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post #11 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by abhichandra View Post

Thanks a lot for responding so quicklt.I don't want to get a GPU as of now, may be later. I never play games at all so I don't know if i need a GPU for Photoshop. As far as I know, it needs a better CPU than GPU since it uses multithreading. I might be wrong.
I don't want a phantom machine, something that does the job without hassles.
I'm more of a s/w guy, do didn't know all the h/w specs perfectly.
Also I don't think I will be overclocking it either.

 

Then I think you're looking at parts that you won't ever take full advantage of because they're designed for overclocking, such as the "K" series CPU, the Z77 motherboard, the G.SKILL Ripjaws (but of course, memory isn't all that expensive anyway these days), and the computer case - it's more designed for gaming systems.  The PSU is a bit of a rip-off for that price.  That's why I'm now recommending the Rosewill Capstone 450-M.  It crushes the CX500 and would still be overkill for any single-GPU setup that is otherwise similar to yours.

 

I'm only interested in enabling you to get the best for your money while not having that money going towards things you won't ever really use.

 

So guys, as you can see it pays to ask questions first.  I'm sorry, but I'm just not enjoying seeing you guys make recommendations when you don't really know what is wanted or needed.

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post #12 of 66
I thought capstones were high end superflower internals, am I wrong?
    
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post #13 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaze0303 View Post

I thought capstones were high end superflower internals, am I wrong?

 

You're right.  The modular Capstones are Super Flower Golden Green Pros, and the non-modular units are the Golden Greens.  Very similar, both high-end.

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post #14 of 66
Yeah if your not overclocking, look into a non k series i5 CPU.
Edited by Blaze0303 - 1/30/13 at 4:40am
    
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post #15 of 66
Just for curiosity's sake, I'm going to throw in some numbers here. He's no interest overclocking, so the processor's pulling it's rated TDP of 77w at load. Let's just say he decides down the line that he wants a decent video card for a bit of CUDA support. 650ti it is! The GTX650ti, again at stock, probably pulls something like 100-120w tdp at load. We've almost hit 200w here now. Let's add one platter drive, one SSD, and..... oh 5 fans. Let's just call that 50w for headroom's sake.

We're almost pulling 250 watts here!

a 450w PSU's allowing for 80 percent more headroom. The fact that the capstone is modular only potentially increases value, just because better cable management increases airflow, lowering your temps, and lowering your chance for "x" failure because of thermal issues.

What was that about headroom? This isn't SB-E and a 690 we're talking about here.
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post #16 of 66
Does Photoshop derive any major benefit from GPU acceleration? If so, I would think that even if OP isn't a gamer, he could benefit from a mid-range card, yes?
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post #17 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by PiOfPie View Post

Does Photoshop derive any major benefit from GPU acceleration? If so, I would think that even if OP isn't a gamer, he could benefit from a mid-range card, yes?

http://www.nvidia.com/object/adobe_photoshop.html

Typical marketing mumbo-jumbo.
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I'm so cheap
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post #18 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post


I corrected the pricing in that post to fix inconsistencies, just a heads up.

That is a bad argument when comparing PSUs from very different wattage ratings, because even a mediocre 650w will trounce the best 450w in the world. To me, a 450w that leaves almost zero headroom at all besides a single strong GPU if you don't overclock is a bad idea.

 

Ok, then I'll prove it.

 

Let's compare the power consumption of a system with a 7970, and then one with a GTX 680.  Note:  a 3770K overclocked to about 5 GHz can consume up to about 150W.  I can prove if I need to.  At stock under full load, it would only pull up to 77W at the most.  So knowing this, let's get into it because this will benefit abhichandra too:

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/amd_radeon_hd_7970_review,8.html

 

With one 7970 under full load in their system, their PSU pulled 355W from their wall outlet.  Their CPU was idling, so I'll just go ahead and add that 150W for an overclocked 3770K under full load even though it looks like he will not be overclocking.  So, with a 7970 and an overclocked 3770K pulling 150W while the 7970 is pulling 355W, that makes the PSU pulling 505W from the wall outlet.  Now, their PSU is about 85% efficient, so if the PSU is 85% efficient while pulling 505W from the wall outlet, then that means the system is only pulling 430W from the PSU.  Keep in mind that this is only if the 7970 and 3770K are completely maxed out simultaneously.  How often does that happen?  It's pretty rare.  Now, the Rosewill Capstone 450-M is like any quality-made 450W that I would recommend:  it's designed to be able to deliver 450W continuously, or "24/7" if it's ever needed.  So, even pulling 430W is nothing for this PSU.

 

Now here's the calculation for having a GTX 680 in his system:

 

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_680_sli_review,4.html

 

With one GTX 680 under full load, their PSU pulled 307W from the wall outlet.  Following the same as above, the final calculation comes out to be 388W being pulled from the PSU if the 680 and 3770K are maxed out simultaneously.

