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My first PC build - Some feedback would be great :) - Page 6

post #51 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Syryll View Post

I'm scared of SSD. I know there's no need to be. I'm retarded like that. I'd hate to have to set up my interface in WoW again, which is why I keep it backed up tongue.gif

Well theorically a standard 3K P/E SSD has higher lifespan than an HDD and should be easier to recover data from in case of failure (- which should be NAND wearout only since there's no mechanical stuff involved).

When the NAND is worn out, the data written on it is still accessible while that isn't the case for HDDs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GIitched View Post

Well im going to go to sleep now fellas, I'll try to keep you posted on my PC rig status biggrin.gif

Post some pics if you want to!
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post #52 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by adridu59 View Post


A 7950 Crossfire would have a scaling of 1.6x ~ 2.0x (according to Guru3D) and you would need a 700W+ power supply (Guru3D).
You can read the whole article to learn more about 7950 Crossfire. thumb.gif
http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/radeon_hd_7950_crossfire_review_2_and_3_way,19.html

But it is absolutely not needed as of now, for single-screen 1080p gaming at least.

 

No, all that would be needed for two 7950s in Crossfire is quality-made 550W power supply.  The reason they're recommending that much is they have to refer to peak-rated power supplies.  A 700W peak-rated PSU would likely be able to deliver 500-550W continuously - albeit not very well.

 

As you can see, two 7950's pulled 279W from the PSU.  This does not take into account the idle power which would be about 175W for Guru3D.  That makes the PSU pulling 454W from the wall outlet.  Now, their CPU is idling, so I have to add about 150W for an overclocked 3570K or 3770K which makes the PSU pulling about 605W from the wall outlet.  So, if the PSU is 85% efficient while pulling about 605W from the wall outlet, then that means the system is pulling no more than about 515W from the PSU.

 

So, two 7950s pulls less power than two 680s.  For two 680s, it was 530W being pulled from the PSU.

 

Therefore, a quality-made 550W power supply is more than enough.

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post #53 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post

No, all that would be needed for two 7950s in Crossfire is quality-made 550W power supply.  The reason they're recommending that much is they have to refer to peak-rated power supplies.  A 700W peak-rated PSU would likely be able to deliver 500-550W continuously - albeit not very well.

Nice info, thank you. 550W sounds a bit wow - but that's a good thing. biggrin.gif
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post #54 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by adridu59 View Post


Nice info, thank you. 550W sounds a bit wow - but that's a good thing. biggrin.gif

 

Well, the numbers don't lie nor do they have opinions, and that's why I use them.  :)

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post #55 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by GIitched View Post

Well im going to go to sleep now fellas, I'll try to keep you posted on my PC rig status biggrin.gif

Might I throw my opinion in on this one if you don't mind (and you haven't bought parts yet). biggrin.gif

I think you need to do your homework first. I see alot of post like yours, "I seen a build like this", "is this a good build", etc. To be quiet frank if you are asking these questions about the hardware you picked out, you honestly don't know enough about computers to be building a custom then yet. Why? Because you will do like me when I got into this hobby some time ago. You will kick yourself for spending too much/too little on parts you wanted or parts you didn't want. And not only is it money but it is also your TIME. Especially for $2,000+, whether you have the money or not, it is alot of money to spend and you should put some quality time into researching out all the parts you picked.
Example, the graphics card you picked, you asked earlier if 4GB of memory is better than 3GB... that is one of the most basic/common questions to graphics cards. I really think you need to do some more research before settling on any of this, and learn what is good among your own without having to ask. Here are some things i think you need to analyze.

1) What is your budget? Honestly I could build (in fact already own) an AMD system that can compete with that build that I built for half the price. I'm an adult, I make some pretty good cash, but I also am MONEY CONSCIOUS. How are you going to enjoy life and take care of yourself if your pouring thousands of dollars into your computer? If you get an astronomical paycheck than by all means, buy the best of the best parts! But please for yourself, if you don't make that much don't waste it all on a computer. Parts go outdated very fast, especially graphics cards! And I say this because you mentioned buying a car first. It sounds like you are younger. Take care of yourself/life first, computer comes second or third. I don't meant to beat your ear on this if you are older already. But it sounds like you are young, buy your car first and other important things in life.

2) Look at the parts you picked, the best CPU and best grafix card on the market. Are you going to need all that power? I think I seen you mention you play WOW on here. If this is for mild gaming like wow, diablo 3, starcraft II, counter strike, and even newer games like borderlands 2? You absolutely DO NOT need a graphics card of that power. You can run all those games on the highest settings with a budget card like the 550ti for $120. The only thing you need a card like that for is if you are going to be playing Battlefield 3 and/or Crysis 3 next month on maximum settings. And let me tell you something about Crysis. Even in the BEST computer, most people cannot run it at 60fps.

