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post #791 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

If I sell a product for $1k and every single one I build sells, guess what? It was worth $1k. Economics.

Indeed, and for those future generations, you will continue to pay $1k+ for the luxury of having a fast single-GPU card.

10 years ago, this guy was the king of the hill. It cost $400. You might be ok with spending a grand on a graphics card, but once you look at THE MARKET, you realize how absurd that price really is for what you're getting. If the GTX 690 didn't exist, I might be singing a different tune right now, but it does exist. There is no way that nvidia is losing money on the Titan. Nvidia is making a killing on each card sold. Guaranteed.
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post #792 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forceman View Post

Is the alternative - no new card at all - actually better? They will eventually sell a GTX 780, and if it is 20% faster than the GTX 680 they will probably sell it at the high-end price point, which is $500. The Titan doesn't change that. There may be a Titan 2 that also costs $1000, but your assumption is that they could/should have sold the GK110 chip as the $500 card. But that was never going to happen. So your choices are GK104/GK114 at $500 and nothing else, or GK104/GK114 at $500 and GK110/GK120 at $1000. How are those fundamentally different? You still get X performance at $500.

Your complaint is basically that Nvidia should be selling the GK110 as the GTX 680 but there is no indication that was ever going to happen, besides a bunch of Internet wishing.

This! Not sure why people aren't getting that.
 
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post #793 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Murlocke View Post

I really doubt NVIDIA is making much off each Titan sell... That's the problem with this whole logic. Look at the specs, their profit margins on Titan are probably smaller then 680s at $500.

You guys think NVIDIA makes these cards for $200 and then sells them for $1000? tongue.gif

There's no way to know for sure... but considering that NVIDIA made money off of the GTX 580 I doubt they aren't making a decent margin off these things (though this should have a much higher cost of production than the 580 due to the extra VRAM, fancy HSF, and maybe the cost of 28nm at this point in time).

If it actually cost NVIDIA over $800 to produce these things then the price is justified, though I'd be willing to bet everything against that.
Edited by Usario - 2/19/13 at 11:16pm
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post #794 of 1636
This sort reminds me of the whole tethering fee that they tacked onto Apple Users. Who knew they would so readily pay for what was once free and now its starting to become standard. It could be a dangerous slope...?
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post #795 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Pistol View Post

Indeed, and for those future generations, you will continue to pay $1k+ for the luxury of having a fast single-GPU card.

10 years ago, this guy was the king of the hill. It cost $400. You might be ok with spending a grand on a graphics card, but once you look at THE MARKET, you realize how absurd that price really is for what you're getting. If the GTX 690 didn't exist, I might be singing a different tune right now, but it does exist. There is no way that nvidia is losing money on the Titan. Nvidia is making a killing on each card sold. Guaranteed.

Let me add to my quote so you can better understand:

If I sell a product for $1k and every single one I build sells, guess what? It was worth $1k. If I want to sell 250,000 of my product (i.e. mainstream) and only 10k buy it for $1k I need to lower the price to what more people can afford (which for video cards has always been around the $250-$500 area). That is not going to change regardless of whether or not there is a boutique card at the far extreme of the spectrum.
post #796 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by deafboy View Post

And guess what, that's what the extra $2500 gets you. lol.

You can't compare the 580 to the Titan. Just not even the same level

If the Titan was phasing out t he 680 or even the 780 then sure. But it's not. Titan will remain their top single GPU in the consumer market for a while. This has already been discussed.

Not on the same level??? rolleyes.gif

Die size: GTX 580 - 520mm
Die size: Titan - 551mm

Both use 384-bit memory bus

Both have a 250(ish)-watt TDP

Both cards are 10.5 inches long

Both cards use 6+8 pin power connectors

GTX 580 - GF110
Titan - GK110


I think the GTX 580 does compare to the Titan just fine. tongue.gif
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post #797 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

Let me add to my quote so you can better understand:

If I sell a product for $1k and every single one I build sells, guess what? It was worth $1k. If I want to sell 250,000 of my product (i.e. mainstream) and only 10k buy it for $1k I need to lower the price to what more people can afford (which for video cards has always been around the $250-$500 area). That is not going to change regardless of whether or not there is a boutique card at the far extreme of the spectrum.

