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[Various] Nvidia GeForce GTX Titan Reviews - Page 205  

post #2041 of 3575
Do you realiz that driver versions will also benefit all Kepler cards? It is the same arquitecture after all. So saying wait for drivers is like huh really?

So if titan benefit with a driver 690/680 and all other lil cousins will too. The gap will be the same no matter what. Unless nvidia sabotage their own gpus that of course lol. It can happen.
Edited by zGunBLADEz - 2/23/13 at 11:25am
post #2042 of 3575
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forceman View Post

Can we agree that there are 1000 milliseconds in one second? How about that 40 * 25 = 1000?

How long does it take to show 40 frames if each frame is on screen for 25 milliseconds? That would be 40 * 25ms, right? And since 40 * 25 = 1000 that would mean it takes 1000ms to display our 40 frames. 1000ms is 1 second, so we showed 40 frames in one second, which is often shortened to 40 fps. It works the same way in reverse, you just divide instead.

FPS is Frames Per Second, which is how many frames can be displayed in one second. Take one second and divide by the number of frames, and you get the time it was displayed in milliseconds. As for your term of FPMS or frames per millisecond, you are implying that you would be displaying more than 1 frame each millisecond, which would be very impressive indeed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xoleras View Post

Let's ignore the fact that you, like him, did not fix the terms of the equation to be equal on both sides.

What you're stating is ridiculous because it would indicate that current graphics hardware is limited to 40 fps - because most single GPUs render at 25ms latency or more.

There it is. Forceman has laid it out to you in the simplest of terms. His terms are correct, his explanation perfect/logical/mathematically correct.

Nobody ever said that no GPU can render at <25ms and nobody ever said GPU's are limited to 40fps. I dunno WHERE that idea came from, but it wasn't from he or I, I know that wink.gif

I'm not sure what you even mean by 25ms 'latency'. We're talking frametimes here, time to render each frame. I dunno how one would even calculate 25ms 'latency', unless that's something like the standard deviation from the mean time-to-render for each frame. And again, for this number to have 'meaning', you'd also need to know what the mean IS, so that you could understand the 'scale' of the 25ms standard deviation.
Edited by brettjv - 2/23/13 at 11:29am
    
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post #2043 of 3575
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mhill2029 View Post


Now lets take ourselves back to Fermi, and the GTX480. The Fermi refresh (aka GTX500 series) involved increase clockspeeds and more cuda cores and not to mention vastly improved thermals and power efficiency. I have a feeling this is going to happen again....

Do you promise to come back at the end of June so I can ask you where the 7xx is? 7970ghz and 680 mostly trade blows now depending on the game, both are selling incredibly well. Both will likely sell even better now that Titan is released and people realize the best game in town for 500$ is a 680/7970ghz. I'm even giving you until the end of June when I believe you started with two months. Two months is way too short a window. The only answer from AMD this year is a reference 7990 which will likely be good enough for them to say they have the world's fastest graphics card. I don't believe there will be a new flagship (780/8970) from either company this year.

It will be interesting to see who's right in the end.

I have one titan ordered from the egg and am on the lookout for a second. The 3x titan 2560x1600 numbers are pushing me towards a third but I'm trying to be strong. biggrin.gif
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post #2044 of 3575
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mhill2029 View Post

700 series is like 2 months away. Hence why i'm surprised with all this Titan eagerness.....

Usually i'd be all over the Titan like a rash and going 4-Way with those, but with a Kepler refresh so soon i think it's wiser to wait a bit.

It because you will never be able to surpass a Titan config on a 700 config, assuming unlimited budget. The 700 series will likely only be 15%-20% faster than the 680s which is not very impressive because that's not much faster than a 7970 GHz. The 700 series, on the other hand, will give much better price/performance ratio. 4 780s will destroy 2 Titans for the same price most likely, however not everyone wants to have 4 780s in their system.

As I stated earlier in the thread, and others also agreed. If the 700 series is faster than Titan we are giving our computers away for free. lol. Totally different market targets, for totally different budgets. Titan is going to be the best single GPU on the market for quite some time, and just like the 8800 Ultra, you are going to have to get a crappy price/performance ratio to get the best single GPU.

(By the way, I remember you buying a few 8800 Ultras which were far worse value than Titans. $350 more than a 8800GGTX for ~10% performance. Am I thinking of someone else?)
Edited by Murlocke - 2/23/13 at 11:42am
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post #2045 of 3575
Can we get back to arguing about value?

