Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Video Game News › [Geek] Following 800 poor reviews, Amazon stops selling download copies of SimCity
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[Geek] Following 800 poor reviews, Amazon stops selling download copies of SimCity - Page 21

post #201 of 216
I'm clearly pissed off because I don't want 60 bucks games in the future to all become rent a game. If you pay 60 dollars for a game, you should be able to own the game, not just rent it in my personal opinion.
post #202 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by -Apocalypse- View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaldari View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by -Apocalypse- View Post

The reason they put it online is they wanted the simulation to focus on quality over quantity. The decision was made years ago with the assumption that the servers would hold. When you get a online game with a high preorder:day 1 sales ratio, bad things happen to the servers. Preorders are used to predict sales, and when that prediction is significantly off, you're left unprepared.

Or they could be grossly exaggerating the workload of these calculations in a scheme to hide the true intention of this being primarily a form of DRM.

EA already knew that draconian DRM has failed badly in the past. You think their marketing department isn't going to sugar-coat things as much as possible in hopes of circumventing consumer speculation?

<- Has actually played the game
<- Has actually witnessed how many things get broken when server connection is lost for longer than a few seconds

Yes, a good amount of the game is beyond the workload of the average gaming computer because of scale (each individual sim has their own decision tree), the individual calculations might not be intense, it's the number of them.

www.overclock.net/t/1370401/rps-maxis-insider-tells-rps-simcity-servers-not-necessary

Care to continue?
Bueller
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 3770K 4.7Ghz @ 1.36v Asus Sabertooth Z77 Gigabyte Windforce 780 Ti 3GB 16GB Corsair Vengeance 1866 9-10-9-27 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
256GB Samsung 840 Pro + RAID1 2TB 7200 Hitachis LG 6X Blu-ray Burner Corsair H100i Windows 7 x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Asus VG236HE XArmor U9BL-S Enermax Galaxy Evo 1250W Corsair 600T 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Logitech G500 SteelSeries 5L O2DAC -> Corsair SP2500 (or O2 amp and Beyerdyn... 
  hide details  
Reply
Bueller
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 3770K 4.7Ghz @ 1.36v Asus Sabertooth Z77 Gigabyte Windforce 780 Ti 3GB 16GB Corsair Vengeance 1866 9-10-9-27 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
256GB Samsung 840 Pro + RAID1 2TB 7200 Hitachis LG 6X Blu-ray Burner Corsair H100i Windows 7 x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Asus VG236HE XArmor U9BL-S Enermax Galaxy Evo 1250W Corsair 600T 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Logitech G500 SteelSeries 5L O2DAC -> Corsair SP2500 (or O2 amp and Beyerdyn... 
  hide details  
Reply
post #203 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by -Apocalypse- View Post

Except the game is actually quite good? I'll remind you that the game is online because of cloud computing, effective DRM is just a byproduct.

They claim our processors aren't powerful enough to do the calculations - yet, they didn't even add multi-core support. If the "not powerful enough"-part was true, they'd be spending A LOT of money on hardware. There's just no way this is true.
Citra ♥
(15 items)
 
Big Mac
(10 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[Intel] Core i7 2600K [Asus] P8Z68-V Pro [Gainward] Geforce 9800 GTX+ [Corsair] Vengeance 16GB @ 1600 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
[Kingston] HyperX 120GB SSD [Intel] 520 series 60GB [Corsair] H80 [Canonical] Ubuntu 12.10 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
[BenQ] XL2420T [Corsair] Vengeance K60 Performance [OCZ] ZX 850W [CM] Storm Enforcer 
MouseAudioOther
[Razer] Mamba 4G 2012 [Beats] urBeats [NZXT] 24/8/6 pin extensions 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[Intel] Core i5-3210M [Apple] Proprietary [Intel] HD 4000 [Hynix] H5TC2G83CFR DDR3L 8GB 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
[Samsung] 128GB SSD [Apple] OS X 10.8.2 ML 13" 2560x1600 Retina [Apple] Backlit Keyboard 
CaseMouse Pad
[Apple] Unibody [Apple] Trackpad 
  hide details  
Reply
Citra ♥
(15 items)
 
