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4 WD VRaptors What now? - Page 2

post #11 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtyworks View Post

Seek speeds for the OS. Not only do the Raptors spin faster, the platters are physically smaller.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD

Smaller platters are a bad thing for performance. The outer edge of a 1 TB 3.5" HDD platter is probably close or better
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post #12 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtyworks View Post

Seek speeds for the OS. Not only do the Raptors spin faster, the platters are physically smaller.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD

Smaller platters are a bad thing for performance. The outer edge of a 1 TB 3.5" HDD platter is probably close or better

I'd say close. The access times don't drop as much as you'd expect, but sequential speeds should be comparable to a modern Velociraptor.

hdtuneproahcireadbenchm.png
hdtuneproahcireadrandom.png
     
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post #13 of 27
Smaller is worse for seek performance? I understand it would hinder sequential transfer speeds, but wouldn't the outer edge of a 10k 2.5" platter be a better spot for an OS than the outer edge of a 3.5" 7200 drive? Less real estate for the head to move is what I'm thinking.
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post #14 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtyworks View Post

Smaller is worse for seek performance? I understand it would hinder sequential transfer speeds, but wouldn't the outer edge of a 10k 2.5" platter be a better spot for an OS than the outer edge of a 3.5" 7200 drive? Less real estate for the head to move is what I'm thinking.
Some of those characteristics actually work against each other. An idea Velociraptor design would be 3.5" and 10k RPM, but short-stroked
Quote:
Higher Platter Density
+Increases sequential performance
+Allows larger capacity drives that can cut access times when you utilize less of them. (Short stroking)
-May require the manufacturer to tune the drive to have conservative seeks (especially when working with new densities)

Higher density drives are usually rolled out in "Green" models first.
Quote:
Higher RPM
+Increases sequential performance
+Decreases access time
Quote:
Larger Platter Size
+Increases sequential performance towards the outer edge
-Increases whole-drive access times, as they fall toward the inner edge


What we currently have is a 2.5" Velociraptor, which has these aspects:
Quote:
Platter Density: Sequential Performance+++
RPM: Sequential Performance+++, Access Times---
Platter Size: Sequential Performance---, Access Times---

Of course, access times dropping are a good thing - but the small platter size actually works against the platter density and RPM when it comes to sequential speeds, and short stroking a 10k RPM drive with 3.5" platters should allow the same access times of the 2.5" model.

Regarding the internals of a drive, physically speaking a few millimetres of movement are a few millimetres of movement - that movement should take the same amount of time when the drive's controller is tuned the same way, and is dealing with the same density of platter. (Which does not necessarily have to be the same size of platter.) Regardless of whether the platter is 2.5 inches across or 3.5 inches across, the drive should be able to deliver the same access times because the other characteristics match up. But there's no way for the smaller platter with a smaller circumference to match the larger one in sequential performance, because literally more data is passing under the head per second for the larger platter.
Edited by Kramy - 1/7/13 at 3:29pm
     
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post #15 of 27
Thread Starter 
So still 2 questions should i raid the os? And if so what stripe size should i use for the os? Largest common file size moved would be probably about 500 mb although i do love me my udk, which is about 1.2 gb avg
     
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post #16 of 27
128k stripe. i had to 2 300gb raptors set up like this before and it was very fast for standard drives.
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post #17 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by dekciW View Post

So still 2 questions should i raid the os? And if so what stripe size should i use for the os? Largest common file size moved would be probably about 500 mb although i do love me my udk, which is about 1.2 gb avg
I probably wouldn't - but then again, I do enough stuff with my computer to merit all the drives in my signature. tongue.gif When doing that many things at once, having each drive have its own IOPS (rather than combining them with RAID-0) is best.

64K or 128K for OS, on an array built from modern drives.
     
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post #18 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtyworks View Post

Smaller is worse for seek performance? I understand it would hinder sequential transfer speeds, but wouldn't the outer edge of a 10k 2.5" platter be a better spot for an OS than the outer edge of a 3.5" 7200 drive? Less real estate for the head to move is what I'm thinking.

I don't know the exact platter radius but lets assume 2.5" and 3.5".


