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[PCGN] Valve on why they're favouring Linux over Windows 8 - Page 20

post #191 of 289
Title is misleading. No fearmongering of any sorts is going on. Valve is simply saying they're viewing linux as a viable alternative and hoping to add games to it to both bring more support to linux and to expand valve's platform. Easy. Gabe isn't crapping on windows 8 in this article at all. He's saying if windows does in fact "close shop" valve would rather deal with Linux. Which is fine with me. Where the hell is ValveOS already?
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post #192 of 289
from what I understand,the issue is the game dev loose access to administrator account in w8,they also need other thing ,if any could name the added stuff game dev are required of?
post #193 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xero. View Post

Look forwarding to install on Mint smile.gif

The closed beta (and the open beta I think) will only support Ubuntu 12.04 because so many more people use it compared to other distros.

But you can do the Linux survey and they might select you for the beta, if enough people put Mint as their distro in the survey I guess:

http://www.valvesoftware.com/linuxsurvey.php
Edited by Edge Of Pain - 11/6/12 at 3:18pm
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post #194 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by xeekei View Post

All I see in this thread is anti-Linux FUD, Windows 8 hate or love, and even good ol' American arrogance. confused.gif Can't we be happy that games are a huge step closer to becoming available on a third, very decent platform? redface.gif
Calling people arrogant, is kind of arrogant. tongue.gif
post #195 of 289
Experienced Linux gamer please
post #196 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atrophy View Post

While I despise Valve and Steam, I'm hoping this is the catalyst to hopefully move most PC gaming to Linux.
May I ask, how do you buy games (I hope this doesn't sound rude)? I have read that steam is not good, but many games, even retail, need to be activated via steam.

My question is if you dislike steam, how do you buy games?
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post #197 of 289
Not all games are on Steam. In fact I rarely use Steam these days with MOHW, BF3, and all the Crysis games making up the majority of my gaming...
post #198 of 289
^ I buy retailer where ever possible.
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post #199 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by conntick View Post

Calling people arrogant, is kind of arrogant. tongue.gif
I have no horse in this race, but if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck...
post #200 of 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzleBoy View Post

Good luck getting devs to port their games to linux for free.

I'll see you all back on Windows in about a year or so after you get bored of playing almost nothing but Valve games (which is "awesome" considering Valve barely makes games these days).

There's more than just Valve games, I'm sure you've seen the list.
I'm going to use GPU passthrough to a VM running Windows 7 and maybe 8, I get >90% of the native Windows performance without any of the future security vulnerabilities in future, at least any that matter; I could even use network drives and symlinks to have the saves on the non-VM HDDs so if I got a virus (Somehow) then I could simply delete the VM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniflex View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post

Actually, Java can be just as fast as C/C++ with proper coding; however trusting all programmers to code properly and not do a one night job is like trusting that a i7 3930K and HD7970 CFX setup will still max out games in 10 years time..it just won't happen.
Perhaps, I dont know as I dont use Java, however, back when Matlab was still written mostly in Java I remember when my supervisor asked me to solve a Boussinesq equation numerically and gave me some code snippet as an example which solved the Korteweg De Vries equation (in a nutshell nonlinear partial differential equations). When I made the code run it was damn slow, so I did the exactly same thing in FORTRAN and lo and behold it was approx 1000 times faster (I.e., what took previously hours to compute happened within seconds). Now if Matlab programmers were not being able to pull off "proper coding" I kind of doubt that there is many people on Earth who can pull off such speed feats within Java. It was mostly fast Fourier transforms, some multiplication with complex numbers in Fourier space and the inverse transform each time step and in time it was solved with the pretty standard Runge-Kutta (i.e., the "leap frog method").

It heavily depends on the code.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Audio View Post

I'm not sure why the consensus on overclock.net has recently changed from everyone agreeing with gabe, to now gabe is just fear mongering. To me it's very clear that windows 8 is a strong move towards a closed platform. Gabe responds appropriately by making a strong move towards a new open platform, this guy isn't one of the richest persons in the world because he's a dumb fear monger-er. Like a smart buisness man, gabes concern is his consumers.

Do I want a closed platform as a consumer/user? hell ****ing no. Not having a start button is not only a change i don't agree with, it's a movement in a direction that i don't want as user. Sure W8 isn't closed platform , but it's the first step.

It's not definite but it certainly looks like they're trying to move to a closed platform with the admin account changes, the UAC changes and Metro. For people who say that it's definitely not going to happen..well, do you really think the man voted as the worst CEO and acts deranged quite often (Look at the many, many videos of him on youtube) is going to make great decisions? I can see him trying to force everyone to use apps from the App Store if MS don't force him out and then failing anyway.