 

Taking this further, each new generation of GPUs requires less power than the previous.  The same is true for CPUs.

 

I'm not done yet:

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

As PSUs get old, they lose wattage, and while quality will hold that off, quality and overhead holds it off better. The TX650 will live longer and/or give more overhead depending on use then the 450 Rosewill can.

 

This does not affect quality-made PSUs, including the TX650.  Well it does, but it's far too negligible to be concerned about.  Don't take my word for it.  Instead, do as I did and ask any of the real PSU experts on here.  They will tell you that this is not an issue for quality-made PSUs.  That's why I recommend them.

 

Therefore, a PSU similar to the 450-M would last as long as you need it to, especially with how each new generation of GPUs and CPUs requiring less power than the previous generations.  I mean, so even if there was noticeable degradation, you would still upgrade long before it ever became an issue!  You would always be way ahead of the rate of degradation (but there isn't enough to notice, so this is a moot point).

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

While modular is nice, 450w is not. And no, I don't want to see your proof because I know if can just barely be enough for that. It just won't be good enough to do anything more, and if you have to buy a new power supply in the future because of that, then you're really going to wish you just spent that extra $20 for a PSU that had a future.

 

This is why I provided the proof anyway.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

However, since he said CPU only, then ya, a 450 would give the overhead. Consider this post an academical argument I guess.

 

For this build with only onboard video, even a quality-made 350W power supply would be enough.  For a quality-made unit, the 360W SeaSonic G Series would be overkill, but it's not modular.  Again, that degradation is practically a non-issue with quality-made PSUs.

 

Here are more thoughts about the kind of PSUs we are arguing about here:

 

http://www.overclock.net/t/928113/a-message-to-the-community-on-enthusiast-power-supplies


Edited by TwoCables - 1/29/13 at 11:12pm
It's a computer!
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Thermaltake Frio Win 7 Home Premium x64 SP1 Retail AOC G2460PG (24" 1920 x 1080 144Hz G-SYNC) Filco Majestouch 104-key Cherry MX Blues w/NKRO 
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Corsair HX650 (Bronze, ordered on 12-12-2009) CM 690 Intellimouse Optical (1.1A) 1000Hz polling rate Basic, but premium round 
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It's a computer!
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250 GB Samsung 840 EVO (OS) 3 TB Toshiba P300 (storage) Samsung SH-S243N 24x DVD Burner Samsung SH-S203N 20X DVD Burner 
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Thermaltake Frio Win 7 Home Premium x64 SP1 Retail AOC G2460PG (24" 1920 x 1080 144Hz G-SYNC) Filco Majestouch 104-key Cherry MX Blues w/NKRO 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair HX650 (Bronze, ordered on 12-12-2009) CM 690 Intellimouse Optical (1.1A) 1000Hz polling rate Basic, but premium round 
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post #19 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Syryll View Post

Just for curiosity's sake, I'm going to throw in some numbers here. He's no interest overclocking, so the processor's pulling it's rated TDP of 77w at load. Let's just say he decides down the line that he wants a decent video card for a bit of CUDA support. 650ti it is! The GTX650ti, again at stock, probably pulls something like 100-120w tdp at load. We've almost hit 200w here now. Let's add one platter drive, one SSD, and..... oh 5 fans. Let's just call that 50w for headroom's sake.

We're almost pulling 250 watts here!

a 450w PSU's allowing for 80 percent more headroom. The fact that the capstone is modular only potentially increases value, just because better cable management increases airflow, lowering your temps, and lowering your chance for "x" failure because of thermal issues.

What was that about headroom? This isn't SB-E and a 690 we're talking about here.

TDP is not power draw and vice versa, your variables are wrong. Also, when all your PSU cables are behind the Motherboard tray like would be the case in any HAF case, modular means nothing but convinience of removing said PSU, as all cables are already out of the way.

And headroom always matters, in part due to PSUs losing capability over time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PiOfPie View Post

Does Photoshop derive any major benefit from GPU acceleration? If so, I would think that even if OP isn't a gamer, he could benefit from a mid-range card, yes?

It does, and that is why I suggested maybe getting a reasonable nVidia card for CUDA.

See two cables? It pays to anticipate what they are doing and recommend things that could help.
Edited by KyadCK - 1/29/13 at 11:24pm
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post #20 of 66
i5 3570/i7 3770
b75/h77 motherboard
8 - 16gb ram
120/128gb ssd
1 - 2tb hdd
~400w psu

as for a graphics card, based on your usage, the intel hd4000 would be more than fine.
not gonna get into it, but cuda won't benefit your photography work.. photoshop uses the mercury engine.

i can put together a more detailed list if you like with specific components.

KyadCK, stop arguing.. it's been thoroughly explained that he does not need a 650w psu!

see KyadCK, it pays to stick to what you know thumb.gif
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be quiet!
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