3) Again, your basic PC knowledge, how much do you really know about all those parts? I will give you a very very fine example. You picked out 1866Mhz RAM. Did you know this type of RAM is NOT plug and play? Any RAM you buy that is 1600Mhz+ is considered "overclocked". The RAM was tested to run at those speeds, but it's no guarantee. You typically have to adjust your timings/voltages to run RAM at it's recommended speeds. Whether you mean to or not, you have to get into "overclocking" and "fine tuning" if you want to get the most out of your hardware. In a custom build, you will want to get into fine tuning everything, or else you are going to have a slow, crappy computer that blue screens all the time.

I have no qualm against the parts you picked, or Intel vs. AMD. You have the best of the best parts listed there. I just think you need to do your homework and learn more about those parts on your own before buying things like that. Here is my take on the build. The motherboard/CPU are great. Graphics card, I think it is absolute overkill especially if you don't play Crysis/BF3 which are two of the only real games that fully utilize that hardware. If you want one of the best graphics cards on the market that is less than half the price, check this out:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125414

The Radeon 7950 is the best bang for you buck on the market right now, anyone on here is welcome to argue with me over this because $300, amazing performance, 3GB of memory, and the 384 bit will allow you to go high/max AA settings to get rid of jagged edges. Overclocked, this card EASILY competes with the 670. Also this is just the Gigabyte version but it and the MSI versions I believe have three fans, which you want because these cards run very hot. I would prefer the MSI/Sapphire over Gigabyte one.

RAM, I honestly think you should go with 1600Mhz RAM unless you plan on dealing with timings/voltages/blue screens to get it to run at those rated speeds. You will hardly notice any difference and you will save alot of money. Also, if you do learn what you are doing you can overclock it to run at 1800Mhz+ anyway. Again, anyone is welcome to disagree with me on this as well.

Power supply, I seen someone argue getting a lower watt one. I diagree, 750 watts is the sweet spot. Why? If you upgrade your case with more fans/lights and tons of USB devices, you want those extra watts and you NEVER want to have a PSU running a full load. Second, it leaves headroom for you to do a VERY easy upgrade to your build. When you graphics become slightly dated, you can crossfire a second 7950 graphics card in your build. Additional graphics card must have a good PSU preferrably 750 watt. Note, your motherboard may or may not support crossfire, I recommend getting one that supports both Nvidia SLI and Crossfire X. Lastly, if you're getting a PSU make sure you get something that is known for being QUIET!! Some PSUs can be very noisy/annoying (I'm talking to you, Thermaltake)!

There, you have something to go by, and I think if you go with my recommendations you can safe $400+ on the build. But like I said, do you homework, make sure you want to take the plunge and consider an AMD system as well. Intel is undoubtedly the best but if you're not an enthusiast you aren't really going to enjoy it as much.
post #56 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by executorchunk View Post

Power supply, I seen someone argue getting a lower watt one. I diagree, 750 watts is the sweet spot. Why? If you upgrade your case with more fans/lights and tons of USB devices, you want those extra watts and you NEVER want to have a PSU running a full load.

 

No, those kind of upgrades will not make enough of a difference.  The calculations I posted are for if the video card(s) and the CPU are under load simultaneously.  Plus, the calculations are based on Guru3D's power-hungry test system - it's more power-hungry than the system he is looking at building, that's for sure.

 

Therefore, the 550W recommendation is not going to be saturated easily.  He would have to put a lot of effort into it because again, he'd have to completely max out the video cards and the CPU at the same time in order to reach the 515W and 530W calculations I posted earlier.  Plus, these calculations are based on Guru3D's power-hungry system.  His actual gaming power draw for these 515W and 530W figures will be closer to about 400-450W.  That's far from stressful for a quality-made 550W unit that can easily deliver 550W "24/7" if it's ever needed.

 

Opinions are great and I love my opinions too, but I prefer to go by facts.  They don't lie, and they don't have any of their own opinions.  It's all right there "in black and white".

 

Now, concerning that "sweet spot" you mentioned:

 

On PSU Efficiency

 

PSU "50% Load" Myth

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by executorchunk View Post

Second, it leaves headroom for you to do a VERY easy upgrade to your build. When you graphics become slightly dated, you can crossfire a second 7950 graphics card in your build.

 

Yeah, and adding a 2nd 7950 would come out to be an absolute maximum of 515W being pulled from the PSU if the 7950s and the CPU are completely maxed out simultaneously.  The gaming power draw for this would be closer to about 400-450W.  I explained this in an earlier post.

