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[PG] Valve Sued In Germany Over Game Ownership - Page 45

post #441 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

write EU off till they fix the error in their ways

How is it an error for a country to actually protect it's citizen's consumer rights?

rolleyes.gif
 
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post #442 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheezman View Post

How is it an error for a country to actually protect it's citizen's consumer rights?

rolleyes.gif

It interferes with corporations making money therefore it is unamerican, unholy, ungodly, inhuman, unethical and wrong.


Corporations > People
Profit of corporations > Rights of people


It's the American Way™
    
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post #443 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwnedINC View Post

That was kinda my point though, it's not really up to valve whether or not these games are tradable.
Valve can provide a means to do it, but it's not UP to them whether they are*

That's just redundant. If Valve lose this then publishers have no choice too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OwnedINC View Post

I'm not so concerned about the corporations, but the end result of freely trading your games is no different than piracy.

Also I wouldn't be surprised if to counter this publishers just decide to charge 100euros a game instead. *which is my real concern*

Complete rubbish. Selling your games is absolutely nothing like piracy. Your arguments can now be disregarded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

You are missing what I am saying. I'm not saying they would stop selling to the EU. I'm saying what I think they should do is remove any PHYSICAL PRESENCE they have in the EU (so the EU can't come arrest them or take their servers) and allow people in the EU to go to steam.com and if THEY WANT TO, continue to buy games, download, and play them ... just like normal.

Then what they can do is tell the EU GOVERNMENT to "get bent" (since they don't have a physical presence there). Then the EU GOVERNMENT will either have to TRY (and will most likely fail) to take legal action against them in an international court (which doesn't always work, hence my example of how the EU has blown off the US with extradiction) or block steam.com. If the EU Government does the latter, then the EU customers of Steam will blame the EU Government and NOT Steam for preventing them from playing what they paid for.

Yeah because that's not a totally childish outlook. And no, people would blame Steam for being willfully negligent and purposefully trying to avoid local laws. It's not going to happen. You are living a fantasy pipe dream taht Steama re going to conform to your jaded opinion on reselling licences to games.

Whether Steam have any physical presence in the EU or not, they still do business there and still have to adhere to local law. It's that simple.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

No what I think he was trying to say was that Valve could leave and give everyone the finger and write EU off till they fix the error in their ways..

Really if Valve wanted to they could cut off all access to steam for all EU users including access to the games they bought and retreat back to America. EU could try and sue them all they want on their own land, but Valve isn't located in the EU and it would be impossible to force them to pay a cent. America isn't the most fond of extraditing, and to sue them from American court would be pretty hard given the fact they didn't do anything wrong here. Hell I could go so some African County and kill a couple of people and flee back to America, and get in no trouble. While this will never happen, EU should still understand that retaliation would be bad for its users and they would only have themselves to blame for being so one minded.

WOW. Sorry, but that is very telling of how childish and immature you are. You think you could kill people and then the US government wouldn't ship you off to face justice, or even put you in prison yourself? Yeah, ok.

There is nothing that the EU is doing that needs to "fix their ways". However, given your comment on killing people, I think it's obvious you need ot fix your ways.
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post #444 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpsgc View Post

It interferes with corporations making money therefore it is unamerican, unholy, ungodly, inhuman, unethical and wrong.


Corporations > People
Profit of corporations > Rights of people


It's the American Way™

Oh, thanks for the clarification!

thumb.gif
 
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post #445 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheezman View Post

How is it an error for a country to actually protect it's citizen's consumer rights?

rolleyes.gif

How is it fair to treat a corporation unjustly?

Bullying is Bullying no matter what.

Steam made it pretty clear what you were getting with that services. All EU law states is that you can sell digital games, not that a company has to provide a way to do so. You can get games digitally without going through any services like stream or Origin, nobody is forcing you to use it.

Simple as that
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post #446 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

No what I think he was trying to say was that Valve could leave and give everyone the finger and write EU off till they fix the error in their ways..

