Originally Posted by SIDWULF
I love the notion of free will and I believe everything can be explained by a physical process...even our consciousness.
Were just not there yet! And if it's "Magic" then we can explain that too! Everything is magic until you can explain the process.
Free will, huh?
Consider 2 universes, universe A and universe B.
In both universes, everything is identical, qualitatively and quantitatively. Every atom, every photon, motion, distribution of matter, etc. all in the same position and doing the same thing in both universes. As is time.
In universe A, it is January 1st 2014 on planet Earth.
In universe B, it is January 1st 2014 on planet Earth.
In universe A, Jimmy eats chips on January 1st 2014 for breakfast.
In universe B, Jimmy decides to eat a can of spam instead. Wait, how? He couldn't have. Everything is identical in both universes. So he physically can't exercise free will at all. He is subject to his genes, upbringing, cognitions, the motion of atoms -> chemistry -> brain biology.
How can you use this 'free will' to manipulate anything? Your behavior is subject to desire. You act based on needs and wants (needs are wants too, IMO, but that's for another day).
Everything was pre-determined by the big bang. The distribution of matter due to the big bang occurred. Motion at the molecular level followed, gravity and random motion pulled molecules together, chemical and biological processes followed this. And none of them could have occurred in the same way, nothing in the universe would be the same if just 1 atom was in a slightly different position, could it? In other words, the big bang determined everything.
TL;DR free will is incompatible with logic.Edited by Edge Of Pain - 1/30/13 at 2:28pm