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Goodbye fellow members, my last post at OCN - Page 22  

post #211 of 233
Quote:
We won't do that in any reasonable circumstance.

In fact, I've been here since almost the begining (2004) and can't remember a single incident where this kind of thing has been an issue. The ToS clause is a legal protection, but not something we actively pursue or enforce.

Is this referring to posting content uploaded here to another site as well?
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post #212 of 233
Thank you Chipp and Alatar for clearing up the information gap I had with the ownership stuff in the TOS.

Now the other thing I'm worried about is that if we post something here it is bad if we also post that exact same thing to another forum.
Edited by EpicAMDGamer - 12/10/12 at 4:30pm
     
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post #213 of 233
Please let me take a minute and quote what I wrote on the issue of sponsored content in 2010, since I think we could all use a refresher on why this is:
Quote:
...the companies offering goods for sponsorship purposes know that they are getting know that they are getting thousands of impressions for very little outlay. That is exactly why they offer goods to high-profile modders in the first place. We're not saying there is anything wrong with this, as indeed product placement has a solid place in the advertising world. We're just, as a forum, against the mixing of commercial content with our core content and have been since the site's inception. Indeed, we wish they would better recognize the value of advertising they get through folks like yourself and would be more willing to help with distributing a product placement that provides hundreds of thousands of views for them.

Since this is a popular route for high profile case mods, we wanted to offer an option where work logs with commercial elements could be posted to our site for those that want to have them here, rather than simply saying "no" completely as we had previously. The grandfathered threads in the sponsored logs subforum now show that we were not always perfect with enforcement of that policy.

As has always (and often) been the case, any worklogs posted elsewhere are more than welcome to be linked to by our members and discussed here, no different than how our News section operates. The particular environment we pride ourselves on does not include commercial materials beyond the few advertisements needed to help offset the costs of running a large community like ours.

As an extension of the discussion in this thread, in advance of our platform move which will provide a lot more opportunities to showcase the work of those who do post sponsored logs, we're looking at several immediate options to help accomplish that same goal (the most likely of which is 35,000 ad impressions in our top banner slot). Additionally, we are willing to explicitly document that 100% of the work log fees are returned directly to our modding community in the form of prizes and giveaways.

Quote:
To all:

Our original assumption was that those offering sponsored goods would be willing to pay for the costs of distributing those goods - if they won't negotiate with you, we are happy to work with them directly for them to have their advertisements run here in the form of sponsored logs. The fee was set where it was to keep the bar high - we recieve an incredible number of requests from people who want to "tell company xxx that if they will send them hardware they will review it and post it on OCN". Often, the quality of content created in those situations is abysmal. We hoped to prevent this bottom-feeder atmosphere by keeping a reasonable barrier to entry. The assumption was that $79 spread out amongst 1-4 companies + modder (if needed) would be negligible.

The key issue here is, once again, the sponsors are not giving out hardware randomly, they screen who they give it to based on the return they think they can get on their investment. That is not a purely altruistic goal - this is commercial activity. The FCC mandates that commercial activity be declared as such - this is why when you read a newspaper and see an advertisement that looks like an article, it has large "ADVERTISEMENT" lettering all over it.

This forum has become what it has in the time we've been around exactly because of the kind of community we run here. If we copied the way other folks did things, people would have no reason to come here and be members instead of going other places. Since day one, we've maintained the policy that there is to be no commercial content - nobody can post news articles from their own sites, we don't allow for sponsored hardware reviews, we require vendor representatives and manufacturer reps to keep a support-only presence, etc, etc - until now, we have not allowed sponsored case mods to be posted.

There has never been a problem with sponsored worklogs being linked here from another forum. At that point, the worklog has "gone viral", for lack of a better phrase, and we view that as acceptable. No longer is commercial influence driving the discussion, but rather, the worklog itself is prompting users to share it elsewhere. No problems at all there. If a worklog can't generate enough interest for people to discuss it on more than one message board, then it likely is not something that members here would "miss out" on anyways.

When you accept sponsors for your work, you must keep in mind that you are agreeing to advertise for your sponsors - you are now, essentially, a spokesperson for them. That is a decision each modder will need to make when the time comes for them. Some choose not to accept the commercial influence, while other do. Each is fine. We're trying to setup a program under which those who do accept that commercial influence can have their work posted here, but, since they do carry commercial influence with them it cannot be for free. Taking an innocent view to this process will likely not help when asking a sponsor to cover distribution fees like this - making the proposal as something where they are buying advertising for well under market value perhaps will. The vendors should not expect to have high-visibility advertisements run for free.