Really if Valve wanted to they could cut off all access to steam for all EU users including access to the games they bought and retreat back to America. EU could try and sue them all they want on their own land, but Valve isn't located in the EU and it would be impossible to force them to pay a cent. America isn't the most fond of extraditing, and to sue them from American court would be pretty hard given the fact they didn't do anything wrong here. Hell I could go so some African County and kill a couple of people and flee back to America, and get in no trouble. While this will never happen, EU should still understand that retaliation would be bad for its users and they would only have themselves to blame for being so one minded.


As long as valve is doing business in eu they have to follow their laws.
And even if valve will pull out of eu, there will come another company to provide same service (and follow the law).
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

How is it fair to treat a corporation unjustly?

Bullying is Bullying no matter what.

Steam made it pretty clear what you were getting with that services. All EU law states is that you can sell digital games, not that a company has to provide a way to do so. You can get games digitally without going through any services like stream or Origin, nobody is forcing you to use it.

Simple as that

Go through few pages back to the very first one andyou will see that this is the reason of the lawsuit....
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post #447 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubers View Post

WOW. Sorry, but that is very telling of how childish and immature you are. You think you could kill people and then the US government wouldn't ship you off to face justice, or even put you in prison yourself? Yeah, ok.

There is nothing that the EU is doing that needs to "fix their ways". However, given your comment on killing people, I think it's obvious you need ot fix your ways.

For one it is a example, maybe your to closed minded to get that.
Also I said a African Country, as in one with no extradition law in place. America isn't going to extradite you if they have little to no proof that you killed anyone. Really it needs to be 100%, trust me wouldn't be hard to get away with something like that in a country like that. Regardless on how sick minded it is.

Also if you didn't get it, it was a example to show how hard it is to work with different country's.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mechati View Post

Go through few pages back to the very first one andyou will see that this is the reason of the lawsuit....


I was clearly stating the current law, I know what they are getting sued for. But the Law never stated that they needed to provide a way, and Hopefully Valve will win because it should be valve's choice whether or not to do it. If Valve loses any app store can be sued for the same thing.

How will devs make money when everyone is buying your used game or app when they could buy the real thing for a few bucks more?
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post #448 of 503
How is it fair for the law to say that you can resell digital licences, but Steam refuses to comply? They have no right to do that. There is no bullying going on. It's the law. The law wasn't made just to screw Steam, it was to stop customers from being screwed. Steam have been screwing people for years. thumb.gif

EDIT:

Answer to the "how will devs make money?" question?

Look at consoles. Biggest preowned amrket... biggest grossing for publishers.

Of course, the PC is magically different and a preowned market on the PC will spell the doom for everything ever.

And the law says that you can resell your licences and therefore games, THEREFORE, it DOES mean Valve have to allow this. They do not have a choice.
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post #449 of 503
^ No I don't need help I just view Life in a different way then you do.

I View all intelligent life to be worth equally, if you can get the chair for killing a human then it should be the same for killing a chimp. We are both animals are we not? Only thing we have over everything else is developed vocal chords and a more Intelligent brain. Really we are nothing more then a cadaver holding your brain(you). But the way most people see it, you can take a persons brain and stick it in a cow and then kill it and most wouldn't see a single problem with it. Or if you were to kill a body with a brain dead mind are you actually killing someone? No because they are already dead, Nothing about them other then the cadaver they left behind is left. Yet if you were to kill a live brain dead cadaver in most nations you would be tried for murder. Stick a monkey brain into a human body and then kill it, should you get the same punishment as killing a monkey on its own?

So I can kill a brain dead human and get the chair but if I killed the smartest ape I would get nothing but time. That is logic I don't get
Any intelligent life deserves as much rights as we do. Yet they don't
Or I could harm someone to the point their mind is severely messed up yet they don't die and you still only get time?

Killing doesn't make anyone sick minded, people kill things all the time. Creatures have been killing each other for ages, yet we hold ourselves to be so much better then any other life form it's sickening. While killing is wrong don't get me wrong, but a human life in general is worth no more then any other intelligent creature regardless if you like it or not.
Edited by DzillaXx - 2/3/13 at 8:16am
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Windows 7 Home Premium  Logitech K400 Corsair CX500 nMEDIAPC 6000B 
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Polk Audio CS1 Center Polk Audio PSW10 
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post #450 of 503
Can people resell their mmos over there?
Kara
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Kara
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