Is it definite and is there anything other than circumstantial evidence? No, but I don't really feel like taking a chance with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Audio View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain318 View Post

Gabe wants us to shop the Steam Store only and to hate other distro method's. He wants Steam to start with your PC and be there waiting to take your money from from boot. Not for us to browse the Windows Game store no no no.
I honestly think he see's what a Juggernaut Xbox Live Arcade has become and is worried about Microsoft bringing the same service to Windows and furthermore starting with the PC in this new UI where Steam is not.
As far as W8 being different, I remember these same arguments back when they first introduced the Start Menu when Win 95 came along. It's new and it scares people I get it. Learn it, Stay on 7, or use Start 8.
I know why Microsoft removed the Start Menu and that's to get people to accept change and show investors they were serious about this new UI. It's not that darn hard to use for pete sakes it's just different. But Closed? Haha Microsoft isn't that dumb.
Windows 8 is a good OS. Not perfect but not as bad as it's made out to be wink.gif

Obviously Microsoft isn't that dumb, that's why they are slowly moving in that direction. There's a lot of reasons microsoft would want a closed platform, mostly money. Cold turkey closed platform would be suicide. I tried to make that clear, but apparently i wasn't clear enough. They start with a store, that has a few applications and clear set of rules to abid by if you want to publish said applications, and after the store is widely used they go closed platform. Creating a market controlled by microsoft and it's rules.

If you think m$oft doens't want a part of the steam pie, you're an ignorant moron. Steam and gabe are fine with competition because their only interest is what's best for the consumer and the platform they develop on, they aren't fine with being eliminated by a monopoly that is a closed windows platform. I'll say it again because i want to be extremely clear, windows 8 is not a closed platform, it's a step towards a closed platform. This whole valve supporting linux thing, i don't see any reason why i should not support this. I prefer an open market and competition. More linux users the more pressure put on microsoft to actually make a decent platform. Sure this whole closed platform thing could never pan out, but it's moves like this that create enough competition to stop monopoly.

I sincerely hope that i read more headlines "valve favoring linux over windows", for the sake of competition and open market. Because if you let microsoft get their hand in the cookie jar, they'll eat all the cookies and maybe even the jar.

And if anyone doesn't believe this: Look at IE, it sure was following a lot of standards before it started getting a lot of competition, right? rolleyes.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ksireaper View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deeldo View Post

I've been using Windows since the 95 version.
I use Steam on daily basis. But I won't be going Linux for it. Never, ever. I'm no fanboy, but Windows 8 is great for me.
So was 7, Vista, XP and 98.

Same here. Trying to do basic tasks in Linux is a nightmare. As someone who works on PCs for a living i don't mind learning but it is just way too much work for the average user to ever gain any real market share.

Valve could completely move to Linux and no longer support Windows and they would lose me as a customer because i don't want to deal with the headache that is Linux.

I have no idea what you consider "basic tasks" but they're certainly easy to do in Ubuntu in my experience, I class it as word processing, internet browsing, watching videos and a few other things.
I've also seen many people get their kids and older relatives on Ubuntu without much if any difficulty.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain318 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ksireaper View Post

Windows 8 is extremely polished. Best Windows OS that i have used to date. ( In My Opinion
Same here. Trying to do basic tasks in Linux is a nightmare. As someone who works on PCs for a living i don't mind learning but it is just way too much work for the average user to ever gain any real market share.
Valve could completely move to Linux and no longer support Windows and they would lose me as a customer because i don't want to deal with the headache that is Linux.

What's funny is all the so called "advanced users" here on OCN revolt against Windows 8 for changing the UI. Well if they are so advanced they can put back the start menu but they won't because HEY they shouldn't have too rolleyes.gif but in the same breath say they will run to Linux which is a giant pain the butt and has little software support. Same folks that adore Steam and hate Origin and now the Windows Store.

LOL OCN you is full of Hypocrites

EDIT: I forgot to put in ALL HAIL STEAM rolleyes.gif

MS clearly wants to move us to WinRT eventually, which is only used by Metro apps and not the normal desktop environment, we'll likely lose the normal desktop completely which renders Start8 and ClassicShell useless. Until I have a 1st party (ie. From MS) option to have a real start menu, I won't be touching it.

Anyway, I'm happy to move to Linux because it's not a pain in the butt unless you do stuff to try and make it a pain in the butt, and the vast majority of software I use works fine on it, I'd be using it Steam or no Steam because the way Microsoft is moving Windows is incompatible with what I want in an OS.

I dislike Steam and Origin, I want a DRM free store-front from a 3rd party.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpriest667 View Post

Sorry I had to delete all the rest of the crap from your post so I could address what you said to me. I call Libre Office Open Office because it is Open Office. Its the same program the same interface and the same amount of suckage. Thats #1

2) THERE WERE PEOPLE CLAIMING THAT WIN8 WOULD NOT RUN STEAM or SOME GAMES. <--- read please... So I was just debunking that myth right then and there.