Big Mac
(10 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[Intel] Core i7 2600K [Asus] P8Z68-V Pro [Gainward] Geforce 9800 GTX+ [Corsair] Vengeance 16GB @ 1600 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
[Kingston] HyperX 120GB SSD [Intel] 520 series 60GB [Corsair] H80 [Canonical] Ubuntu 12.10 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
[BenQ] XL2420T [Corsair] Vengeance K60 Performance [OCZ] ZX 850W [CM] Storm Enforcer 
MouseAudioOther
[Razer] Mamba 4G 2012 [Beats] urBeats [NZXT] 24/8/6 pin extensions 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[Intel] Core i5-3210M [Apple] Proprietary [Intel] HD 4000 [Hynix] H5TC2G83CFR DDR3L 8GB 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
[Samsung] 128GB SSD [Apple] OS X 10.8.2 ML 13" 2560x1600 Retina [Apple] Backlit Keyboard 
CaseMouse Pad
[Apple] Unibody [Apple] Trackpad 
  hide details  
Reply
post #204 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by bruflot View Post

They claim our processors aren't powerful enough to do the calculations - yet, they didn't even add multi-core support. If the "not powerful enough"-part was true, they'd be spending A LOT of money on hardware. There's just no way this is true.

They are renting servers from Amazon...AWS servers are not top of the line stuff. They are not bad from my experience with them, but not even the most expensive tier service runs on amazing hardware.

There are likely several virtual machines running off each physical server rack. This is just a guess, but let's say it is possible there would be a cluster of 20 virtual machines that might be working on your game...you probably only have eight CPU cores of Xeon actually running it...not overclocked and running on ECC memory mind you. Which would still be more hardware than the average person. However, then you throw in that the same cluster is also running the games of several thousand other people...yeah...there cannot be much of a load to run this game, but even if there was you'd get far more horsepower to run the game if it was played locally.

Servers are meant to "Serve" and not actually offload software from the work stations. Some times it is advantageous to run an application on a server, but when you do the performance tanks fast as the amount of users ramps up because the server will only have so much CPU.

Plus its been documented pretty well what happens when the Internet is cut during a game...I would appreciate if every one that has the game would give it a try and report back. Start up a game and cut the Internet while playing. It sounds like the Sims keep working, but other aspects of the game die. However the work load of the the Sims' decisions was the reason why it had to be run on a server...or at least that was the reason given.
Edited by Vagrant Storm - 3/13/13 at 6:07am
My System
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
2600K @ 4.7GHz Asus P8P67 B3 GTX 580 EVGA Hydro Copper 2 GTX 580 EVGA  
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveOS
4x4GB G.Skill Ripjaws bunch of 'em Blu-Ray For movies Windows 8.1 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
24.4" Hans G HH251 X2 Yamakasi DS270  Blah 1000watt Super Flower 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Built into Desk Microsoft SideWinder X8 Comfy one... Creative Extreme Gamer 
  hide details  
Reply
My System
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
2600K @ 4.7GHz Asus P8P67 B3 GTX 580 EVGA Hydro Copper 2 GTX 580 EVGA  
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveOS
4x4GB G.Skill Ripjaws bunch of 'em Blu-Ray For movies Windows 8.1 
MonitorMonitorKeyboardPower
24.4" Hans G HH251 X2 Yamakasi DS270  Blah 1000watt Super Flower 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Built into Desk Microsoft SideWinder X8 Comfy one... Creative Extreme Gamer 
  hide details  
Reply
post #205 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vagrant Storm View Post

They are renting servers from Amazon...AWS servers are not top of the line stuff. They are not bad from my experience with them, but not even the most expensive tier service runs on amazing hardware.

There are likely several virtual machines running off each physical server rack. This is just a guess, but let's say it is possible there would be a cluster of 20 virtual machines that might be working on your game...you probably only have eight CPU cores of Xeon actually running it...not overclocked and running on ECC memory mind you. Which would still be more hardware than the average person. However, then you throw in that the same cluster is also running the games of several thousand other people...yeah...there cannot be much of a load to run this game, but even if there was you'd get far more horsepower to run the game if it was played locally.

Servers are meant to "Serve" and not actually offload software from the work stations. Some times it is advantageous to run an application on a server, but when you do the performance tanks fast as the amount of users ramps up because the server will only have so much CPU.

