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FPS exposing the myth between 30 fps and 60 fps - Page 8

post #71 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rickles View Post

You are wrong, CRTs had a refresh rate higher than 60( I would like to say 85 but not sure) and soap opera tv has a refresh rate of 48 fps (iirc) and cinema has a refresh rate of 24 fps, which I why when you watch Avatar in 3d at the cinema it is one big blurry mess.

Explains why Soap Operas always weirded me out. Maybe... why I could never look away too.
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post #72 of 144
Huge difference between 30 ad 60fps. if you can't tell the difference you need to get your eyes checked.
Simple as that.
post #73 of 144
When I ran this game and the FPS dropped to a persistent 30fps I noticed this straight away, It was running smooth but not the smoothest I've seen a game run and this game run, I see 60FPS a lot in MP3.
I assume that the FPS may have been a bit lower than a straight 30FPS, or It's Rockstar game's Rage Engine playing up again.
Either I'm not used to a high frame rate and a ckear drop or there's something sluggish about the Rage Engine in Max Payne 3.
I'll have to test It again but I dont think I've seen 30fps like that before, otherwise the game runs and looks magnificently.

I used to be a console gamer, I've only transitioned to (almost) full PC gaming since 2010 however I've always known of It and used to play PC games alot on my Brother's RIG, other than that I've mostly been with console gaming, doesn't been I dont know what I'm doing though, my friends call me a Geek tongue.gif
post #74 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by trulsrohk View Post

This is very subjective, not everyone's eyes work quite the same way, and What's smooth to one isn't to others.

The human eye is the same for every person. Granted vision acuity might change but, not the way or frequency the brain interprets these images.

I am willing to bet that in a double blind test a average gaming enthusiast will not be able to tell the difference between a constant 30FPS and a constant 50FPS or 60FPS. I know tons of people who dumped money into their rigs will argue they can, but I would like to see an experiment done.
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post #75 of 144
I posted this in the halo 4 thread and I don't want to type it out again:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paratrooper1n0 View Post

15 FPS is actually the framerate where our eyes run at, which is why fast objects are blurry when they pass out eyes. It's input lag that makes 30FPS seem different than 60FPS. Take Need For Speed Shift for example. It runs at 30FPS on consoles, but it is very fluid. There is little input lag. Most games I see input lag in are actually on the PC. Yes, I may be playing a game at 60FPS on my PC, but it's not fluid because of the input lag.

Please correct the bolded part. Human eye 101, it doesn't run at a certain fps.

So first of all, yes when the issue is simplified one image will be held by the visual cortex for about 1/10th or 1/15th of a second. This means that anything above say 13 to 15fps will look like motion in stead of individual pictures. But here's the kicker, just because we don't see the material as individual pictures anymore doesn't mean that it will look smooth.

For a film/game/whatever to look smoother you need more frames, above 15 you will already have a sense of motion but there is a huge difference between how we see 15, how we see 30 and how we see 60. With 15 our brain has to fill in much more blanks than it does with 60fps. That means that with 30fps we see more of something that could be described as motion blur. Yes, the smoothness can actually start to look unnatural at some point (and that limit definitely isn't at 30fps btw) but unlike for movies/TV this isn't really a bad thing for games.

With games you need to take more into consideration. First of all, how does the title handle motion blur? TV/movie material looks smoother at a lower frame rate than games due to more natural and consistent motion blur found in movies. Yes there are differences between games and how fluid they look at a given fps but the rule of thumb is that you need quite a lot of more frames per second to achieve similar fluidity.

As for the input lag argument, yes it's a part of it, it only makes the effect that much easier to detect on console PC. This effect is usually also amplified by the poor input lag that most TVs have. But input lag doesn't explain the whole issue, it's just a part of it. If input lag what was causing the whole thing, why would framerate differences be noticeable when there is no input?

see this link: http://boallen.com/fps-compare.html
 
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post #76 of 144
When I worry about FPS, the game feels too ruined. =\ I stopped caring about how high my FPS gets, as long its not stuttery.
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post #77 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimaggio1103 View Post

The human eye is the same for every person. Granted vision acuity might change but, not the way or frequency the brain interprets these images.
I am willing to bet that in a double blind test a average gaming enthusiast will not be able to tell the difference between a constant 30FPS and a constant 50FPS or 60FPS. I know tons of people who dumped money into their rigs will argue they can, but I would like to see an experiment done.
that would literally be the easiest test ever. all you would have to do is pan the camera.
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post #78 of 144
For me, anything below 45 is not smooth at all
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post #79 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcamaross View Post

that would literally be the easiest test ever. all you would have to do is pan the camera.

You wouldn't even have to play a game. The difference is extremely obvious at the desktop. Moving the cursor, opening folders, minimizing and maximizing.... Its so freaking obvious, I can't believe this is even being discussed.
post #80 of 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derp View Post

You wouldn't even have to play a game. The difference is extremely obvious at the desktop. Moving the cursor, opening folders, minimizing and maximizing.... Its so freaking obvious, I can't believe this is even being discussed.

Some people would rather live in denial than admit that they are wrong (or that they need up upgrade their hardware). I know someone who insists his 10 FPS is fine because its a "steady" 10 fps. No need to upgrade from his x850xt. Then he complains about how video games give him migraines. Totally the game engine's fault rolleyes.gif
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