Overclock.net › Forums › Software, Programming and Coding › Networking & Security › Feedback on real world working Tech's? Going back to school questions?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Feedback on real world working Tech's? Going back to school questions? - Page 2

post #11 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by KGB7 View Post

Really?

rolleyes.gif

He will earn a paycheck as he learns the basics as he works on computers. At the same time he will be going to school and earning a better degree.

I worked at Microcenter as a Tech for a year. I learned nothing because i already knew what i was doing, but it put food on the table, paid bills, and gave me time to find a better job.

A job is a job. If you never worked in retail it will give you many lessons that you will never acquire on any job. Retail is a cut throat business, its not the bottom of the barrel as working as a janitor, but you do grow a thicker skin.

And retail is NOT always a dead end job. If you put in the years, time, long hours, you can ended up as a manager, which can lead to corporate position. Or much sooner if you kiss right asses.
Home Depot managers have nice houses, drive nice cars, have families with several children. Yet they work in retail.

Show me a retail supervisor or some sort of mediocre management position person who lives in a shoe box. Go on, i would love to meet such person.

When i worked in Microcenter, there are sales people who have worked for the company for 20 years plus, making a good living and supporting their family at the same time. Its just like being a car salesman.
Even Donald Trump is nothing more then a salesman that you will find at your local retail store, but he knows how to sell snow to Eskimos, and that is why he is rich.

Or how about car dealerships. Walk in to service department, and half the people are in their 50s and 60s. With kids who are in college. All paid by so called retail money.

Retail is retail. no matter where you work. If you work on commission, then you are working in retail. Some retail jobs bring in more coin then others.

.
How many general managers are there in a store? How many employees? wink.gif

In addition, there's more of a ceiling. A store mangers can only make so much. If you go to a big firm, everyone who's not junior is already making as much as a store manager...so it's only up from there!

Retail can lead you up to management and maybe into corporate.... but the short-cut is simply going to college. In fact, many higher-level or even entry positions require some college degree even if in an unrelated field. i.e. My wife has a psychology degree back was working a Lehman Bros.... $55K base with a $10-20K annual bonus before she left them. That's an entry level position.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StatikGP View Post

College is almost useless in the IT industry, its all about certifications and real world experience in the field. Take it from someone who's been a Network Administrator for 10 years making over 75k a year with zero college degrees. I've worked for several different companies. college was never even mentioned in the interviews or application process.
Not quite true.... college lets you skip ahead.

Certifications are nice and all... they prove that you can do that one thing well. College on the other hand proves that you have more depth. The guys with college degrees can generally learn to do the jobs of the guys with certs... and more.

i.e. You don't get into HPC, GPGPU, Big Data, financial software, quantitative analysis, etc on certificates alone.
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
post #12 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by StatikGP View Post

College is almost useless in the IT industry, its all about certifications and real world experience in the field. Take it from someone who's been a Network Administrator for 10 years making over 75k a year with zero college degrees. I've worked for several different companies. college was never even mentioned in the interviews or application process.

this is almost kinda true , depending on the job

and to the OP .. i was checking the link of the classes from the AAC ... its not worth it . in the end you just paid for a diploma of stuff you already know lol (asuming you know some computer stuff ) , i had a friend of mine that took one of those "classes" for one year , for computer programing .. in the end he just learned a little bit of HTML intro to Java and some SQL stuff and visual basic ... he spent lots of money and still cant find a job

... i would give you this tip , go with something business related ... its the safe bet these days and faster to learn too , Accounting was my path , spent like 5-6 years ( yeah i was spending too much time with videogames and all that college stuff lol) , and it wasnt worth it if you are not going to get a CPA , i could have save lots of money by going to one of those institutes and learn the accounting cycle and how to fill Taxes , business and individual .... macro and micro economics and u are set lol
My Trusty PC
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 1366 950 EVGA Classified 3 EVGA 580 gtx G.skill Pi  
OSKeyboardPowerCase
W7 ultimate 64bit Logitec G510 Corsair  Haf X 
Mouse
Deathadder 
  hide details  
Reply
My Trusty PC
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 1366 950 EVGA Classified 3 EVGA 580 gtx G.skill Pi  
OSKeyboardPowerCase
W7 ultimate 64bit Logitec G510 Corsair  Haf X 
Mouse
Deathadder 
  hide details  
Reply
post #13 of 29
If you want $60K+ starting.... get a degree in finance combined with physics/math/computer science.... become a quantitative analyst.
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
post #14 of 29
yeah , thats kinda hardcore lol
My Trusty PC
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 1366 950 EVGA Classified 3 EVGA 580 gtx G.skill Pi  
OSKeyboardPowerCase
W7 ultimate 64bit Logitec G510 Corsair  Haf X 
Mouse
Deathadder 
  hide details  
Reply
My Trusty PC
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 1366 950 EVGA Classified 3 EVGA 580 gtx G.skill Pi  
OSKeyboardPowerCase
W7 ultimate 64bit Logitec G510 Corsair  Haf X 
Mouse
Deathadder 
  hide details  
Reply
post #15 of 29
Personally... I got a Computer Engineering Degree and Economic degree in 5 years..... started at $40K and in 8 years making over 3-4 times as much....
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
post #16 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