 

Not only that, but we are on a trend right now where each new generation of video cards requires less power than the previous.  There is no sign of this trend stopping, so it makes no sense to get a quality-made 750W power supply unless you want to have 2-3 video cards, and maybe 4 future-generation video cards.  Yes, seriously.

 

Edit:  This trend goes for CPUs too.


Edited by TwoCables - 1/13/13 at 12:04pm
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post #57 of 65
executorchunk, I think you didn't read through the whole thread since the following build is what's being considered now:
Quote:
Originally Posted by adridu59 View Post

PCPartPicker part list

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($229.00 @ PCCaseGear)
CPU Cooler: NZXT Havik 140 ($69.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UD3H-WB WIFI ($189.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Memory: G.Skill Ares F3-1866C9D-8GAB 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 ($55.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($75.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Storage: Plextor M5S Series 128GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($119.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon HD 7950 3GB Video Card ($329.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Case: Corsair Carbide 200R ($79.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Power Supply: Antec High Current Gamer 620W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($95.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Optical Drive: Samsung SH-224BB DVD/CD Writer ($19.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Monitor: Asus VE247H 23.6" Monitor ($169.00 @ PCCaseGear)
Total: $1348.00
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-01-14 05:08 EST+1100)

It has already a 7950 and such. But considering an AMD system is a joke right now, since AMD FX CPU's have too much flaws (it improved with Vishera but still not here, we're all hoping Steamroller will be competitive through).
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post #58 of 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by adridu59 View Post

executorchunk, I think you didn't read through the whole thread since the following build is what's being considered now:
It has already a 7950 and such. But considering an AMD system is a joke right now, since AMD FX CPU's have too much flaws (it improved with Vishera but still not here, we're all hoping Steamroller will be competitive through).

I'm sure that wall of text took him quite sometime to write. He may very well have started before you posted that overhauled build.


I do say that 3570k is a better choice for OP regardless. Doesn't Vishera get outperformed by it in video gaming?

@Executorchunk: Enthusiasts have to start somewhere. While OP might just be getting started with his first build, he seems interested in what he can make it do, and if he needs more help, that's what we're here for! This post was research in my book. OP's learned quite a bit here already.
Edited by Syryll - 1/13/13 at 12:25pm
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post #59 of 65
nice parts
post #60 of 65
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by executorchunk View Post

Might I throw my opinion in on this one if you don't mind (and you haven't bought parts yet). biggrin.gif

I think you need to do your homework first. I see alot of post like yours, "I seen a build like this", "is this a good build", etc. To be quiet frank if you are asking these questions about the hardware you picked out, you honestly don't know enough about computers to be building a custom then yet. Why? Because you will do like me when I got into this hobby some time ago. You will kick yourself for spending too much/too little on parts you wanted or parts you didn't want. And not only is it money but it is also your TIME. Especially for $2,000+, whether you have the money or not, it is alot of money to spend and you should put some quality time into researching out all the parts you picked.
Example, the graphics card you picked, you asked earlier if 4GB of memory is better than 3GB... that is one of the most basic/common questions to graphics cards. I really think you need to do some more research before settling on any of this, and learn what is good among your own without having to ask. Here are some things i think you need to analyze.

I agree, I didnt want to spend good money on a PC rig that has parts that are complete over kill, but I was also thinking about future proofing the rig so that I wont have to worry about future upgrades so much. I.e. get a GTX680 now so in the future i can just buy another card.

And I was asking about if the 4gb worth getting over the 2gb when the reviews i read said the 4gb only really came into effect on much larger high resolution screens. So if im getting a smaller screen then the 4gb might not be worth it.
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1) What is your budget? Honestly I could build (in fact already own) an AMD system that can compete with that build that I built for half the price. I'm an adult, I make some pretty good cash, but I also am MONEY CONSCIOUS. How are you going to enjoy life and take care of yourself if your pouring thousands of dollars into your computer? If you get an astronomical paycheck than by all means, buy the best of the best parts! But please for yourself, if you don't make that much don't waste it all on a computer. Parts go outdated very fast, especially graphics cards! And I say this because you mentioned buying a car first. It sounds like you are younger. Take care of yourself/life first, computer comes second or third. I don't meant to beat your ear on this if you are older already. But it sounds like you are young, buy your car first and other important things in life.