Plus its been documented pretty well what happens when the Internet is cut during a game...I would appreciate if every one that has the game would give it a try and report back. Start up a game and cut the Internet while playing. It sounds like the Sims keep working, but other aspects of the game die. However the work load of the the Sims' decisions was the reason why it had to be run on a server...or at least that was the reason given.

The fact that anyone even entertained the possibility that Maxis is renting sufficient server power to out-perform the average gamers PC is ridiculous.

The worst part is that IIRC people used this as an excuse to defend them not bothering to multi-thread the game.
Serigatum
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k @ 4.7Ghz Asus P87 Deluxe EVGA GTX 780 Corsair Vengeance 2400Mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Raid0: 2x512GB Samsung 840 Pro 2GB WD Black NZXT Kraken x60 Windows 8 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Dell U2412M Razer Blackwidow Ultimate Corsair AX850 NZXT Phantom 820 
Mouse
Razer Ouroboros 
  hide details  
Reply
Serigatum
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k @ 4.7Ghz Asus P87 Deluxe EVGA GTX 780 Corsair Vengeance 2400Mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Raid0: 2x512GB Samsung 840 Pro 2GB WD Black NZXT Kraken x60 Windows 8 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Dell U2412M Razer Blackwidow Ultimate Corsair AX850 NZXT Phantom 820 
Mouse
Razer Ouroboros 
  hide details  
Reply
post #206 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by NihilOC View Post

The fact that anyone even entertained the possibility that Maxis is renting sufficient server power to out-perform the average gamers PC is ridiculous.

The worst part is that IIRC people used this as an excuse to defend them not bothering to multi-thread the game.

Indeed.

I remember someone tried to argue that the game being single threaded was actually a good thing, because it meant less work for the developers and simpler coding. Imagine if they released Crysis or Battlefield 3 single threaded only. People would have a freaking field day. SimCity is totally exempt from all this, though; EA says so. rolleyes.gif
 
NZXT Source 210
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Ryzen R7 1700 Gigabyte GA-AX370-Gaming K7 XFX RX480 GTR Corsair Vengeance LPX 3200MHz 16GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung 850 EVO 500GB Samsung 850 EVO 500GB Western Digital 1TB WD10EXEXSP Western Digital 1TB WD10EXEXSP 
CoolingOSPowerCase
NZXT Kraken X62 Windows 10 Pro EVGA Supernova 750 G3 NZXT S340 Glossy Black 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX6300 ASUS M5A99FX PRO R2.0 XFX Radeon RX 480 Corsair Vengence LP 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Western Digital WD5003AZEX Samsung 840 Evo Samsung 850 Pro LG GH24NS95 
CoolingOSMonitorPower
Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus Windows 10 40" 1080p Vizio LED LCD HDTV Corsair CX600M 
Case
NZXT Source 210 Elite - Black 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Pentium 4 w/ HT 3.2GHz Dell N6381 Intel Extreme Graphics 2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... 512MB DDR 400 
Hard DriveCoolingOSPower
Western Digital 160GB IDE Covered in a thick layer of dust Windows XP Home Edition 32bit Dell M0148 250w 
Case
Dell Dimension 3000 
  hide details  
Reply
 
NZXT Source 210
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Ryzen R7 1700 Gigabyte GA-AX370-Gaming K7 XFX RX480 GTR Corsair Vengeance LPX 3200MHz 16GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung 850 EVO 500GB Samsung 850 EVO 500GB Western Digital 1TB WD10EXEXSP Western Digital 1TB WD10EXEXSP 
CoolingOSPowerCase
NZXT Kraken X62 Windows 10 Pro EVGA Supernova 750 G3 NZXT S340 Glossy Black 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX6300 ASUS M5A99FX PRO R2.0 XFX Radeon RX 480 Corsair Vengence LP 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Western Digital WD5003AZEX Samsung 840 Evo Samsung 850 Pro LG GH24NS95 
CoolingOSMonitorPower
Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus Windows 10 40" 1080p Vizio LED LCD HDTV Corsair CX600M 
Case
NZXT Source 210 Elite - Black 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Pentium 4 w/ HT 3.2GHz Dell N6381 Intel Extreme Graphics 2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... 512MB DDR 400 
Hard DriveCoolingOSPower
Western Digital 160GB IDE Covered in a thick layer of dust Windows XP Home Edition 32bit Dell M0148 250w 
Case
Dell Dimension 3000 
  hide details  
Reply
post #207 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheezman View Post

Indeed.