How many general managers are there in a store? How many employees? wink.gif

In addition, there's more of a ceiling. A store mangers can only make so much. If you go to a big firm, everyone who's not junior is already making as much as a store manager...so it's only up from there!

Retail can lead you up to management and maybe into corporate.... but the short-cut is simply going to college. In fact, many higher-level or even entry positions require some college degree even if in an unrelated field. i.e. My wife has a psychology degree back was working a Lehman Bros.... $55K base with a $10-20K annual bonus before she left them. That's an entry level position.
Not quite true.... college lets you skip ahead.

Certifications are nice and all... they prove that you can do that one thing well. College on the other hand proves that you have more depth. The guys with college degrees can generally learn to do the jobs of the guys with certs... and more.

i.e. You don't get into HPC, GPGPU, Big Data, financial software, quantitative analysis, etc on certificates alone.


If you start at the bottom of Google, what are you chances of becoming a CEO of Google? And if i start at the bottom of BestBuy, what are my chances of becoming a CEO of Best buy?
Answer is simple. We both have same amount of chance. Because there are many employees in the company who have same amount of chance of becoming a CEO in either company. But, there is no guarantee that either one of us will become a CEO.

How many CEOs and Managers are there in Google? Just as many as there are at BestBuy. Point is, there is a ceiling in everything.
Even if you become a President of United States, you are a President at the best for 8 years. Afterwords, its down the hill from there. you no longer a president, now you are an ex President. You cant become a president of the World or Universe. You can be a Mayor of a city if you wanted to, but i dont know any president that has done so. Thus you have hit a ceiling.


Now lest say you wanted to stay with IT only for the rest of your life, and you wanted to work for Baker & McKenzie ( law firm) for the rest of your life. Guess what, you will hit a ceiling at some point.


And yes, having a Univ degree does help. I cant recall how many times i was told during an interview with a surprise; " I see you have a Masters from University so and so." At the same time, if you become a plumber and start your own business, you can make a lot more money then most College grads. There is also no guarantee you will be successful at running a plumbing business with a College degree.
Edited by KGB7 - 2/8/13 at 6:52pm
post #17 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by KGB7 View Post

If you start at the bottom of Google, what are you chances of becoming a CEO of Google? And if i start at the bottom of BestBuy, what are my chances of becoming a CEO of Best buy?
Answer is simple. We both have same amount of chance. Because there are many employees in the company who have same amount of chance of becoming a CEO in either company. But, there is no guarantee that either one of us will become a CEO.

How many CEOs and Managers are there in Google? Just as many as there are at BestBuy. Point is, there is a ceiling in everything.
Even if you become a President of United States, you are a President at the best for 8 years. Afterwords, its down the hill from there. you no longer a president, now you are an ex President. You cant become a president of the World or Universe. You can be a Mayor of a city if you wanted to, but i dont know any president that has done so. Thus you have hit a ceiling.


Now lest say you wanted to stay with IT only for the rest of your life, and you wanted to work for Baker & McKenzie ( law firm) for the rest of your life. Guess what, you will hit a ceiling at some point.


And yes, having a Univ degree does help. I cant recall how many times i was told during an interview with a surprise; " I see you have a Masters from University so and so." At the same time, if you become a plumber and start your own business, you can make a lot more money then most College grads. There is also no guarantee you will be successful at running a plumbing business with a College degree.