But when this boutique card would have been the mainstream card if we were living 5 years ago and you decide to relegate the mainstream market to 25-50% performance increases per cycle, cycles that have been significantly increased in time, it becomes apparent that progress in the mainstream market has been stagnated.
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post #798 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

If I sell a product for $1k and every single one I build sells, guess what? It was worth $1k. Economics.

Try telling that to everyone going through a short sale right now. This exact notion is what cause the housing crisis.

Now obviously these are two very different matters but understand that it is slightly like playing with fire. A good scale on this is what used prices of the cards will fetch and how long after until they drop.

In no way am I saying that will happen to titan, but its moves like these that can leave a product out to dry.

Btw, titan should be $800, I would bit for that much tongue.gif
     
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post #799 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsm106 View Post

This sort reminds me of the whole tethering fee that they taced onto Apple Users. Who knew they would so readily pay for what was once free and not its starting to become standard. It could be a dangerous slope...?

If it was for their mainstream product I would agree. It could be dangerous. But that's just not the case.

700 series cards will remain at a similar price point at the current gen 600 cards, as was the price point for the 500 cards and so forth.

They are simply introducing a special card because they can and because people want it. It's an expensive product to make and they know they can't sell many of them at x, y, and z cost. So they guess how many they will sell and price it accordingly.

If they made GK110 their new mainstream flagship GTX card then they'd be shooting themself in the foot for the 700 series mainstream cards.
 
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post #800 of 1636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Usario View Post

No it wasn't. It means that you were able to convince people of questionable intelligence that it was worth $1k. Apple sells iPhones for $800.

I thought you were being really reasonable until this comment. Maybe i'm misunderstanding you, it's 1AM here and i'm tired. biggrin.gif

So if I make $3,000/week, and I want to buy a $1000 GPU that makes me stupid? Dollars amounts are 100% dependant on a person's income and a person's income is usually a reflection of their intelligence. Definitely not always, but you get what I mean. Celebrity blow tens of thousands on clothes every month just because they can.

$1000 may seem like a lot to you, but too some people it's nothing to lose sleep over. This card is really not designed for someone with the normal income, and even if you have a normal income you could totally save for the card if you wanted it. I personally don't feel $500,000 cars are worth it, but if I was making a million dollars a year, i'd probably change my opinion.
Edited by Murlocke - 2/19/13 at 11:25pm
The Leviathan
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i7 6700k @ 4.7GHz MSI Z170A Gaming M7 12GB NVIDIA Titan X (Pascal) 32GB G.Skill Ripjaws V (DDR4 3200) 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
2x 1TB Samsung 960 PRO 193TB unRAID Server 3x 140mm Noctua NF-A14 Noctua NH-D15 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 10 Pro x64 65" LG 65E6P (4K OLED) Ducky DK9008 Shine 3  Corsair AX860 
CaseMouseAudioAudio
Corsair Obsidian 750D Logitech G502 Proteus Sprectrum Denon X7200WA (Receiver) 2x Klipsch RF-7 (Front Speakers) 
AudioAudioAudioAudio
4x Klipsch RS-62 (Surround Speakers) Klipsch RC-64 (Center Speaker) 4x Klipsch CDT-5800-C II (Atmos Speakers) 2x SVS PB16-Ultra (Subwoofers) 
  hide details  
The Leviathan
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i7 6700k @ 4.7GHz MSI Z170A Gaming M7 12GB NVIDIA Titan X (Pascal) 32GB G.Skill Ripjaws V (DDR4 3200) 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
2x 1TB Samsung 960 PRO 193TB unRAID Server 3x 140mm Noctua NF-A14 Noctua NH-D15 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 10 Pro x64 65" LG 65E6P (4K OLED) Ducky DK9008 Shine 3  Corsair AX860 
CaseMouseAudioAudio
Corsair Obsidian 750D Logitech G502 Proteus Sprectrum Denon X7200WA (Receiver) 2x Klipsch RF-7 (Front Speakers) 
AudioAudioAudioAudio
4x Klipsch RS-62 (Surround Speakers) Klipsch RC-64 (Center Speaker) 4x Klipsch CDT-5800-C II (Atmos Speakers) 2x SVS PB16-Ultra (Subwoofers) 
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