I remember someone tried to argue that the game being single threaded was actually a good thing, because it meant less work for the developers and simpler coding. Imagine if they released Crysis or Battlefield 3 single threaded only. People would have a freaking field day. SimCity is totally exempt from all this, though; EA says so. rolleyes.gif

Crysis or Battlefield 3 are aimed at gamers, Where simcity will be played on lesser pc's / laptops without the latest cpu and gfx card, so not making it need multicore cpu gives the game a lower end player probably more lightly to play it over the hardcore gamer.
swimming haf-x
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5-2500k 4.7 1.37 v asus p8p67 deluxe vtx3d black HD 7870 kiningston hyper x 1600 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingOS
hitachi xspc raystorm phobya 360 Ek-vga Bridge edition  windows 7 ultimate 
MonitorPowerCaseMouse
aoc 23.5" mushkin joules 800w coolermaster HaF-X gigabyte 
  hide details  
Reply
swimming haf-x
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5-2500k 4.7 1.37 v asus p8p67 deluxe vtx3d black HD 7870 kiningston hyper x 1600 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingOS
hitachi xspc raystorm phobya 360 Ek-vga Bridge edition  windows 7 ultimate 
MonitorPowerCaseMouse
aoc 23.5" mushkin joules 800w coolermaster HaF-X gigabyte 
  hide details  
Reply
post #208 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenback View Post

Crysis or Battlefield 3 are aimed at gamers, Where simcity will be played on lesser pc's / laptops without the latest cpu and gfx card, so not making it need multicore cpu gives the game a lower end player probably more lightly to play it over the hardcore gamer.

Mainstream PC's are multi-core now.

Oh, and the games minimum requirements still call for at least a duel core processor:
Quote:
Originally Posted by EA View Post

CPU:
Intel players will need, minimally, a 2.0 GHz Core2Duo, while our AMD players will need at least an Athlon 64 X2 Dual-Core 4000+.

See the disconnect?
 
NZXT Source 210
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Ryzen R7 1700 Gigabyte GA-AX370-Gaming K7 XFX RX480 GTR Corsair Vengeance LPX 3200MHz 16GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung 850 EVO 500GB Samsung 850 EVO 500GB Western Digital 1TB WD10EXEXSP Western Digital 1TB WD10EXEXSP 
CoolingOSPowerCase
NZXT Kraken X62 Windows 10 Pro EVGA Supernova 750 G3 NZXT S340 Glossy Black 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX6300 ASUS M5A99FX PRO R2.0 XFX Radeon RX 480 Corsair Vengence LP 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Western Digital WD5003AZEX Samsung 840 Evo Samsung 850 Pro LG GH24NS95 
CoolingOSMonitorPower
Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus Windows 10 40" 1080p Vizio LED LCD HDTV Corsair CX600M 
Case
NZXT Source 210 Elite - Black 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Pentium 4 w/ HT 3.2GHz Dell N6381 Intel Extreme Graphics 2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... 512MB DDR 400 
Hard DriveCoolingOSPower
Western Digital 160GB IDE Covered in a thick layer of dust Windows XP Home Edition 32bit Dell M0148 250w 
Case
Dell Dimension 3000 
  hide details  
Reply
 
NZXT Source 210
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Ryzen R7 1700 Gigabyte GA-AX370-Gaming K7 XFX RX480 GTR Corsair Vengeance LPX 3200MHz 16GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung 850 EVO 500GB Samsung 850 EVO 500GB Western Digital 1TB WD10EXEXSP Western Digital 1TB WD10EXEXSP 
CoolingOSPowerCase
NZXT Kraken X62 Windows 10 Pro EVGA Supernova 750 G3 NZXT S340 Glossy Black 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD FX6300 ASUS M5A99FX PRO R2.0 XFX Radeon RX 480 Corsair Vengence LP 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Western Digital WD5003AZEX Samsung 840 Evo Samsung 850 Pro LG GH24NS95 
CoolingOSMonitorPower
Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus Windows 10 40" 1080p Vizio LED LCD HDTV Corsair CX600M 
Case
NZXT Source 210 Elite - Black 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Pentium 4 w/ HT 3.2GHz Dell N6381 Intel Extreme Graphics 2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... 512MB DDR 400 
Hard DriveCoolingOSPower
Western Digital 160GB IDE Covered in a thick layer of dust Windows XP Home Edition 32bit Dell M0148 250w 
Case
Dell Dimension 3000 
  hide details  
Reply
post #209 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheezman View Post