The RPMs and size of the platter determine the linear velocity at the edge:
7200RPM 2.5" HDD's: 7200 * 2 * pi * 2.5/2 = 54977 in/minute = 53 mph
7200RPM 3.5" HDD's: 7200 * 2 * pi * 3.5/2 = 79168 in/minute = 75 mph
10K RPM 2.5" HDD's: 10000 * 2 * pi * 2.5/2 = 78540 in/minute = 75 mph
15K RPM 2.5" HDD's: 15000 * 2 * pi * 2.5/2 = 117810 in/minute = 112 mph


This is regardless of the aeral density.
Edited by DuckieHo - 1/7/13 at 9:27am
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Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
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Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
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i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
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Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
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post #19 of 27
Thread Starter 
So I got around to running some HD Tune and here's the results..I also ran it with my old drive to get an idea on the difference in speed...So for starters I guess I will post those first since I ran into something interesting...The testing I did with both the WD running as the OS and the Seagate. So there are 2 sets of results and I also ran the 500GB Raptor just for fun..

I'm not sure if their current usage capacities make a difference in these tests, but if they do I will post up the usage should anyone say. Also the Seagate is an old windows install while the raptor is fresh so this can play a difference as well. I will be doing the raid setup at a later time when I find the time and will post results then...

So here are the seagate results with the Raptor as the OS Drive.


Now here It is run as the OS Drive... Any ideas as to the cause of that large drop in minimums?


Here are the results of the raptor drives pretty consistent through all the tests...

As the OS Drive


As secondary drive


500GB on raptor OS drive
     
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i7 3770k @ 4.5/1.26v ASUS Maximus Formula V XFX R290X 16GB CORSAIR DOMINATOR GT DDR3 2133Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
x2 WD WD2500HHTZ, x2 WD WD5000HHTZ (Raid0), Sea... Samsung SH-222AB Corsair H100 Quad-Fan - CPU Corsair H80/H80 - 6990 
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7 Ultimate x64 SP1 3x Samsung S27A750D in Eyefinity Microsoft Sidewinder X6 Corsair AX1200 
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Cooler Master Haf X (Temp Case) NZXT Avatar S (Black) Xtrac PADS RIPPER XXL Razer Megalodon/Maelstrom Audio Engine 7.1 
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Sony CECHYA-0080 Wireless Headset/Onboard Realt... Harman/Kardon AVR 1600 - Sony SAVS-150H 7.1 Spe... Harman/Kardon 330A - Cinema Acoustics CSX-1200 ... 
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Intel C2D E6700 (Conroe) @ 3.6Ghz Intel D975XBX2 "Bad Axe 2" ATi Radeon X1950 Pro 4GB DualChan Corsair Dominator PC6400 @ 720Mhz 
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Old 130gb 5400rpm Seagate  SH22AB H60 Dual Fan Intake 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i7 3770k @ 4.5/1.26v ASUS Maximus Formula V XFX R290X 16GB CORSAIR DOMINATOR GT DDR3 2133Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingCooling
x2 WD WD2500HHTZ, x2 WD WD5000HHTZ (Raid0), Sea... Samsung SH-222AB Corsair H100 Quad-Fan - CPU Corsair H80/H80 - 6990 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
7 Ultimate x64 SP1 3x Samsung S27A750D in Eyefinity Microsoft Sidewinder X6 Corsair AX1200 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Cooler Master Haf X (Temp Case) NZXT Avatar S (Black) Xtrac PADS RIPPER XXL Razer Megalodon/Maelstrom Audio Engine 7.1 
AudioAudioAudio
Sony CECHYA-0080 Wireless Headset/Onboard Realt... Harman/Kardon AVR 1600 - Sony SAVS-150H 7.1 Spe... Harman/Kardon 330A - Cinema Acoustics CSX-1200 ... 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel C2D E6700 (Conroe) @ 3.6Ghz Intel D975XBX2 "Bad Axe 2" ATi Radeon X1950 Pro 4GB DualChan Corsair Dominator PC6400 @ 720Mhz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Old 130gb 5400rpm Seagate  SH22AB H60 Dual Fan Intake 
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Corsair TX750v2 NZXT Apollo None 
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post #20 of 27
i don't know if this helps, but here is my 3x Vraps in raid 0. i just got the third when it went on sale at fry's. got it for less then $80US after a coupon i had for 10% off.



Edit: my OS is on these babies and all my games.
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