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[Sweclockers] AMD to sell a cut down version of Sony's Playstation 4 APU - Page 13

post #121 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by adriangb View Post

Don't you guys think that AMD should work on perfecting hybrid crossfire? What I'm afraid of (if I were to buy an APU) is that I would later want to put in a dedicated GPU in, and the APU would then just idle, wasting space, heat and money (unless I got a 6650 or whatever the single model you can crossfire is). It would also be great for their dedicated GPU sales, since you'd have to be dumb to go nVidia if you could get an AMD APU and add to your APUs power instead of replacing it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultracarpet View Post

really? I didn't know there was an intel cpu that had a 7850 on the same die?? If you are talking about raw cpu performance, well yea. But so will most of AMD's desktop processors. Jaguar is a low-power cpu, what else would you expect?
I think AMD needs to work on perfecting normal crossfire first lol. But seriously, stuff like Virtu MVP should help cure your apu woes. Although, I dunno how well it works with amd apu's.
Virtu-MVP is a crap technology, and people prefer not to use it when buying gaming systems. Most people prefer to shut off the iGPU to save power and reduce heat. For AMD they haven't really much use for Virtu-MVP as they have dual graphics. They should indeed add a wider range of compatibility to the unit so you could dual graphics even with a 7970. Tho I think AMD will find using the iGPU for physics number crunching while the game has full use of your dedicated card. This way having hair physics and other stuff in the game doesn't tax your frame rate. That's just my idea, but I imagine AMD isn't "dumb" enough to not think of it too. I imagine they will extend the range of compatibility with Kaveri, as it will be using the same architecture that every single 7000 series card uses. So there isn't any reason to why you couldn't use a card as low as a 7750 all the way up to a 7970 for dual graphics. If AMD fails to realize this, it could eventually hurt their APU sales at an enthusiast level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socks keep you warm View Post

LOL, the console hardware is still worse then what Intel have to offer.
Most Intel CPU's will still demolish this.
Open up the OpenCL SDK and I beg to differ, this unit will be able to crush any CPU that Intel has ever made ten fold.
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post #122 of 139
But it's a lot easier to make everything run on a single thread than to bother with a more complex GPU computing software.

Performance issue? Just clock it higher and turn up the fan. rolleyes.gif


On serious note, I wonder how long would it take for HSA to be used enough in the software industry to make Intel think hard about also supporting it, or creating a counter to it (Such as Larrabee 2.0?).
post #123 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

But it's a lot easier to make everything run on a single thread than to bother with a more complex GPU computing software.

Performance issue? Just clock it higher and turn up the fan. rolleyes.gif


On serious note, I wonder how long would it take for HSA to be used enough in the software industry to make Intel think hard about also supporting it, or creating a counter to it (Such as Larrabee 2.0?).

They have, it's called HD graphics.
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post #124 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liranan View Post

They have, it's called HD graphics.

The issue is that the GPU computing isn't that great, which is unsurprisingly since Intel was aiming for a GPU good enough for movies.

What they did instead was market a 1000-core 86x auxiliary computing card a while ago.
post #125 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlankName View Post


Virtu-MVP is a crap technology, and people prefer not to use it when buying gaming systems. Most people prefer to shut off the iGPU to save power and reduce heat. For AMD they haven't really much use for Virtu-MVP as they have dual graphics. They should indeed add a wider range of compatibility to the unit so you could dual graphics even with a 7970. Tho I think AMD will find using the iGPU for physics number crunching while the game has full use of your dedicated card. This way having hair physics and other stuff in the game doesn't tax your frame rate. That's just my idea, but I imagine AMD isn't "dumb" enough to not think of it too. I imagine they will extend the range of compatibility with Kaveri, as it will be using the same architecture that every single 7000 series card uses. So there isn't any reason to why you couldn't use a card as low as a 7750 all the way up to a 7970 for dual graphics. If AMD fails to realize this, it could eventually hurt their APU sales at an enthusiast level.
.

I don't think it's that bad, tons of people use it with intel's hd4000 and it seems to work ok. If nothing else, virtu has at least opened AMD's eyes to the potential of their igpu's. Conventional Dual Graphics wouldn't allow a card that is way more powerful to crossfire with the igpu. Utilizing the igpu when the dedicated video card is not in crossfire, should probably AMD's next step. As of right now if you are buying a graphics card that isn't a 6670 or 6570, there is no reason to buy an amd apu.