Actually, that's not quite true.... in Google, there is more upward mobility. In technical careers, you can really demonstrate your skills through your work and papers. "Hey look, I design a method to allow a NoSQL cluster to span the planet." How many people can do that?

Yes, there's a ceiling for everything... but in a "better" company or good degree, the ceiling is higher. It's less hard to climb the ladder.

Having a degree in the field that you are pursing is generally better... so your plumber example is moot.
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
post #18 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by StatikGP View Post

College is almost useless in the IT industry, its all about certifications and real world experience in the field. Take it from someone who's been a Network Administrator for 10 years making over 75k a year with zero college degrees. I've worked for several different companies. college was never even mentioned in the interviews or application process.

This is an interesting point, experience is key in a field as agile as IT, no doubt about that, everything else comes after.

Though some employers will look for a degree to demonstrate a more "rounded" skill base, commitment and thought process.

The comment about a degree letting you skip steps is also true to an extent

My experience so far has been

1: Experience
2: "Special/Interesting skills" - see below
3: Certs
4: Uni - Though I'd actually say Uni and Certs are equal third.

Don't discount impressing the employer with other things too, for example, I'm quite young but have accumulated a lot of work experience and a few certs and am currently in Uni.
Edited by dushan24 - 2/9/13 at 4:52pm
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i7 860 Asus P7P55D-E Pro MSI GTX560 Ti TwinFrozr II MSI GTX560 Ti TwinFrozr II 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Corsair 8GB DDR3 OCZ Vertex 3 Western Digital Caviar Black Western Digital Caviar Green 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Samsung 840 Pro Lite-On 24x DVD-RW CoolerMaster V8 Windows 8.1 Professional 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Debian 7.1 Samsung S22B350H Samsung S22B350H Samsung S22B350H 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine II Corsair HX850 CoolerMaster Storm Enforcer Logitech M500 
Mouse PadAudio
Razer Goliathus Microsoft LifeChat LX 3000 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel Core i7 860 Asus P7P55D-E Pro MSI GTX560 Ti TwinFrozr II MSI GTX560 Ti TwinFrozr II 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Corsair 8GB DDR3 OCZ Vertex 3 Western Digital Caviar Black Western Digital Caviar Green 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Samsung 840 Pro Lite-On 24x DVD-RW CoolerMaster V8 Windows 8.1 Professional 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Debian 7.1 Samsung S22B350H Samsung S22B350H Samsung S22B350H 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine II Corsair HX850 CoolerMaster Storm Enforcer Logitech M500 
Mouse PadAudio
Razer Goliathus Microsoft LifeChat LX 3000 
  hide details  
Reply
post #19 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by dushan24 View Post

This is an interesting point, experience is key in a field as agile as IT, no doubt about that, everything else comes after.

Though some employers will look for a degree to demonstrate a more "rounded" skill base, commitment and thought process.

The comment about a degree letting you skip steps is also true to an extent

My experience so far has been

1: Experience
2: "Special/Interesting skills" - see below
3: Certs
4: Uni - Though I'd actually say Uni and Certs are equal third.

Don't discount impressing the employer with other things too, for example, I'm quite young but have accumulated a lot of work experience and a few certs and am currently in Uni.

College degrees are absolutely higher than certs... because anyone can pick up a cert. Certs are great for a very specific admin position. If you want a position that naturally grows, you'll want degree. Go check the Intel, AMD, or any major tech companies hiring pages.... CS, CE, EE, etc are base requirement.

In fact, most people won't get past HR without a college degree in larger companies (most Fortune 500).
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
Once again...
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
post #20 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

College degrees are absolutely higher than certs... because anyone can pick up a cert. Certs are great for a very specific admin position. If you want a position that naturally grows, you'll want degree. Go check the Intel, AMD, or any major tech companies hiring pages.... CS, CE, EE, etc are base requirement.

In fact, most people won't get past HR without a college degree in larger companies (most Fortune 500).


I agree. The only management position you might get at a Fortune 500 company, or in most companies that arent even close to 500 with out College degree, is a Custodian Engineer Manager.


Few small management positions can be achieved by taking classes at local College, that certify you in that specific Management field. But you will be taking night classes many times over to get more and more certificates. At the same time, others will get the position before you. Thus you will always be held back.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Networking & Security
Overclock.net › Forums › Software, Programming and Coding › Networking & Security › Feedback on real world working Tech's? Going back to school questions?