Mainstream PC's are multi-core now.

Oh, and the games minimum requirements still call for at least a duel core processor:
See the disconnect?

CPU:
Intel players will need, minimally, a 2.0 GHz Core2Duo, while our AMD players will need at least an Athlon 64 X2 Dual-Core 4000+.

Which are old cpu's on older pc's/laptops which is my point,
swimming haf-x
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5-2500k 4.7 1.37 v asus p8p67 deluxe vtx3d black HD 7870 kiningston hyper x 1600 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingOS
hitachi xspc raystorm phobya 360 Ek-vga Bridge edition  windows 7 ultimate 
MonitorPowerCaseMouse
aoc 23.5" mushkin joules 800w coolermaster HaF-X gigabyte 
  hide details  
Reply
swimming haf-x
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5-2500k 4.7 1.37 v asus p8p67 deluxe vtx3d black HD 7870 kiningston hyper x 1600 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingOS
hitachi xspc raystorm phobya 360 Ek-vga Bridge edition  windows 7 ultimate 
MonitorPowerCaseMouse
aoc 23.5" mushkin joules 800w coolermaster HaF-X gigabyte 
  hide details  
Reply
post #210 of 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenback View Post

CPU:
Intel players will need, minimally, a 2.0 GHz Core2Duo, while our AMD players will need at least an Athlon 64 X2 Dual-Core 4000+.

Which are old cpu's on older pc's/laptops which is my point,

I think I know about 2 people who still run dual cores in their main rigs...and I'm not even including people who know what Linux is either. The kind of person who is still running a Pentium 4 is not going to buy this game, no matter how much marketing EA does. (The only kind of game they'd play is Farmville)
My system
(22 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 3770k @ 4.6Ghz ASRock Z77 Pro3 Powercolor Radeon HD7950 3GB @ 1150/1370 4x4GB G.Skill Ares 2200Mhz CL11 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Samsung 840 250GB Western Digital Black 1TB WD1002FAEX Samsung Spinpoint EcoGreen 2TB Pioneer DVR-220LBKS 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Noctua NH-D14 Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850rpm Corsair AF140 Quiet Edition Arch Linux x86-64, amdgpu 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 10 Bloatfree Edition BenQ G2220HD BenQ G2020HD Ducky Shine III Year of the Snake, Cherry Blue 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Silverstone Strider Plus 600w Lian Li Lancool PC-K60 SteelSeries Sensei Professional Artisan Hien Mid Japan Black Large 
AudioOther
ASUS Xonar DX NZXT Sentry Mesh 30w Fan Controller 
  hide details  
Reply
My system
(22 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 3770k @ 4.6Ghz ASRock Z77 Pro3 Powercolor Radeon HD7950 3GB @ 1150/1370 4x4GB G.Skill Ares 2200Mhz CL11 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Samsung 840 250GB Western Digital Black 1TB WD1002FAEX Samsung Spinpoint EcoGreen 2TB Pioneer DVR-220LBKS 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Noctua NH-D14 Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850rpm Corsair AF140 Quiet Edition Arch Linux x86-64, amdgpu 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 10 Bloatfree Edition BenQ G2220HD BenQ G2020HD Ducky Shine III Year of the Snake, Cherry Blue 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Silverstone Strider Plus 600w Lian Li Lancool PC-K60 SteelSeries Sensei Professional Artisan Hien Mid Japan Black Large 
AudioOther
ASUS Xonar DX NZXT Sentry Mesh 30w Fan Controller 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Video Game News
Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Video Game News › [Geek] Following 800 poor reviews, Amazon stops selling download copies of SimCity