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[IGN] Report: PS4 Dev Kits Surface - Page 5  

post #41 of 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arni90 View Post

So, basically, the PS4 won't be that much more powerful than a Wii U.

Wii U s about as powerful as an Xbox 360 and PS3 with a bit better specs. So... no.
post #42 of 468
They get a lot of hate for the PS3 the fact is the games still look stunning today, albeit at 720p usually with 30fps, but they haven't half sucked the bottom of the barrell dry in terms of processing power/ visual quality.

Hats off to them and I for one will be getting a PS4/ Xbox 720(whatever they call it)
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post #43 of 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bosniac View Post

Wii U s about as powerful as an Xbox 360 and PS3 with a bit better specs. So... no.

Let's hope that's not the case, also that PS3 emulation people are asking for on this speculated system, I dont see this happening with a 4 core processor from AMD even though It's better than the PS3's CPU at the moment (Not sure how much)
And real processing cores shall hopefully be a lot more beneficial than SPUs which are magnificent at running I believe small "operations" or instructions.

And an APU? Yes It's better than the PS3's current GPU but if Sony wish to push this system another 6 or 7 more years then they need to put something tougher in there to keep It going, a 6770 type GPU should be standard If they're going with AMD and judging by history with the PS3 I think they would go for a higher end GPU as the 7800 was at the time I believe, so If they were to release It this year (I know they wont) they would go for possibly a 6800-900 as the Nvidia 7800 GTX was about a year old, another thing is that people are going to want 1920x1080p running natively on the system so they'll need a 5-7 series AMD GPU if they plan to do so easily.

I also dont think they will take the AMD CPU Route, It's a logical choice I guess If they're focusing on keeping the price down on the system, there's been many PS3 SKUs and I think this is to do with the pricing of the hardware rather than getting the product smaller although that could be the case also. It shipped with a hefty 600+ which everyone was complaining about and this must of been to do with the CPU and blu-ray drive at the time, I dont know if the RSX would make much a difference and with each SKU they took something away, they took away the capacitive buttons on the slim and also the PS2 emulation on the original, Sony love to use custom hardware so they might be working on a new CPU, hopefully they use proper CPU cores this time were coming upto 6 core processors these days at a reasonable price so either sony would go for a quad core processor as standard or an eight core which may be provided by AMD.
post #44 of 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobotheklown View Post

Sad, sounds like the rumored 4K resolution is false

I'm pretty sure those 4k rumors were in reference for future media like video/movies. Video games would be a different beast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpriest667 View Post

Um so what are these guys going to do when 3 years in 4000p is our standard? LOL 1080p60 is so 5 years ago man.

I really don't think in 3 years 4000p will be standard. Most tv networks still do HD in 1080i or 720p. 1080p streaming from like Netflix is didn't happen until not that long ago. The first 4k tvs just barely went on sale and those are at 84" and $20,000 and that will probably take at least three years to get down to reasonable prices. Content providers won't jump on 4k content until there is a large enough base of 4k tvs in circulation. TV broadcasting will probably take even longer to be widespread. Probably sports networks will be quicker to upgrade.
Edited by KingGreasy - 11/1/12 at 2:18pm
post #45 of 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingGreasy View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobotheklown View Post

Sad, sounds like the rumored 4K resolution is false

I'm pretty sure those 4k rumors were in reference for future media like video/movies. Video games would be a different beast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpriest667 View Post

Um so what are these guys going to do when 3 years in 4000p is our standard? LOL 1080p60 is so 5 years ago man.

I really don't think in 3 years 4000p will be standard. Most tv networks still do HD in 1080i or 720p. 1080p streaming from like Netflix is didn't happen until not that long ago. The first 4k tvs just barely went on sale and those are at 84" and $20,000 and that will probably take at least three years to get down to reasonable prices. Content providers won't jump on 4k content until there is a large enough base of 4k tvs in circulation. TV broadcasting will probably take even longer to be widespread. Probably sports networks will be quicker to upgrade.

Yea, 4k resolution would require a very powerful GPU for a console, just to get to 30 fps. The minimum "4K" resolution of 3840x2160 is 8,294,400 pixels, 4x what 1080p has, and 4x the load on the pixel shader, which does the most work for rendering. You'd essentially need 4x the GPU power to support that resolution. Although, 4K at 30fps would be the same pixels per second as 1080p@120hz. Personally I'd rather have the 120hz. Still, most TVs don't have true 120hz input, or 4K resolution, so I don't think the GPU will be made powerful enough to target either of those marks, yes it may be able to support them, but developers likely could not use them without a very stripped down game.
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post #46 of 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt View Post

Can't wait to see how the A10 APU performs on the PS4.

The latest rumors are pointing to an APU+ dedicated GPU. This has been discussed over at Beyond3D which a lot of industry workers posts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Frosty View Post

PS3 generally now runs multiplats with no difference and in some games it actually runs them better then 360
Its not hard to code for, RSX uses basic OpenGL which has been around forever and any one who programmed PS2's Emotion Engine would find Cell a doddle..
PS3's biggest problem for the first few years was memory, the OS take a good chunk of RAM but over the years Sony have reduced it and gave developers more memory.
At launch PS3's OS took 120mb of memory, now it only takes 50mb giving developers an extra 70mb to play with, that has made all the difference.