My budget was towards $1600-$1800 but only due to my own time restraints of wanting to get this rig bought ASAP. And I have a car, my parents helped me through buying the car for me and I repay them $150 a week towards it. So the money I save from my PC will be going towards paying the car off.
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2) Look at the parts you picked, the best CPU and best grafix card on the market. Are you going to need all that power? I think I seen you mention you play WOW on here. If this is for mild gaming like wow, diablo 3, starcraft II, counter strike, and even newer games like borderlands 2? You absolutely DO NOT need a graphics card of that power. You can run all those games on the highest settings with a budget card like the 550ti for $120. The only thing you need a card like that for is if you are going to be playing Battlefield 3 and/or Crysis 3 next month on maximum settings. And let me tell you something about Crysis. Even in the BEST computer, most people cannot run it at 60fps.

I didnt mention I play WoW that was someone helping me, I will be looking forward to playing GW2 when the rig is done though. And my mates are looking forward to me getting the new rig so I can play such games as BF3 with them. Also some of the newer massive fps live combat games such as Planetside 2 I can see being quite load intensive but I wouldn't know. My main point is wanting to play any game that I through at my PC with the settings on at least medium quality.
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3) Again, your basic PC knowledge, how much do you really know about all those parts? I will give you a very very fine example. You picked out 1866Mhz RAM. Did you know this type of RAM is NOT plug and play? Any RAM you buy that is 1600Mhz+ is considered "overclocked". The RAM was tested to run at those speeds, but it's no guarantee. You typically have to adjust your timings/voltages to run RAM at it's recommended speeds. Whether you mean to or not, you have to get into "overclocking" and "fine tuning" if you want to get the most out of your hardware. In a custom build, you will want to get into fine tuning everything, or else you are going to have a slow, crappy computer that blue screens all the time.

I did not know that, I assumed all/most RAM was just plug in and forget etc. (aside from the obvious system stress tests etc)
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I have no qualm against the parts you picked, or Intel vs. AMD. You have the best of the best parts listed there. I just think you need to do your homework and learn more about those parts on your own before buying things like that. Here is my take on the build. The motherboard/CPU are great. Graphics card, I think it is absolute overkill especially if you don't play Crysis/BF3 which are two of the only real games that fully utilize that hardware. If you want one of the best graphics cards on the market that is less than half the price, check this out:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125414

Yeah I know I need to do my homework, hence why I'm here haha. Ive been wanting to build a custom gaming rig since probably 4th grade which is probably 10 years now. I did do some research into what parts perform betters than other, like I learnt the difference between the 3770k and the 3570k is that the i7 has 8 threads instead of 4 which is attributed to more multitasking etc.
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The Radeon 7950 is the best bang for you buck on the market right now, anyone on here is welcome to argue with me over this because $300, amazing performance, 3GB of memory, and the 384 bit will allow you to go high/max AA settings to get rid of jagged edges. Overclocked, this card EASILY competes with the 670. Also this is just the Gigabyte version but it and the MSI versions I believe have three fans, which you want because these cards run very hot. I would prefer the MSI/Sapphire over Gigabyte one.

Awesome I will look into the differences between the different makes of the 7950 smile.gif
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RAM, I honestly think you should go with 1600Mhz RAM unless you plan on dealing with timings/voltages/blue screens to get it to run at those rated speeds. You will hardly notice any difference and you will save alot of money. Also, if you do learn what you are doing you can overclock it to run at 1800Mhz+ anyway. Again, anyone is welcome to disagree with me on this as well.

I will take this into consideration, thinking about it now I want to start simple with my first PC and then build up the different customisation options later on in more advanced builds smile.gif
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Power supply, I seen someone argue getting a lower watt one. I diagree, 750 watts is the sweet spot. Why? If you upgrade your case with more fans/lights and tons of USB devices, you want those extra watts and you NEVER want to have a PSU running a full load. Second, it leaves headroom for you to do a VERY easy upgrade to your build. When you graphics become slightly dated, you can crossfire a second 7950 graphics card in your build. Additional graphics card must have a good PSU preferrably 750 watt. Note, your motherboard may or may not support crossfire, I recommend getting one that supports both Nvidia SLI and Crossfire X. Lastly, if you're getting a PSU make sure you get something that is known for being QUIET!! Some PSUs can be very noisy/annoying (I'm talking to you, Thermaltake)!

The power supply is definitely something I dont want to screw up. I will look deeper and take into consideration what has been mentioned on this thread as to what PSU i will end up buying.
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There, you have something to go by, and I think if you go with my recommendations you can safe $400+ on the build. But like I said, do you homework, make sure you want to take the plunge and consider an AMD system as well. Intel is undoubtedly the best but if you're not an enthusiast you aren't really going to enjoy it as much.

Thank you for such a detailed reply, I will definitely do my homework before anything is bought smile.gif I have 3 weeks till Ive got enough to buy everything in the build.
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