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[ZDNET] Surface Pro versus MacBook Air: Who's being dishonest with storage space? - Page 8

post #71 of 87
This whole line of discussion is almost completely pointless....

Where are we even going with this?
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post #72 of 87
I iterated a point, and then it seems it was reiterated in a different way each time for about an additional 4-5 times. This thread is traveling in circles with people calling each other 'kids/teenagers'.

I would love for this thread to be back on topic as I personally enjoy going into stores and playing around with the Windows 8 tabs/ultraportables. I think one of these SP8s would be an absolute powerhouse with a capacitive stylus. You would get handwriting/drawing, and then everything else you need out of Windows in a tablet-sized package. I for one would love to use my MBA like a SP8 tab.
 
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post #73 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzleBoy View Post

Where are we even going with this?

lol.


As usual there's like ten mini-arguments happening but as for mine; the whole concept of the tablet ebbing into the ultra portable space as does the SP and the subsequent marketing of MS directly comparing -be it denoted as a "hybrid" to a tactile-feedback scissor switch keyboard, traditional clamshell layout of a laptop-netbook-ultrabook-esque MBA does not make for direct comparisons barring a spec sheet.

The fact that they are even marketing in such a manner is IMO such a technique as to out maneuver-in marketing terms the MBA and attempts to draw revenue away from such purchases and thereby implying that the SP is better fitting product to the layman.
Edited by Blindrage606 - 2/8/13 at 12:28pm
 
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post #74 of 87
Why are you ignoring the simple fact that the only reason they are being compared in this article is for their similar usable storage space?

The point of the article is to compare usable storage space for the user between the two (as well as point out the pure hypocrisy of people trying to call MS untruthful/worthy of being sued due to their formatting) and nothing more.
Edited by GrizzleBoy - 2/8/13 at 12:38pm
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post #75 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindrage606 View Post

lol.


As usual there's like ten mini-arguments happening but as for mine; the whole concept of the tablet ebbing into the ultra portable space as does the SP and the subsequent marketing of MS directly comparing -be it denoted as a "hybrid" to a tactile-feedback scissor switch keyboard, traditional clamshell layout of a laptop-netbook-ultrabook-esque MBA does not make for direct comparisons barring a spec sheet.

The fact that they are even marketing in such a manner is IMO such a technique as to out maneuver-in marketing terms the MBA and attempts to draw revenue away from such purchases and thereby implying that the SP is better fitting product to the layman.

Your entire argument is essentially an assumption. You have absolutely no facts to back up anything you've said about product marketing on either the Apple or Microsoft side. You have no idea how Microsoft is marketing their product because you do not work for them - you're only speaking to your own perceptions and opinions. People obviously comprehend available information differently, which is the crux of the issue and the crux of this thread as a whole. You can't "bar" a spec sheet and dismiss it as an invalid piece of evidence when speaking to the Surface Pro. That's just ignorant.

Some people see the Surface Pro as a direct competitor to Ultrabooks because of its guts. Others consider it a direct competitor to tablets due strictly to the form factor. Neither is correct - it is a hybrid, and the creator of the device himself stated it as such. In whatever way people twist that idea - that the Surface Pro is a hybrid device, and being marketed as such, and NOT as one form exclusively - is doing just that; twisting the facts.

The Surface Pro is a hybrid device that does not accomplish the perfection of being a full-fledged, full-OS-driven laptop or a tablet, but rather, can provide the experience of both, with some compromises.

Whether or not it meets one's needs is irrelevant to the way one perceives its marketing. If this device meets your needs (i'll be picking mine up tomorrow morning), then you know what you're getting. There is no point in trying to pretend that anyone has to be the people's hero and defend the ignorance of prospective "casual" buyers who don't know what they're getting - because those people obviously aren't the target audience for this device, considering the plethora of available options out in the market already. If you're getting a Surface Pro, and you've waited for it - you know its positives and negatives. That's all there is to it.

EDIT, from the Surface Pro official website (http://www.microsoft.com/Surface/en-us/surface-with-windows-8-pro/home):



Does that say, "tablet PC?!?!" Indeed it does. Anyone seeing this device as strictly a tablet or comparing it strictly to tablets is choosing to ignore available facts/marketing, and is refusing to distinguish "opinions and perceptions" from, "facts."
Edited by jcde7ago - 2/8/13 at 12:56pm
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post #76 of 87
Ugh who cares about this silly space comparision? Just choose the product you prefer because it is more useful and efficient for you. And I agree that the Surface compares to the MacBook Air.

But really if Microsoft had done a good job of advertising like Samsung did with their Galaxy S3, we might have started seeing as many Surfaces as there are small form laptops and iPads. I went to NYC a few months ago and EVERYWHERE I saw the galaxy S3. It was ridiculous. And the "cool" factor that everyone has the impression of the S3.
Edited by iEATu - 2/8/13 at 1:00pm
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post #77 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcde7ago View Post

Your entire argument is essentially an assumption. You have absolutely no facts to back up anything you've said about product marketing on either the Apple or Microsoft side. You have no idea how Microsoft is marketing their product because you do not work for them - you're only speaking to your own perceptions and opinions. People obviously comprehend available information differently, which is the crux of the issue and the crux of this thread as a whole. You can't "bar" a spec sheet and dismiss it as an invalid piece of evidence when speaking to the Surface Pro. That's just ignorant.

