs lend themselves well to over-sizing or under-sizing; but not many. That's why you generally do not see a design repeated from 80mm up to 92mm, or 120mm up to 140mm.

 

As for why they don't create a performance 140mm fan; they're focused on selling the Megaflow/230mm fans. If you haven't noticed, they'll load up just about any case with those. As size sells.

 

People assume (at least in the general market) that bigger fans are quieter, and super big fans will be super awesome.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paps.pt View Post


So for someone who really wants a push-pull config in a high density fin radiator, with good temps and low noise, what would you suggest? A Noctua Nf-F12 pushing and what other model doing the pulling?

 

I would never suggest mixing push & pull. Like wise, it really would depend on the radiator / config. Most of the time, Push-Pull configs add twice as much noise, without a significant drop in temperatures.

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post #1364 of 2743
Are you sure that a push setup is all thats necessary? Thats not what Tim Logan says. In a review of the Noctua NF-F12 in a H100 he saw a 5 degrees decrease when adding 2 more fans for a push-pull config.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qAvH3yJ_A8
post #1365 of 2743
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paps.pt View Post

Are you sure that a push setup is all thats necessary? Thats not what Tim Logan says. In a review of the Noctua NF-F12 in a H100 he saw a 5 degrees decrease when adding 2 more fans for a push-pull config.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qAvH3yJ_A8

 

I have a hard time believing his numbers to be accurate in that regard.

 

I can specifically state that my H100 doesn't show a noticeable drop in temps (more than 2*C) when using Push-Pull on it with Cooler Master Blade Master fans (4 of them) even maxed out.

 

Like wise, you can check out some excellent testing of radiators and the fan configs, as well as how it effects temps.

http://martinsliquidlab.org/2012/06/08/hesmelaughs-radiator-sandwich-testing/

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post #1366 of 2743
I noticed a decrease of 5c by going from single 5300rpm 120x38mm fan to dual 220cfm beasts in my Silver Arrow...and that heatsink is one of the most dense there is out there. (first SA)
I say it's not worth it.
Now I'm running passive with only ty-140 fans as case fans, and that's what I consider silent (4 of them, full blast) biggrin.gif
post #1367 of 2743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post

I have a hard time believing his numbers to be accurate in that regard.

I can specifically state that my H100 doesn't show a noticeable drop in temps (more than 2*C) when using Push-Pull on it with Cooler Master Blade Master fans (4 of them) even maxed out.

Like wise, you can check out some excellent testing of radiators and the fan configs, as well as how it effects temps.
http://martinsliquidlab.org/2012/06/08/hesmelaughs-radiator-sandwich-testing/

I will be cooling a 2500k at 4.3Ghz and a Inno3d gtx570 Hawk with a Asetek 760GC CLC kit, which as a 120mm high dens fin Radiator so maybe both fans will make a difference, dont you think?
You never recommend it because the noctuas in push-pull make extra noise or because there isnt much of a difference to make it worth the cost of an extra fan?
post #1368 of 2743
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paps.pt View Post


I will be cooling a 2500k at 4.3Ghz and a Inno3d gtx570 Hawk with a Asetek 760GC CLC kit, which as a 120mm high dens fin Radiator so maybe both fans will make a difference, dont you think?
You never recommend it because the noctuas in push-pull make extra noise or because there isnt much of a difference to make it worth the cost of an extra fan?

 

In the case of the Noctua's, it'll be even noisier than normal due to their unique design. 

 

I also do not recommend it, in general, because of the additional cost. The Asetek cooling system doesn't have enough flow from the pump, or area on the radiator to make a difference with 1 fan vs 2 fans. 

 

Water Cooling isn't magic, and the two most important aspects (heat dissipation area & flow) often get overlooked when people choose a system. 

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post #1369 of 2743
I've been told that pull is better than push for temperature. Personally, I'm using 4 GT AP-14s in push/pull intake at 800rpm where I just about cant hear them over ambient noise. Good temperature at practically nonexistent noise level. I can definitely hear them at 1000 rpm in that setup.
   
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post #1370 of 2743
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElevenEleven View Post

I've been told that pull is better than push for temperature. Personally, I'm using 4 GT AP-14s in push/pull intake at 800rpm where I just about cant hear them over ambient noise. Good temperature at practically nonexistent noise level. I can definitely hear them at 1000 rpm in that setup.

 

You're talking at points of virtually inaudible noise levels.

 

Every 3dB(A) increase in sound pressure is twice the amount of sound level present.

So 15dB(A) vs 18dB(A) should scientifically be twice as loud. Perceptually though, it's much lower than the sound level of the normal world (which depending on where you live can come from 25dB(A) up to 40dB(A) or Quiet Country Side to Busy & Loud City apartment.)

 

So while it is a doubling of the perceptual sound pressure, it doesn't correlate to such an outcome when the existing noise floor is already 2-3 times louder if not more.

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Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB Western Digital Green 2TB Samsung Spinpoint M4 500GB 
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Intel X-25M G2 80GB Lite-On BluRay Drive Arctic Cooling Freezer 13 Pro Windows 7 Ultimate 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Dell U2212HM Deck Legend Frost Tactile Silverstone Strider Plus 750w Custom Acrylic Test Bed 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
Logitech G500 Cooler Master Storm Tactics FPS Beyer Dynamics DT-990 600ohm Samson MediaOne 3A 
AudioAudioOtherOther
FiiO E09k QOGIR FiiO E17 ALPEN Microsoft Lifecam Studio Blue Yeti Pro Microphone 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD A10-A5800K ASRock FM2A85X-ITX Radeon HD7770 1GB 2x8GB 1866mhz C9 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
SanDisk Ultra Plus 128GB 2TB 5400 RPM  24x DVD Drive Noctua L9A 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Home Premium 32" IPS TV Logitech K400 Seasonic G360 
CaseMouseAudio
Cooler Master Elite 120 Advanced Logitech K400 Trackpad Custom 2.1 Home Theater Setup 
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