If a modder cannot or will not pay the fee, that is no problem. Just as we welcome noncommercial content and have built our community around it, I am sure there are plenty of communities out there what would have no problems with an inline advertisement being run as content. Here, we place stipulations on such a thing.

Please note that I wrote this post during the course of a debate on the sponsored post system, prior to us establishing the price for a sponsored thread (review, worklog, etc) at $29. $79 was the original figure, which we revised down.
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post #214 of 233
After reading this whole thread, I see epicAMDgamer responding and quoting almost everything, yet, not understanding one bit of it. Everything has been laid out since early in the thread and this seems like an awful way to just raise your post count. Actually read what EVERYONE is telling you, and you wouldn't be asking the same question 15 times in 2 hours. sozo.gif
post #215 of 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by InsideJob View Post

Quote:
We won't do that in any reasonable circumstance.

In fact, I've been here since almost the begining (2004) and can't remember a single incident where this kind of thing has been an issue. The ToS clause is a legal protection, but not something we actively pursue or enforce.

Is this referring to posting content uploaded here to another site as well?

Absolutely.
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post #216 of 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai707 View Post

After reading this whole thread, I see epicAMDgamer responding and quoting almost everything, yet, not understanding one bit of it. Everything has been laid out since early in the thread and this seems like an awful way to just raise your post count. Actually read what EVERYONE is telling you, and you wouldn't be asking the same question 15 times in 2 hours. sozo.gif

Don't try to tell me what to do. I dont care about you. (that rhymes)
     
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post #217 of 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai707 View Post

After reading this whole thread, I see epicAMDgamer responding and quoting almost everything, yet, not understanding one bit of it. Everything has been laid out since early in the thread and this seems like an awful way to just raise your post count. Actually read what EVERYONE is telling you, and you wouldn't be asking the same question 15 times in 2 hours. sozo.gif
smh. haven't you figured it by now? epicgamer and OP are the same person.
    
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post #218 of 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remix65 View Post

smh. haven't you figured it by now? epicgamer and OP are the same person.


Actually I'm not sure what you've figured out but you have an error somewhere in the statement above. I'm not the op tongue.gif

TOS says only one account per person.........
Edited by EpicAMDGamer - 12/10/12 at 4:37pm
     
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post #219 of 233
As I think chipp cleared this up pretty well, I will have no further comment. Users are welcomed to PM me with hypothetical legal questions as how tgis pertains personally to them should they feel the need. Once again, chipp has cleared it up. Nothing has changed.
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post #220 of 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

Mods are still people... The people I moderate with here are great and they really do do their best and they're also extremely hardworking veteran users of OCN who know the site and the rules inside and out. That doesn't mean that mistakes can't happen, in this case a mistake was made about the policy on sponsored reviews, and then if was fixed.
Gonna have to ask someone else about that, I have no info. but again the misunderstanding was just fixed a small while ago, might take a while before everything is sorted.

Whoa, whoa, whoa...you guys are people?! lol, j/k I love (most ) of you guys. lol. wubsmiley.gif

I guess I will just stay tuned and see how things play out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chipp View Post

We won't do that in any reasonable circumstance.
In fact, I've been here since almost the begining (2004) and can't remember a single incident where this kind of thing has been an issue. The ToS clause is a legal protection, but not something we actively pursue or enforce.

I have never seen it as an issue until recently. Where these supposedly old rules have been misconstrued causing, in my opinion, valuable threads to be deleted. Just curious as to why things have been different lately although the rules have more-or-less remained the same in relation to such content.

I fully understand why you guys have the clause there, it simply should be updated/reworded to something less....scary, for the lack of a better description.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

The ToS doesn't prohibit you from watermarking your pictures.
Also look; EULAs in general are to cover the company of any frivolous lawsuits, they do not usually hold up in court in situations that would matter to you, me or any of the users here. No one will steal your pictures etc. from you and even if someone tried they wouldn't win that dispute because what you have agreed to is a legally non binding agreement.

this just reminds me of the South Park episode and Apple's EULA and human centipede. lol.
 
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