I wouldn't expect though, that they would release this technology anytime soon. Until all of their desktop processors are APUs. If they released kaveri (for example) with this technology, and it performed way better in games than conventional cpu+gpu. Then they would only be pissing on their fx lineup of cpus.
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post #126 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socks keep you warm View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultracarpet View Post

really? I didn't know there was an intel cpu that had a 7850 on the same die?? If you are talking about raw cpu performance, well yea. But so will most of AMD's desktop processors. Jaguar is a low-power cpu, what else would you expect?
That's true but what i kind of didn't say which is my fault is that this kind of APU will not reach the market any time soon. Why would AMD need to sell 7850's and below if they can sell an APU. Loss of profit, unless it will be OEM only.

Plus, you know, the CPU side sucks. It's like buying a low-clocked high-core count Xeon when a good number of the things you will do will be single thread.

There is a place for it. But things like laptops would be better off with 4 faster cores then 8 slow ones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liranan View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

Because Intel, despite it's reputation as a competent CPU maker, failed to convince Sony or Microsoft to use their CPU instead of AMD's APU. Most likely because it demanded too much, just like what the ultrabook manufacturers were complaining about Intel's high CPU prices.

Also, the APU is a true eight core. Given proper heavy threading and optimization, that can be a potent CPU for a while until newer CPUs start to beat it through sheer raw performance.

EDIT: Have you seen the recent Crysis 3's CPU benchmarks? The FXes actually came kinda close to Intel's offerings, unlike almost all of the other games that didn't support 4+ threads.

Price isn't the only reason. Intel's APU's and drivers are worse than terrible. Neither MS nor Sony want to commit suicide, thus they use AMD's offerings not Intel's. And when drivers are properly optimised Intel's CPU's are demolished by AMD's. It takes Intel a much more expensive product to beat AMD.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socks keep you warm View Post

LOL, the console hardware is still worse then what Intel have to offer.
Most Intel CPU's will still demolish this.

Really? Why don't you prove that, rather than make random claims.

Most AMD CPUs would destroy it too. It's an ultra-low power part, successor to Brazos, it'll get kicked around the block.

However... It's an APU. Offload all that work onto the GPU half and it's a whole different story.
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post #127 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Plus, you know, the CPU side sucks. It's like buying a low-clocked high-core count Xeon when a good number of the things you will do will be single thread.

There is a place for it. But things like laptops would be better off with 4 faster cores then 8 slow ones.

It's likely that AMD would sell hexa, quad, and/or dual core versions of the PS4's APU. After all, not all of them will meet Sony's requirement.
post #128 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Plus, you know, the CPU side sucks. It's like buying a low-clocked high-core count Xeon when a good number of the things you will do will be single thread.

There is a place for it. But things like laptops would be better off with 4 faster cores then 8 slow ones.

It's likely that AMD would sell hexa, quad, and/or dual core versions of the PS4's APU. After all, not all of them will meet Sony's requirement.

While true, they'll also have to clock higher then the rumored 1.8Ghz to be useful. How high can a Low-Power part go?
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post #129 of 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by A Bad Day View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Plus, you know, the CPU side sucks. It's like buying a low-clocked high-core count Xeon when a good number of the things you will do will be single thread.

There is a place for it. But things like laptops would be better off with 4 faster cores then 8 slow ones.

It's likely that AMD would sell hexa, quad, and/or dual core versions of the PS4's APU. After all, not all of them will meet Sony's requirement.

While true, they'll also have to clock higher then the rumored 1.8Ghz to be useful. How high can a Low-Power part go?

Well, i'd dare say the extra ventilation room a PC allows, along with the extra room for cooling and "lack" of power limitations, you could clock it higher than AMD is limited to on a console's constrained space and power requirement. Plus i highly doubt all eight cores will be available (since all octo-cores would go into the PS4)

I could easily see a hexacore clocked at 2.5-2.8 GHz on a desktop, and a quadcore at 3 GHz+, along with the GPU, within a 130-150w envelope if the GPU side is untouched.
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post #130 of 139
It would be a strange sight to see a modified architecture meant for low power devices end up having a higher performance and TDP than a Kaveri A10 (most likely A10-7800K).
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