At least then we can all be right
Edited by jomama22 - 2/23/13 at 11:36am
     
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post #2046 of 3575
Quote:
Originally Posted by brettjv View Post


I'm not sure what you even mean by 25ms 'latency'. We're talking frametimes here, time to render each frame. I dunno how one would even calculate 25ms 'latency', unless that's something like the standard deviation from the mean time-to-render for each frame. And again, for this number to have 'meaning', you'd also need to know what the mean IS, so that you could understand the 'scale' of the 25ms standard deviation.

Let it go. His understanding of how microstutter occurs is wrong. He thinks because the 690 produces frames faster that microstutter doesn't happen. He doesn't grasp the concept that microstutter is ocurring when we see the large spikes when one frame is under 20ms and the next is 45ms and then back to 20ms after that. It's been explained to him over and over again.
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post #2047 of 3575
Quote:
Originally Posted by zGunBLADEz View Post

Do you realiz that driver versions will also benefit all Kepler cards? It is the same arquitecture after all. So saying wait for drivers is like huh really?

So if titan benefit with a driver 690/680 and all other lil cousins will too. The gap will be the same no matter what. Unless nvidia sabotage their own gpus that of course lol. It can happen.

I would not doubt Nvidia doing that very thing if it meant they sold more $1000 gpu's.

Does anyone even realize what kind of market trend is being set? The Titan is the true successor to the GTX580 and now requires a $1k entry fee instead of $500 like it has been in the past.

~40% increase over the GTX 680 does not warrant a ~100% markup. By my calculations, the Titan is about $300 overpriced. IMHO
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post #2048 of 3575
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenTiger View Post

Nice! Limit 1/customer.

http://www.amazon.com/GeForce-384-bit-Express-Support-GTXTITAN-6GD5/dp/B00BJ7AJ7C/ Amazon has a pre-order for the Asus up, with no obvious quantity limit posted.

Amazon's current limit is 2/person. wink.gif
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post #2049 of 3575
Quote:
Originally Posted by criminal View Post

By my calculations, the Titan is about $300 overpriced. IMHO

Weird nobody has said Titan was overpriced in 205 pages! Thanks for your completely original contribution to the thread.


(aka: Yay we're back on the value argument!)
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post #2050 of 3575
I've skipped the last few pages, there was too much bickering going on, will get caught up...

This post isn't directed at anyone in particular, just my thoughts on Titan in general from my perspective.

Titan > 690 > 7990 > 7970 > 680.

Single GPU > SLI, 690's lack of compute, based on mid-range GPU's, and lack of VRAM, makes Titan the winner from my POV.

Titan is the fastest single GPU, and a compute beast combined, and to the right person it's well worth the $1000 and beyond.







Not only that, but if you're a 690 owner, your upgrade path is a 2nd 690. 2 Titans > 2 690's, you can always add a 3rd, even 4th Titan...

With that out of the way, NVIDIA has effectively DOUBLED their prices in one Generation. Forget the x80 naming scheme, but let's focus on Gx104, and Gx110.

GF104 $250, GF110 $500.

GK104 $500, GK110 $1000.

The dual GPU even went up by 50% as well. 590 $749, 690 $1000.

NVIDIA never wanted the 590 at $749 but it HAD to be that way due to its performance and limitations.

From a gaming perspective compare Titan to the 580.



Look again, and compare it to the 590, which has 2 GF110 GPU's.

If you look at Titan beyond a gaming perspective, NVIDIA's marketing wants everyone to know that they're inside the world's fastest Super Computer, hence the name Titan, which provides unprecedented compute compared to GF110 for example. I can't remember a non-Quadro / Tesla card that came with 1/3 FP32, AND 896 DP cores. smile.gif From this perspective Titan is in a league of its own.

With that said, I'm wondering where NVIDIA will draw the line for GM110's Titan replacement. Will it remain at $1000, or will it be $1500?

GM110 will be bringing a larger performance gap over GK110.



GM110's Titan replacement WILL be at LEAST 50% faster, that's a given, but will it once again cost $1000?

I predict that we will see a GK110 variant with crippled compute, 3 GB RAM for $749 and a K20 variant with 2.5 GB RAM for $599.

Maxwell will release 2nd half 2014.

I wasn't considering a Titan, but the more I think about it, the more it makes sense RIGHT NOW.

It's a huge upgrade for me from my 470, and I will actually put that compute to good use. I do more work related stuff than I do gaming. The 680 never interested me because of its lack of compute, if my prediction is correct, there won't be another compute / gaming card like Titan for quite some time.

I'm not in a hurry, as I have other priorities right now, but if I do grab one it'd be in a couple months, I want to wait and see how things pan out. I don't foresee supply shortages over the long haul.

You gotta pay to play, and this is the price of admission right now.

Agree or disagree with what is said above, let's discuss, not flame.
Edited by 2010rig - 2/23/13 at 11:50am
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