Most multiplatform games look and run better on 360 even with multi-sampling AA applied. PS3 uses a custom version of OpenGL that isn't backwards compatible with any other version of OGP... Its essentially closed-source.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bosniac View Post

That's because ports are ports. Those devs. did not from a cost perspective utilize the PS3 fully. Yet we see games like Uncharted 2, Ratchet & Clank, God Of War 3, and Killzone 3 look fantastic, and as good and better as any title on the Xbox 360.

Crysis 2 on Xbox 360 was unanimously praised as the best looking console game and it came out after Uncharted 2 and Ratchet and Clank..

Source
Quote:
Originally Posted by doomlord52 View Post

At least they picked a sane CPU arch this time. Should result in better cross-plat games, and hopefully better performance.
As for 8-16gb RAM? Probably not. I could see 4-6gb, but I'm fearing it's going to be around 3gb. I dont think Sony wants a repeat of the $600+ launch price. And 1080p60fps? I doubt it. I'm pretty sure we'll be seeing 1080p almost entirely, but I think we'll still be stuck at 30fps. We're already going from 900,000 pixels (720p) to over 2 million, and it gets even more insane if you ALSO go from 30 to 60fps: From 27million pixels per second to 124 million.
While hardware has improved, they'll also want to increase poly count, AA and so on, all of which is going to add to render time. The only way it's going to happen is if the hardware is 10-20x faster than the PS3.

Poly count is not as important as it once was. The biggest hurdle now is fillrates/bandwith.

Also, dev kits usually have double the RAM for debugging on the console. Xbox 360 dev kits ship with 1GB of RAM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbie2009 View Post

APU? Really? Seems a little...underpowered.

Rumours are that its an quad-core APU + dedicated GPU

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Frosty View Post

And yet they all seem to get demolished by PS3 Exclusive games...... I remember when mutliplatform developers were slagging PS3 off saying it would never have textures as good as 360 could produce...
Then Naughty Dog released Uncharted and made them all look stupid........

360 exclusives and select multiplats look just as good, if not better than PS3 exclusive and I can assure you that no developer had to touch assembly language. Even taking into account PS3 exclusives, there isn't one I can think of that employs MSAA like the handful that are on 360.

Most recent example: Forza Horiza has 4xMSAA and FXAA.

Uncharted 2 looks about on par with Gears of War 3 yet to extract that performance, devs had to program in assembly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4LC4PON3 View Post

I cant wait. I love the PS3 for its exclusives. IMO the Xbox 360 has really only 2 exclusives. Gears Of War & Halo where as the PS3 has a bunch of exclusives. Dont get me wrong I used to like my 360 because it did offer the best online experience but ofr me not everything for me is done online. I enjoy great single player games & the PS3 just had more to offer.
I cant wait to get the PS4 I may have to skip the next xbox if it does not offer more games.

360 has more exclusives than the PS3.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arni90 View Post

So, basically, the PS4 won't be that much more powerful than a Wii U.

It'll have an APU + dedicated GPU.
Edited by BizzareRide - 11/1/12 at 2:57pm
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post #47 of 468

For some reason most 360 exclusives never appealed to me.

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post #48 of 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Frosty View Post

And yet they all seem to get demolished by PS3 Exclusive games...... I remember when mutliplatform developers were slagging PS3 off saying it would never have textures as good as 360 could produce...
Then Naughty Dog released Uncharted and made them all look stupid........

The funny thing about Uncharted is that there are very few polygons in the game. All of the buildings consist of flat surfaces with illusionary textures which make them appear to be rounded when looking at it straight on. Even round columns are actually cubic (not even octagonal) with textures that make them appear round using lighting techniques (my art major roommate pointed these out while playing it). In terms of systems demand Uncharted should run fine on the Xbox 360 though certain effects like water and wind may not work without the SPU's.

Really the PS3 was unnecessarily difficult to develop for just because Sony wanted to push a chip that they had just developed with IBM and Toshiba (that or it was a contract to sell the chip). While it made for an excellent server rendering chip it just wasn't made to work with games. Still I don't think it was as bad as say the PS2 which had a very unusual CPU architecture (one CPU core, two vector processing units, and an image processor which pre-processes an image before rendering in the graphics synthesizer).

An APU based console would be ideal because:
- it's based on pre-existing technology that is already compatible with generic x86 software
- it uses shared memory like the Xbox 360 so that memory allocation can be decided by the developers.
- it's already in mass production so entry costs are minimal
- it already integrates a GPU (among other components) into the chip which would make production even cheaper
- it has the option to work in conjunction with a HD 6670 to boost graphical performance (if that option for the PS4 ever comes around).
- it has a low enough TDP that consoles should not suffer from a RROD or YLOD.
- PC ports of PS4 games should run a lot smoother than current ports and have lower system requirements.

On the downside it won't be backwards compatible with PS3 games because the hardware won't be powerful enough to emulate them but re-releases can be expected anyways.
post #49 of 468
There is no Point to having a APU + GPU. I think APU think Fast system memory could perform really well.
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post #50 of 468
so all 3 next gen consoles will use an AMD GPU...
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