Some people see the Surface Pro as a direct competitor to Ultrabooks because of its guts. Others consider it a direct competitor to tablets due strictly to the form factor. Neither is correct - it is a hybrid, and the creator of the device himself stated it as such. In whatever way people twist that idea - that the Surface Pro is a hybrid device, and being marketed as such, and NOT as one form exclusively - is doing just that; twisting the facts.

The Surface Pro is a hybrid device that does not accomplish the perfection of being a full-fledged, full-OS-driven laptop or a tablet, but rather, can provide the experience of both, with some compromises.

Whether or not it meets one's needs is irrelevant to the way one perceives its marketing. If this device meets your needs (i'll be picking mine up tomorrow morning), then you know what you're getting. There is no point in trying to pretend that anyone has to be the people's hero and defend the ignorance of prospective "casual" buyers who don't know what they're getting - because those people obviously aren't the target audience for this device, considering the plethora of available options out in the market already. If you're getting a Surface Pro, and you've waited for it - you know its positives and negatives. That's all there is to it.

I'll just use the bold face as a starting point:

Sure, I don't work for the MS Marketing team but with experience in marketing it's an inexact science and transmission based on perception. We can argue in circles for this one, but you mentioned this already.

Why can't I invalidate a quantitative source of information on a qualitative means of measure and concept? In fact, on the issues I'm addressing such as human interactions, input methods, touch vs amounts of keyboard feedback tactility, etc, with said devices, one should do so.

A labeled form of market creation to form a niche within a niche, by the creator. Create buzz, PR, etc.

Exactly these types of "compromises" that dictate a different category and not comparing an MBA or any such laptop-netbook-ultraportable in fear of not making apples-to-apples comparisons.

I can imagine a few instances, say a corporate buyer or a casual user thinking high end. SP cannot sustain itself on an enthusiast market.

Lastly, shouldn't we be ultimately comparing the SP against other "hybrids"?
Edited by Blindrage606 - 2/8/13 at 1:18pm
 
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post #78 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindrage606 View Post

I'll just use the bold face as a starting point:

Sure, I don't work for the MS Marketing team but with experience in marketing it's an inexact science and transmission based on perception. We can argue in circles for this one, but you mentioned this already.

Why can't I invalidate a quantitative source of information on a qualitative means of measure and concept? In fact, on the issues I'm addressing such as human interactions, input methods, touch vs amounts of keyboard feedback tactility, etc, with said devices, one should do so.

A labeled form of market creation to form a niche within a niche, by the creator. Create buzz, PR, etc.

Exactly these types of "compromises" that dictate a different category and not comparing an MBA or any such laptop-netbook-ultraportable in fear of not making apples-to-apples comparisons.

I can imagine a few instances, say a corporate buyer or a casual user thinking high end. SP cannot sustain itself on an enthusiast market.

Lastly, shouldn't we be ultimately comparing the SP against other "hybrids"?

You didn't actually say anything new - you still fail to comprehend that your personal perception and opinion of the device does not invalidate stated facts that the manufacturer has made regarding the way they actually ARE marketing their product and to whom.

And yes, we should be comparing the Surface Pro to other hybrids - too bad there aren't really any other devices to compare a full-fledged/full-OS driven, Ultrabook/Tablet hybrid to. And if that were the case, there shouldn't be any outrage regarding the storage "issue," since those outcries stem from a failed comparison of the Surface Pro directly to ARM-based tablets.
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post #79 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindrage606 View Post

Lastly, shouldn't we be ultimately comparing the SP against other "hybrids"?

This one sentence alone outlines just how much you've managed to completely actually miss the point of the article. Did you actually read it?

As you've seemingly refused to realise, the reason the comparison was done was not to compare the essence of the devices across separate form factors. Its not about functionality or anything like that.

It was to outline how in the midst of all the outrage and broo haa haa about the Surface not providing the full amount of storage and how they should be sued for false advertising and rabble rabble rabble, there is another company with a product boasting similar storage space that does more to "deceive" in terms of available storage.

It was just a piece to show how hypocritical the industry can decide to be when it wants to make headlines, as well as a showcase of how malleable and squishy the consumer brain is when it comes to reacting to thise headlines.


Once again, this line of argument is almost completely pointless/irrelevant.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coachmark2 View Post

Yes. My brother has a MacBook pro and he wonders why when I send him a 38 megabyte file, it takes up 41 or 42 megs of his hard drive... rolleyes.gif Apple is being extremely dishonest about the space in that way.

Yes, I know it's just a different way of reporting it, but it is still cooking the books in my opinion.

In all due respect apple have reported the "real" measure when displaying the amount of space on their HDD's. It's windows that reads GiB as GB that makes the 1TB show up as only 930+ GB," a 1TB drive is indeed actually a 1 terabyte drive that = 1000 GB."

I am not going to go into the math of MegaByte vs MibiByte here....but apple actually displays the real measure of storage space, both measures are real it's just that on measure TB (eg(Terabyte)) will look smaller than the measure of TiB.. It's windows that uses the more misleading measure to read HDD space.

so basically

windows sees the 1 TByte drive as 931.32 GByte, when it should read 931.32 GiByte, because of the GiB being bigger than the GByte it actually is a 1TB drive that = 1000 GigaBytes but windows mixes up the measure..
Edited by smash_mouth01 - 2/8/13 at 2:14pm
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Overclock.net › Forums › Mobile Computing Forum › Tablets ›  [ZDNET] Surface Pro versus MacBook Air: Who's being dishonest with storage space?