3) I read the article unlike half the posters in here. What I heard was whining. Sorry you don't like it.

1) It's a fork/enhancement, by that logic you should call OS/2 and Windows DOS, Linux and Mac OS X Unix, etc. It also doesn't suck, I don't know what you were trying to do on it but I never have any issues with it for the most common type of stuff done in Word/Excel.

2) Maybe when Win8 was still in beta, I didn't see anyone saying so here..And if they were they meant it's a possibility in future if MS does continue down the path of locking Windows down.

3) Whining because MS is moving in a direction that's bad for them..Why is it bad that they complain about that? You're effectively saying that person A shouldn't complain when person B kicks them because that's just whining.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

What a bunch of hogwash! I'm using Steam and Origin just fine on Win8. MS isn't trying to lock out game clients... rolleyes.gif

No-one said they were, but wait until Windows 10 or 11, if the MS App Store becomes the most popular marketplace on Windows then I can definitely see them locking Windows down tighter than a virgin.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrak View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubers View Post

I think many people here are just happy to see some serious gaming support for Linux.

This.

And it seams that a lot of people assume Steam coming to Linux is about converting Windows users, which it isn't ( although if some do then great ).

Most of us are just happy to see a REAL effort put into gaming for Linux. People can say it's been done before by other big names like John Carmack, but even he didn't put a lot of effort into it. His attempt was a joke at best. Valve went straight to one of the biggest problems, video drivers, and started helping get things fixed that needed it. And are helping Nvidia and AMD, and have found and reported a bunch of bugs to Nvidia already. They aren't just bringing Steam to Linux, they're actually trying to fix some of the underlying issues that have been holding it back in the gaming world ( outside of DirectX of course ).

This. OCN isn't level headed when it comes to this things, you're either hard one way or hard another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven Dizzle View Post

I hate to break it to you, guys. This isn't going to put but a scratch in Microsofts market share. I know some of you are simply on some sort of anti-8 tirade and leaning towards this as a leverage, but it'll make zero difference. For the majority of users, which is all that really matters in a situation like this, it's not feasible to switch to Linux if every single app I use doesn't work, and it's even less feasible to think that the majority of (or average) users will want to set up a dual boot.

Only an idiot thinks this will make Linux overtake Windows overnight, it certainly will help..Linux already has gotten increased company recognition from it. (See: nVidia's new drivers)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

I'm personally loving Win8 so far. Once they get the bugs worked out it will be far superior to Win7 in my opinion...

That's great, it's also your opinion..What I don't get about the Win8 defenders is why they think having a 1st party Microsoft Start Menu as an option is a bad thing, I don't care if they have Metro as long as I know I'll have my normal start menu for the foreseeable future as GUIs are a subjective thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Domino View Post

I was just about to use Linux as my main media/basic OS on my second hard drive but later found out that Windows was just better in every aspect; so I formatted that junk off my system. The user experience on Linux is poor, and only offers that placebo effect for the haters or those exploring alternative OSs. And why is it poor? Because of the crap support. Linux on supported platforms, like Android, OSs for game consoles, etc., are much better, why, because of the support they get.

It's not a good move. They should be putting their efforts into communicating with Microsoft and working on new titles or episodes instead of baseless fear mongering while being hypocritical about it on other platforms.

You say it like its fact, support doesn't really matter for everyone. As long as my hardware works fine (Which it all does) then I don't give a rats if ObscureWiFiUSBDongleA isn't supported.
I tend to google my problems and I'm yet to really get stuck with an issue to have no fix..which is more than I can see for Windows 7. (I get a weird AoE2 colour bug that's different from the normal one, it's practically unfixable, Steam fonts are also ugly on this i5 for some reason and a few games have really bad input lag..I can't find any fixes at all, anywhere)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil Penguin View Post

Valve isn't claiming that Windows 8 is a closed platform and they are simply looking into Linux as an alternative if Windows becomes a closed platform.
It seems like the majority of you guys didn't read the article or view the video.
Some of you are simply hating on Valve or Linux.

Exactly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubers View Post

Right, so Grizzle doesn't want to acknowledge that you can create Androids apps and distribute them regardless of the App Store, unlike Windows RT and what he said was entirely false about other ARM based OS's.

^ Just making sure everyone else recognises this.

He does that a lot, once you post something that completely disproves him he ignores it. I remember when he'd completely ignore the many times I said I don't like Steam nor Origin forcing you to use them when Origin was first starting, and ignored people proving it isn't EAs first DD time. (EA Download Manager)
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